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[ggpoker] allin insurance replaced by EV cashout

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04-29-2022 , 12:45 PM

da_ve

centurion

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 125

according to the release notes, you can now cashout your EV in a pot where you're allin being at least 60% favourite, without paying a fee.

Quote:

How It Works
Players with 60% or higher pot equity after all live player’s have revealed their hole cards will be offered an EV Cashout.

If the player accepts the EV Cashout offer, the Cashout will be paid to the player regardless of the result of the hand, and the player will forfeit the pot.

If the player declines the EV Cashout offer, they will continue to player for the pot.

EV Cashout is offered only after the flop cards have been dealt.

Calculating the EV Cashout
EV Cashout is calculated as follows.

Cashout = (Pot size - rake - jackpot fee) x Equity

No extra fee is charged on EV Cashout.

if thats really the case, it's a huge difference in terms of variance. what's your take on this?

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04-29-2022 , 01:03 PM

Esa_Perse

banned

Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 1,850

If that's really without any fees it makes taking shots and playing deeper stacks way less stressful . Stars cashout is like 3bb extra in rake right?

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04-29-2022 , 02:59 PM

CaptnGenyo

stranger

Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 11

You do pay a price as you wont get chips for the daily $100k GG Flipout

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04-29-2022 , 04:42 PM

da_ve

centurion

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 125

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptnGenyo

You do pay a price as you wont get chips for the daily $100k GG Flipout

this is not true, i just got a ggcheers bonus after winning a big pot where i used EV cashout

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04-30-2022 , 09:11 AM

TooCuriousso1

Golden 2017

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 6,711

Hmm what are the rake implications?

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04-30-2022 , 12:13 PM

boris_angelov

stranger

Join Date: Apr 2016 Posts: 4

Quoting from GG's article on it:
"Calculating the EV Cashout
EV Cashout is calculated as follows.

Cashout = (Pot size - rake - jackpot fee) x Equity

No extra fee is charged on EV Cashout."

I used it twice and it seemed ok, although I think I didn't get the GG cheers tournament entry. If it really is legit it would be a massive game changer for your variance and I don't see a reason why you wouldn't use it everytime.

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04-30-2022 , 05:59 PM

da_ve

centurion

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 125

Quote:

Originally Posted by boris_angelov

Quoting from GG's article on it:

I used it twice and it seemed ok, although I think I didn't get the GG cheers tournament entry

you don't always get the ggcheers normally, it's a bit random. I don't think it's affected since i have been getting them when using ev cashout

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04-30-2022 , 06:00 PM

da_ve

centurion

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 125

I agree that if there's really no hidden disadvantages, it's a gamechanger for variance

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05-01-2022 , 05:20 AM

gavilanu77

newbie

Join Date: May 2022 Posts: 19

hi!
and the ggcare works too when you cash out and lose the hand?

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05-01-2022 , 05:43 AM

#10

da_ve

centurion

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 125

Quote:

Originally Posted by gavilanu77

hi!
and the ggcare works too when you cash out and lose the hand?

I have yet to find out, will let you know when i do

Quote

05-01-2022 , 07:15 AM

#11

da_ve

centurion

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 125

Quote:

Originally Posted by TooCuriousso1

Hmm what are the rake implications?

good question.

let's assume two allin hands with 50% equity in a headsup 100bb allin

with EV cashout ( (Pot size - rake - jackpot fee) x Equity)

hand 1: Cashout = (200 - 3) * 0.5 = 98.5 cashout = -1.5 bb
hand 2: Cashout = (200 - 3) * 0.5 = 98.5 cashout = -1.5bb
total win: -3bb
total rake contributed: 6bb * 0.5 = 3bb

without Ev cashout
hand 1: (200 - 3) * 1 = +97
hand 2: (200 -3) * 0 = -100
total win: -3bb
total rake contributed: 6bb * 0.5 = 3bb

Looks like there is no difference!

This is assuming that, since the rake is taken out of the pot before the cashout, the rake contribution also is based on that same amount, which sounds likely.

