He's not bitter at all. I said virtually the same thing, and have never tried to be a pro, nor would I ever want to. We're calling it like we see it.

As for your 2nd paragraph, I'm in 100% agreement. But, you clearly have spent zero time reading threads on the subject on this site, because there's an abundance of people here who truly believe they are pros despite living at home.

Bum

luullz ty sir.

Mass-tabling might be akin to being an air traffic controller, in terms of "decisions per hour", but it's not as if 400 people will die if you send a couple of buy-ins into the abyss.

Poker is more like being a salesman that gets paid on commission. Sometimes people just won't buy your product, no matter how good you are at marketing it. #variance.

I've read enough. And yes, I completely understand they believe that ... but simply believing in something doesn't make it true.

And just so its clear, I by no means think I am better then anyone else simply b/c I have been able to support myself for 6 years now playing poker online. Its a hard job and if I knew what I was getting into 6 years ago (mainly black Friday and the fallout I am still dealing with) I probably would of never quit my cushy middle management job where I got paid no matter what as long as my ass was in the seat and I at least attempted to look busy.

If a 22 year old kid asked me today if he should play poker for a living, I would say absolutely not unless they are truly really talented at the game or have some specific life situation that would compatible (like say a motorcycle crash and you can't leave the house anyway or a felony on your record or something like that).

I agree that working on commission is pretty close. They also aren't sure exactly what their cash flow is going to be month to month, so they have to plan ahead.

Although, a salesman has no risk. It would be more like one of those scam companies where they make you buy all of the product up front and if you don't sell it you eat it.

A salesman doesn't have to worry about having a -15K month b/c he ran bad at Pot limit insurance.

Good posts.

This really isn't all that stressful of a job. Although, It depends on where you work.

^ seems about right. Poker has a few other peculiarities worth noting though

- Being a professional gambler is not the same socially as managing a small business or being a salesperson. There are personal issues - family, friends, in-laws, etc. - even if 90% are on board, the rest will not change there minds and will likely be a continued thorn in your side. Then there's the professional side of things. Being a salesman looks like a job on a resume - being a poker player does not. This is particularly problematic today, because it is often far more difficult to even get an interview for a job than actually do it. With keyword software and various HR idiots running the process, if your history doesn't fall into certain preselected boxes you will have a hard time even getting your foot in the door.


OTOH, poker has a few very significant upsides that other business don't.

- First, there is not a lot of "memory" in the game. If you **** something up today, you can just pick up tomorrow and start fresh. Making a bad professional decision could haunt you indefinitely. Even if everyone in the world saw you make a terrible poker decision, it is not going to block you from entering a game tomorrow and playing your A game. It would actually help you get action.


- Secondly, if you play online, you can play virtually anywhere. You can live in places with few good jobs available. If you like to travel, you can move around at will and still play full time. For me the first reason is/was the biggest benefit of playing full time - but I want to live in places that don't have good jobs. If you live in a major city and want to stay there, that is of little value.


FWIW, I played between quarter and half time while in grad school for a few years and full time for about a year. I now work as a physicist/engineer at a job well-suited for me, but I miss some aspects of poker. Working a technical job you end up staring at a computer screen a big chunk of the day anyway. People often suggest that there's something superior about making an actual physical product or being involved with some "service," but in reality most jobs that pay well have little real value - developing technology you don't need, convoluted games with money, convincing people to buy things, etc. OTOH it's nice to have some stability - short and long term - a matter of trade offs, I guess.

On the flip side a salesman can not run +15k because he ran good in pot limit insurance either. Everyone talks about the danger of running bad, however every single time a player gets unlucky an opposing player gets lucky . Yet we never seem to hear from those lucky guys. One of the many aspects of being a pro is you have to be able to absorb the bad runs, and take advantage of the good ones. If you can't you are playing too high for your BR or you don't have the temperament to be a pro. If short term luck was not always evident at the poker table poker would be as popular as chess.

^ +1

And while you spread this nonsense around the world, there are people who focused on their game a lot last year and are now beating or crushing small-mid stakes. Check the PG+C thread.

"Talent" in poker is a myth.

