Nah, bro, it kind of does mean they make that typically. When you're spending $50K+ lying about such things can be a huge deal and a lot of time we verify income. Even if we don't verify, every single person is told we do so they don't lie.

Obviously 100K isn't avg, but saying there isn't a lot of people making it is pretty absurd. I wasn't bragging, but if I can get to $100K in 3 years as a young kid with mo degree what's stopping anyone else? Oh.... that hard work thing, kind of like poker.

I've always found that the people thinking $100K is some unicorn tend to be people with no desirable skills or people who spent $100K on school to get a $40K job because they picked a stupid career path (with respect to making money).

If you want to make $100K move to or near a big city and go get it. Obviously staying in small town USA isn't going to get you there often.

lots of reasons why itt and in others.

if I were you, i would be thinking hard about how to save myself a bunch of money before i go out looking for a second job. and then if that still wasnt enough then i would look at continuing education. i just dont think playing poker is a long term viable solution, nor is it the most +ev.

Have def thought about it. On 85k salary in LA cost of living here is pretty absurd and wife doesn't work right now but she's in process of trying to get real estate license. We live in an upper middle class city, schools are rated high, and I can save about 1700 a month, being very tight on expenses. I have been driving lyft lately and driving lyft regularly can help me boost savings to roughly 2500 a month. I plan on trying to get mba from top school in next couple years but need a decent nest egg first and wife needs to be in real estate before I go back to school again. Good thing is, I served so government will pay me while I go to school basic allowance for housing, if I got into ucla, they would pay me like 2500 a month. So I do plan on studying for gmat, but really want to be free and trade the markets independently at some point/play poker/blog and have my own website and not have to work for a corporation eventually

Says anyone who has read this or threads like this. Most say dont go pro. Even in the good old days if someone said they were giving up a, good, job or dropping out they would be told not to. Mostly.

And sorry you must be reading as bad as me, that was no revelation just a misreading of your post. Its also been said many times and is trivially obvious. Someone who has a job with benefits should consider them before taking one without benefits and calculate that in there. Wow!!

And some that seem to be on a crusaded regardless of situations and circumstances.

lol

Was talking about live as that's what the few posts I saw around the one I responded to seemed to be referring to. Making money in the entry level limit games (where I was at pre-boom) was harder than making money in the entry level nl games today. I can't compare mid-stakes because I didn't play them pre-boom and can't compare high stakes because I've never played them.

Online is a different beast, as far as I know was extremely small pre-boom (your time frame doesn't match up to either of the posts you quoted), and is something I can't and didn't comment at all on. If you were a live cash player starting out before NL took off I don't think you had it easier than if you are starting out in LLSNL today, all things considered.

We can agree to disagree. U still sound angry btw. Smile

Never really angry but generally when someone calls me dense i stop treating them nice. Odd i know.

siculamente is unemployed dude . hes been grinding this thread so hard the past few days ( he can say what ever he wants but theres no other explanation ) lol. i dont care that he dosent think its worth it to play poker for a living ( probably isnt for most people). i dont even care that he thinks 60k < 40k because he has a mild ******ation of some sort ( inb4 because of benefits). its impressive that in the amount of words hes typed you can tell how insufferable he is. but id be willing to bet that the same reason he sucks at poker is the same reason hes coming off as a stupid ******* ITT.

Its all good. Someone has to tell the kids they should not become painters. The ones who really want it will go for it either which way. And hey if they fail they can always become an avg joe at costcos making 40k which is 60k when you add in benefits.

this thread is so much lol. yall delusional just because you grew up in a "middleclass" household with swimming pool and housekeeper doesnt mean its normal to make 100k per year avg, I make dunno, 8k per year? save maybe 8$ per month. and then yall start talking about how everything is sooo expensive in LA or NYC? what is expensive ? food is cheaper or the same (at supermarkets) than my "3rd world lol poor eastern european country", clothes are way more cheaper than here, electronics is way more cheaper than here, even ***** drugs are way way cheaper than here. okay clubbing, booze and dining out is ofc more expensive there and ofcourse renting/buying apartment but thats about it. even your "poor ghetto people" live in ***** houses and get more welfare money that we make here avg per month DD and here avg working people is living in housing apartments tiny as jail cells tho nobody complain. you americans and canadians are delusional.