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05-01-2022 , 07:30 AM

#12

polezipoker

newbie

Join Date: Feb 2016 Posts: 45

I have a question about this, if I decided to cashout and lose, how much money villain will win? If he receive about the same thing, it's a bit strange, because in this case GG is paying him outside of pot, anyone know the answer?

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05-01-2022 , 07:34 AM

#13

gavilanu77

newbie

Join Date: May 2022 Posts: 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by da_ve

I have yet to find out, will let you know when i do

thank you!

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05-01-2022 , 07:36 AM

#14

gavilanu77

newbie

Join Date: May 2022 Posts: 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by polezipoker

you are paying it when decide to cash out and you are winning the hand

Quote

05-01-2022 , 12:12 PM

#15

da_ve

centurion

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 125

Quote:

Originally Posted by gavilanu77

you are paying it when decide to cash out and you are winning the hand

yep, on the long run it will even out, but they take the variance instead for you.

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05-02-2022 , 02:26 PM

#16

jhalischuk

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 39

Quote:

Originally Posted by gavilanu77

hi!
and the ggcare works too when you cash out and lose the hand?

I got it in as a 90% favourite, cashed out, lost, and got the gg cares bonus

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05-02-2022 , 02:53 PM

#17

alwayscall_

centurion

Join Date: Dec 2021 Posts: 102

The flip-side is, if villain has 65% and takes cashout you ALWAYS run it Once with your 35%. So you just as often are forced to run-it-once when you are dog, as you get to cash-out when you are fav, which makes it really whatever in the longrun as variance for all-ins stays similar to always running it twice.

Last edited by alwayscall_; 05-02-2022 at 03:03 PM.

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05-02-2022 , 02:56 PM

#18

jhalischuk

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 39

Quote:

Originally Posted by alwayscall_

Yeah but you can also take it at any point in the hand if you're 60% or more. So even if you get it in behind and on the flop/turn you're over 60% to win you can take it.

Quote

05-03-2022 , 03:42 AM

#19

gavilanu77

newbie

Join Date: May 2022 Posts: 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhalischuk

I got it in as a 90% favourite, cashed out, lost, and got the gg cares bonus

thank you!! nice info

Quote

05-03-2022 , 04:23 AM

#20

Esa_Perse

banned

Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 1,850

Quote:

Originally Posted by alwayscall_

Lol.

Quote

05-04-2022 , 09:55 AM

#21

da_ve

centurion

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 125

Quote:

Originally Posted by alwayscall_

if you get it in with 35% just as often as having 65% you have bigger problems :P

Quote

05-04-2022 , 08:25 PM

#22

TooCuriousso1

Golden 2017

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 6,711

Am I remembering wrong or is the rake not deducted until after?

Seems like I remember EV cashout = 177bb with 90% on 200bb pot.

If so .9*197= 177.3 is the run it EV.

Maybe I have something wrong or am remembering wrong.

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05-05-2022 , 08:38 AM

#23

polezipoker

newbie

Join Date: Feb 2016 Posts: 45

I don't know If I seen wrong, but the cashout value is not showing in balance history

I win 2 hands 200bbs (NL10), in the next hand I cashout from table, $17,80 and $16,33, the rest of my money is not showing there, is this normal?
In PokerCraft is showing like I win 200bbs

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05-05-2022 , 01:21 PM

#24

duckyfAL

grinder

Join Date: Nov 2016 Posts: 592

edit: my bad

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05-06-2022 , 06:17 AM

#25

gavilanu77

newbie

Join Date: May 2022 Posts: 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by polezipoker

I don't know If I seen wrong, but the cashout value is not showing in balance history

I win 2 hands 200bbs (NL10), in the next hand I cashout from table, $17,80 and $16,33, the rest of my money is not showing there, is this normal?
In PokerCraft is showing like I win 200bbs

when you accept the EV cashout you are giving up the pot for just cashing out the money that belongs to you in EV terms, no matter who finally win the hand

if you go all-in for a 20$ pot with 75% equity and you take the cashout you will recieve 15$ (-rake), and giving up the 5$

and the pokercraft, Imo is a complete shitty tool, It doesn't show the rake which have no sense for me, and i don't know if it's doing well with the cashout ev stuff... probably not

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