It's also worth pointing out that the age distribution has a long tail, so 3 x 23yo final tablers are balanced by 1 x 63yo final tabler. That means those numbers understate the dominance of the younger guys.

I think it's a bit like golf. People can stay on tour well into their mid 40s, but generally don't maintain the same standard of play. Look at Nicklaus, for example: 15 majors before the age of 40, 1 after, and 2 wins AT 40.

Big tournaments need multi-day concentration. Younger people have an edge.

what is said was a generalization, not fact for all. If you are on 2p2, then i am assuming you have a clue, and would be the exception

I think one of the clear advantages that young online players have is that no one knows how they play and thus can't really put them on a range on hands in any given situation. When you're unsure of how someone plays you're prone to check,calling and sticking to fundamentals. However, once people get to know their game they will begin to adapt and punish mistakes they were getting away with previously. To me thats how Isildur1 won so much initially, before he went busto. The people I fear most at the table are not LAGS, because their aggression becomes very predictable after a while and maniacs can be punished by fundamentals, but the players who constantly change gears, while still playing optimally most of the time.

[ ] phil ivey has been raping all of us.

no one is saying that phil isnt an incredible player. he thinks on a higher level than almost everyone out there.

i thought the number is roughly 90%, which makes sense when its thought about. there are a larger population of losing players that feed the winning players. i would imagine without rake, you'd still see like 20% winning players.

its kinda like natures food chain.

i really don't know why im responding to you though, i doubt any of this made sense to you anyway

lol @ people over emphasizing reads like this guy:
Also, Phil Ivey isn't considered a "live player" in the context of this discussion. Ivey is a beast and he was 8 tabling online poker way back when it first came around, so that doesn't really constitute a "live player". Live player in the context we're talking about is the old school player who hasn't adapted his play style to that of a more aggressive approach and doesn't get involved in 3 betting/4betting, and the new school form of poker. Clearly Ivey doesn't fit that category. Ivey is in the category of someone who has kept up with the curve of the new school of poker. Sort of the same way Negreanu has admitted the old school live players are behind the curve and he's been working on his game with online kids to try to get caught up to speed. He's made a lot of progress and would smoke most players like Hellmuth HU at this point.

Go JETS!

Anyway this probably true, although imo it's just the fact that you get the old guy with money who doesn't really know how to play. How man 20 somethings come with a random amount of money and no skill?

MODS, ARE YOU THERE?? CAN'T YOU LOCK THIS THREAD

YOOOO, HOOOO, THIS IS ONLY THE 2957th THIS HAS GONE ROUND AND ROUND.

HOW IS THIS BETTERING THE FORUMS???????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????

Statistics ALWAYS uses median...
Except the Grade 10 grads doing WSOP "stats".

These numbers show young players do not "dominate"...
And women were only 3.5% of ME entries...
So these numbers probably statistically meaningless.


It's an illusion, but people don't get the REASON...
It's all about OPPORTUNITY COST.

To play poker at tourney level...
You must be a Top 1% talent...
And THEN devote 10,000 hrs or 3 full years of life...
To a SINGLE-MINDED pursuit of poker excellence.

If you are 17 with $5,000... it's +EV.

But if you are Top 1% talent...
By the time you are 40, 45, 50...
You are a millionaire via trading, internet, etc.

For a 40 something with multi-millions...
Devoting 10,000 hrs to low stakes poker...
Is off-the-charts MINUS EV...
One just have so many other options in life.

It's not youth until your > 60 yo...
It's OPPORTUNITY COST.

you realize using the mean would be ******ed?
and you in fact explain why young guys dominate. it is because they devoted more time to playing and learning the game.

also noon needs to be top 1% to play, 10k hours of experience is stupid. If that were the case, every NL25 multitabler would be a pro, and many higher stakes players would not be. The 10,000th hour of experience is not what separates competent players from pros.

Read too much Outliers, imo.

Also, WOW is that an annoying writing style.

they're better

/thread

He's just read that book that claims you need at least 10k hours to get to world class level in anything. By Malcolm Gladwell I think. It isn't very good...

Younger people learn way faster, are more motivated, more open-minded, think more clearly, and are not as lazy



This is the dumbest **** i have heard in a long time.

The big difference between Young players and older players . Is younger players lack something that us older players have. It's called respect and experience. I was 20 years old once. I know what it is like. But i had respect for my elders.
The arrogance of some young players is repulsive. And you know what they say arrogance and ignorance go hand in hand.




Alvin the Chipmunk
Three betting, playing against a person’s range, floating. Puggy Pearson, Johnny Moss, Jack Strauss and Bill Smith knew these things back in the 1980s. They just didn’t have names for them but they knew what they were. They called them names likee re-raising, putting the other guy on a hand, sandbagging, etc. “Floating” is no big frickin’ deal!!! Players have been doing them since the 1970s!

I have been thinking this same thing for a while, just didn't know where to say it. You probably said it better than i could anyways.

Pretty dumb thread imo. Its simply a numbers game at the ME. There are more younger players than old. Plus hasn't it been said that a few players believe it will be rare to see a "Pro" win the main event ever simply because of high variance in such a large field. Also fwiw if someone like Durr or Antonius would take on an old school player such as Doyle HU live, their "new school" would probably crush their old school.

us old guys, can use this stereotype as a level on the tables... BOOYA!

I see similar amounts of disrespect from "older" players, which is kinda funny because sometimes it is from players that think I'm some internet kid when I'm actually older than them. Yes lotta young players are disrespectful, but I hear just as many if not more old-school players grumbling about young players 3 and 4 betting, as if they're not supposed to. Couple other things: The next 10 actual slowrolls you see, I bet at least 8 of them come from players over 50, and next 10 times you hear someone say "2 pair" when there is a pair on the board (a well documented personal pet peeve of mine), more than half of them will be over 50 also.

kids deserve respect?

you know what we have here... it's a Television special with over 30's playing under 30's in a team format HU

I called it first and want my royalties!

Poker is played/thought of very different today then it was "back then" I believe. Many pros were just gamblers (guess some still are today) and it was a lot smaller of a poker.

Internet def gave poker a turn for the better any way you want to look at it. Yeah the old heads might not be fans, but the opportunities it has brought for the players, casinos, etc have been and will continue to be excellent for the game.

Players are now putting more effort into developing their game and making the best +EV moves in every situation they get involved in. I strongly feel a lot of the training sites, books, coaching, etc has also been a direct impact by the Internet players and the growth of the game on here. Also +1 for Poker forums, where players can talk strat and ask advice on optimal plays, what to do, etc in hands for review.

From medicinal point of view people are physically best in 25 and intellectualy in 35 and then is fall, first slowly and then more and more quickly.
I think if you are healthy no smoker no drunk you can be good to 50-55 but it is very individual depend.

These are legitimate psychological plays.

New schoolers can't handle psychology as evidenced by the responses two famous online players made when Brunson made those funny comments about Black Friday a few days after Black Friday. I can't even remember the comments but it totally ticked off two new schoolers as well as their supporters.

Reading comp fail.

Also a logic fail ITT as only three people have brought up that average age distorts the sample and MEDIAN is the proper measurement by which to determine the degree to which OP is wrong.

When you turn 35 call me and tell me if you still believe that bull****.

how is EDD not in this thread, considering most of the 'old school' players rely heavily on their live tells to 'beat anyone in the world HU -- or at least break even (as long as the cards break even).

You missed him.

simple stuff, there are alot more in, just do the math and why didnt they dominate the other events? I didnt see most of the posts but the average age is probaly 21 in this post