and dont even think about telling it i made it up, ive traveled the world alot and seen the prices in western EU, USA, northern africa and most of the eastern europe so just stop this whining.

im not talking im promoting to be a poker pro im just telling facts, maybe yes it is not good idea if u got ur degrees n family ties to get urself nice salary but think little bit outside of the box, every nl10 beating grinder makes just as much as working average human around here. ofc working is more +ev than nl10 because of stability and benefits. but everything over nl16 or nl25 is making 1.5-2x more money if you mix it with working you are already making 2+3x more, and im talking ONLY about microstakes.

also one fact why people want to play and should/want to take poker more seriously it is because there is THEORETICALLY no salary cap. example dwan losing 20m dollar pot in macau set v set, in every other corporate job there is your 200k per year cap and thats it, but in some games its just 20bb. ofc im not telling everyone who is going to take it seriously will ever even achieve level near that only very few people of them all who play but im talking about theory.

and if you think latvia, lithuania or estonia is 3rd world country then gg wp you have a nice brain. and thats the salarys/prices in baltic states. EVEN WORSE in romania, belarus, russia so.... and im not even about talking about indonesia or congo or some real 3rd world. if you are making that 40k or 60k or 100k you are already in the top 0.3% or whatever of the people in the world so stop being so egoistic


if you only want to compare your 40k grinding vs 100k pro skills degree corporate job salarys then please change this title "why would anyone from USA middeclass start taking playing poker seriously in 2016"

I agree that most of these comments are coming from Americans that live in a fckng FISH bowl and have no clue about the world. Most of these "100k jobs" (more like 75k after taxes) are 60 hrs + a week not including commute, just as, if not more stressful than poker, require a lot of time in college aka debt, and are located in or around major cities where the cost of living is so high that 75k take home is a pretty meh quality of life. Their houses, cars, and entire lives are financed and they have no choice but to work almost every single day to pay for all of the **** they don't need. They can't airbnb around the world, or live in different countries all over the world (some with much higher quality of life for much much much cheaper than USA). They are stuck in their house that the bank still owns telling people that actually live their dreams and got out of the rat race that they are insufficient members of society and they should stop being delusional because zomg poker is dead (or insert some other critique for someone on a path different than their own). They get a vacation or two a year and besides that every day is go to work to pay their debt. Every day for 30+ years. It's fine tho because at least they get to live in the bestest country in the whole wide world (even tho they have never lived anywhere else, its still the best because USA USA USA!!!) AND atleast they have their material possessions that the bank is kind enough to let them hold on to so long as they keep making those payments! Finally, at 62 or whatever it is they retire and have a nice nest egg. With the best years of their life behind them, they are very proud of the number on a piece of paper that they have accumulated being a slave to society, media, and corporate America their entire lives...all the while thinking they were doing these things on their own free will. LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL


People working a job to make a living and people playing poker to make a living are both doing it wrong. They should both be a means to an end.

Furthermore, it is flawed thinking to only consider the amount of money you make when deciding what to do with your life. For instance, things like freedom, experiences, time with family/friends, and happiness should also be included in the equation.

In the end, if you are happy that is all that matters and you shouldn't feel the need tell others what to do with their lives. Live and let live.


Lock this 5 month old thread and throw away the key please.

Maybe you should start your own thread called "Why would anyone grind sweatshops in 2016 when i can 24 table 10nl for 6 bucks an hour"?

I'm working in a big big corporation. Trsut me, you will get 100k salary if you are co-ordinating a whole division. It takes an big amount of years to get a 100k job, even working in finances or financially related jobs, that pay much better than the regular ones.

You are just naive to think that corporation will throw money at you left, right and centre. You will get squeezed of every inch of your free time, you will have to put up with sometimes s***y bosses,client and respect a lot of absurd regulations made up by somebody who wanted to advance their career perspective.

I would be glad to be able to transition to a full time poker career just to get away from a money making machine were you will never receive a fair reward for your effort.

You'd be better off working 11h a day improving your game than 11 hours in a corporation. Then if you have other hobbies, you can also have a good social life.