Long and hard education, highly skilled, top demanding job. Needs high mental, emotional, stress managements, top economical insecurity. Thai Boxer is close but they might get paid even when they lose and not sure how much they earn or have when 50, poker being better there. The best pro chess players are more secure as they have financial security, and they need less emotional management, but generally it is close. Any performer or any that needs more or less of these and lives more or less under these factors, is more or less close, in one way or the other.

Thai boxer? Why Thai boxer anymore than normal boxer?

No question that poker can attest to one's physical body being on the line as a military soldier. But when everything you have mind, house, car, kids, wife is lost in poker. That is where the analogy is accurate. Metaphorically speaking, you have ruined, and essentially lost your life when all your possessions are gone.

Well put.

maybe something like how they portray goldmining on discovery. you studied your opponent (the terrain), you perfected your technique (your equipment)

you go out there and put it on the line, sometimes you hit gold, often times the terrain is roughly your equal and it doesnt make much sense staying there (table selecting) and if the terrain is really unfriendly and you took a chance getting there it can leave you broke and in huge debt and your kids have nothing to eat.

Something where you get smashed in the balls most days and intermittent blowjobs.

I think people are over-estimating the stress of being a soldier. Unless you happen to be in an army under the control of some kind of religious nut politician who at any moment can send you on a crusade to a country at the other side of the world, then the chances are that you will go through your whole career without seeing action. Some countries have not been involved in any war for over 100 years.

I think people were referring to being a soldier on tour. If they weren't then you're right.

id say its pretty high up the stress level, i am a father with children and no solid education to fall back on, all i got is pokers going for me luckily I live in a scandi country and I am somewhat successful(or well, i was... now im struggling), i am stressed out as ****, but it is basically because i foresee the coming trainwreck. To sum it up im gonna end up humping crappy jobs on graveyard shifts, trying to figure out how I came up short. See, I had this picture in my head. Me sitting at highstakes, isi to my left, wcg to my right, playing for them big monies.

MTT players = escort drivers

lots of frustrated grinding, very few scores.

Uhm ... wtf? This is not true in at least one case. It is more like if you spend your life creating 15k posts on 2+2 while playing 2/4 limit live you probably should not comment on issues regarding strong players. Or basically anything poker related.

But you are in good company. Most people are just posting their personal excuse of why it is completely fine that they never made it in poker.

Just quoting this for the writing you see on the wall - hope you're wrong about your situation and it turns around for you!

To answer OP, my analogy is: Delusional reality show contestant

• Start out with few RL encumbrances and fewer RL skills
• Some early success that leads you to think YOU can be the one that makes it
• For you to succeed, almost all others MUST fail and you need to push them along the path to failure when you can
• A small few succeed for a short time
• A large number wind up expending enormous effort over years and years to live distinctly average lives - if they'd work this hard in something more traditional they'd have a far better chance of success but THIS is what they want to do
• Very few are successful long term and even those that are have limited up-side compared to the real world
• Even the very few very successful aren't immune to failure - failure insomuch as being broke, having to start over
• Most will be forced back into reality, older, wiser (maybe) and with RL encumbrances - kids, marriages, etc - that have built up over the years. Wondering what happened - see quote above.

You damn well better love playing poker because at some point, loving it might be all you're left with.

In this same vein, it's crossed my mind before that with regard to live tourney grinders, if you posted an ad for a job describing the amount of travel, misery and hard work they go through and how much they MIGHT make, nobody in their right mind would apply for the job.

I can answer for comparing pro poker to military for you.

I was a $500/$1knl live reg, long story short decided when I'm on my deathbed I wanted to have done more than just play cards. So I put in a package to fly fire the military, figured that was cool enough to give up the life of poker.

I met my wife that way, but that's about the only "cool" thing about it. The stresses are so far beyond anything you can imagine. Say you make a bad call and lose a stack, if I do that I die. Or maybe my best friend does.

Every action I take is recorded and monitored so people can look at it later and decide id I made the best decision in the split second I had. Sort of like going over hand histories I guess except again the actions and results are weighted so much heavier. And let me tell you I have plenty of bosses who ensure I'm aware of how important these decisions are.

This isn't even getting into yearly flight evals, which are by far the most stress I've ever experienced, and you live that every year.

Now add in long periods away from your family. Yeah I'm actually thinking about leaving when my contact ends

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