What's scarier is working in a corporation for 30-40 years and then thrown out on the heap of used-chewed up-and-spat out grounded gear that are not useful to anybody.

You should look deeper into what scares you. I personally am scared of the above.

Plus that if you at least manage to earn at least your income, you do not have to worry about appeasing anybody else but yourself. This is a huge win in my opinion.

+1

I had many jobs in my lifetime, including some that most would consider highly highly stressful (ie working unpaid overtime for a boss that would yell at people daily and dealing directly with clients to solve their critical issues which were in many cases completely unsolvable). However, no job I ever had was anywhere close to as mentally draining as poker. You can be the greatest poker player in the world and it will still drain everything that is good from inside you and leave you feeling like ****. This is why most middle aged pros look like they want kill themselves.

Also, in general poker is not a great money making business to be in right now. Entering now would be akin to going into the oil business in 1986, deciding to go into IT in 2001, or starting development of a Las Vegas casino in 2008. It's hard for your timing to be much worse, but if you hate money then go for it. Most poker pros with a brain have been looking for exit strategies.

lol.

FISH- were you this upset when you found out santa clause, easter bunny, god etc doesn't exist? grow up.

I'm shocked that on an English speaking forum that was created by American's that a lot of the conversations that go on are..... about Americans, crazy!

I'm sure on gipsyteam.ru you guys have plenty of conversations about grinding penny stakes and living like a king. I'm not mad at you, I wish I could leave my family to go live somewhere that made that possible, but I can't. So, I grind 400NL online (because you can't afford to play much lower here) and slave my life away at a job as well.

Everyone is entitled to a voice in the conversation, just don't come here acting like you're so surprised the conversation centers around America.

What baffles me is not so much people taking it seriously given the possible winnings available now, but more the:

- clear accelerating decline of players and fish.
- shift in pokersites' attitudes towards winning players.
- death/collapsing of high stakes and mid stakes.

To be seriously thinking of investing hard time/effort/money/career-prospects into an industry that has not only been obviously dying from the top down steadily for 8 years but also where the host companies have started actively trying to alter the game and pricing so that you can't make money from it is the plan of a maniac.

I think the waste of time and career prospects is the biggest cost, hard work on poker will still net you $XX,XXX's but leave you unskilled and unemployable in your mid 30's.

I wonder if you're late teens early twenties this just doesn't occur to you, I know it didn't to me

well, obv americans are not taking it serious anymore as there is nowhere to play to make 2-3k/month with poker consistently for them. And even if that is not enough as rent is high and taxes super high so ya no wonder americans are complaining here.
Not nice to discourage everyone else on this planet to keep earning 30-50k/year just bc you greedy pig want to earn 8k/month? Where in the world is earning 100k/year standard? What a joke!

Average salary here in Canada is 50k a year based on 40 hrs work week. All you Europeans might not make 50k euro a year but your currency is worth 1.3-1.5x as much.

100k is above average but certainly not impossible. More likely than not if you pick STEM and work for 10 years. I assume it's the same deal in Europe.

I'm im my late-ish twenties (27), but if I work on my 'career', means that I will end up being more skilled at pulling someone else's cart. I;m working for almost 5 years in a corporation and I still cannot imagine myself working till I retire for someone else.

What's worse? Taking a shot at being independent - i.e. poker, having a business etc, or working for someone else? There's a steep price for the luxury of placing the responsibility for yourself on someone else's shoulders.

If I'd be making 30k a year from poker, I'd be soaring.

I understand the fact that poker is in decline, but it's not dead yet and while a lot of people complain, someone else is still making serious $$$$.

The thing is, $30K in America is nothing and is why you see American's in this thread saying you're dumb for choosing poker over work if you're not already entrenched in poker.

Obviously $30K here and $30K in Thailand is a huge difference. The thread title should be changed to something about American grinders, IMO, because plenty of countries in the world $30K USD makes you a baller.

Good players are stupid to quit right now if they are winning, but also stupid to not have a back up plan. With what Stars is doing it is very possible that everyone could wake up one day and every site in the world tells you to go get ****ed because you win money, it's already happening on small networks.