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UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article

03-25-2015 , 02:28 PM
Is a study of half a billion poker hands really necessary to determine there is skill involved!? Would, say, 10 million games of chess need to be analysed to demonstrate that that game takes skill in order to be successful?

Dr Dennie van Dolder, of the University of Nottingham's School of Economics, said the study showed 'skilled players will consistently outperform less skilled players if enough hands...are played.'

Dr van Dolder said his study's findings could now have 'significant legal implications' for such people.


lol. Surely no one would say such a thing! It's hardly revolutionary. It's on par to carrying out a chocolate-eating study and declaring the study showed 'chocolate eaters will consistently put on more weight than non-chocolate eaters if enough chocolate is eaten.'

Last edited by MeleaB; 03-25-2015 at 02:34 PM.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-25-2015 , 03:47 PM
Looking at what is said about this study. Why would the Uni professor say that we should be taxing it. The study was on if poker was a game of skill. HMRC sets what is and is not a trade. The govt isn't going to set legislation to tax poker players and in particular professional poker players. They had the betting tax that was abolished in 2001.

There have been studies on if playing poker is a game of skill in the past and there will be in the future. The HMRC handbook states: "This shows that having expertise or being systematic (‘studying form’) is not enough to create a trade of being a ‘professional gambler’." This study doesn't changed that.

Also, if the govt's legislation is deemed unlawful it doesn't mean that there going to snap tax professional poker players.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-25-2015 , 04:34 PM
The times wrote an article as well, but you seem to need to have a subscription to read most of it.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-25-2015 , 05:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by theonepunter

Also, if the govt's legislation is deemed unlawful it doesn't mean that there going to snap tax professional poker players.
They will revert to a betting tax (either on stakes like Ireland or on winnings) which will have unknown consequences for poker, maybe a redic tax like France. The govt is not going to allow offshore firms to continue to trade with uk citizens without getting a cut.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-25-2015 , 06:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SootedPowa
ty davmcg I hope Gib are successful.
Why? Domestic gambling pays the tax so why not online providers? A level playing field works.

POC tax delivers a reunited global player pool.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-25-2015 , 09:52 PM
Quote:
These costs are passed onto customers and winning players who end up basically paying at least half of this tax.
no it wont.

They will just have to make less profit. If they pass it to customers then i will go to a poker site that doesnt pass it on.

And if they ALL pass it on, then I will launch my own poker website - where ill be happy to make £10m profit a year rather than £20m profit but charging more rake

But it wont ever happen. Anyone who knows anything about business knows the nature of the beast is such that firms will have to take the hit, not the customers
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-25-2015 , 10:04 PM
yeh and>? Why shouldnt they pay 15% tax just like every other gambling company in the uk?

If anything this is why the internet is laughable. These companies think they can come to the UK, sell to UK citizens but pay NOTHING to the government in tax. The only difference being... they are based on the internet rather than physically in the uk.

So absolutely they should pay 15%

Also in general i find people keep trying to be 'extreme' regarding uk poker. Any mention of it and people are trying to majorly speculate creating big threads.

UK poker aint getting taxxed any time soon. Companies arent increasing their rake any time soon (and if they do ill join another site that doesnt charge) and in general gambling in uk is never getting taxxed. Were very lucky in UK. One of the few countries that actually has sense on this /thread
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 04:22 AM
superdave - the 15% gross profits tax is already in place and has been passed on in terms of reduced vip benefits, stars were actually considering raking rebuys for uk players. You don't seem to be very up to date on the topic.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 06:38 AM
Vote UKIP!!!! Nige loves a bit of poker and a pint
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 07:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkMattersMan
Vote UKIP!!!! Nige loves a bit of poker and a pint
im sold.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 11:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeztuck
This kind of research could also be beneficial to those countries like the USA where proving poker is a skill game can have some impact on their absurd situation.
Check these studies out as well (sorry about all the ones that need subscriptions)

In recent years there has been no lack of studies supporting the argument that poker is a game of skill. In 2008, researchers at the Case Western Reserve University in Cleveland published the results of a relatively small study in which they concluded that “Poker is a Skill”. The following year, Citigal – a software consulting firm – analysed more than 100 million hands played on PokerStars and determined that skill dominated luck.

Also in 2009, Ingo Fiedler and Jan-Philipp Rock from the University of Hamburg’s Institute of Law and Economics published “Quantifying Skill in Games – Theory and Empirical Evidence for Poker” (subscription required) – a study that examined the results of more than 50,000 online players before providing strong support to the theory that poker is a game of skill.

The Role of Skill Versus Luck in Poker” was published in 2011 – again demonstrating that skill was the dominant factor for profitable players and based on evidence from the previous year´s World Series of Poker. This was followed in 2012 by the most extensive study into the skill vs. luck argument – Robert Hannum´s “Economics of Poker: The Effect of Systematic Change” (subscription required) – which concluded “Clearly the driving force behind the economic outcome of Texas Hold’em is skill rather than chance.”

Info from PokerNewsReport - "Another Study Shows Poker to be a Game of Skill"

WRT taxing winnings in the UK, it will never happen because it is unenforceable.

WRT Judicial Review of POC Tax. My guess it that it will be referred to the EU Court of Justice and we won´t hear about it again for years!
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 12:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richas
Why?
Far less choice for UK consumers since it came in and less rewards/bonuses.

If the UKGC actually really did regulate sites properly (in the players favour as well as the sites) I would not mind but they don't. Money stolen out of UKGC licenced sportsbook wallets on betfair? They don't care. Canbet? They don't care. They are not even enforcing their current regulations. No grey area countries allowed to be served? LOL.

I don't think Gibraltar would do any better btw but at least we would have more choice and more rewards if everything moved back offshore. They just want the tax and not to actually regulate.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 02:44 PM
UK are like we here in canada.

We will never be taxed on gambling or poker winnings.

Its the nuts and forever will stay this way
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 03:28 PM
few things its one article I have not heard anything in the news we do have an election coming up anything political could happen with the parties trying whatever tricks they can to get more votes.

However how serious is this article is it merly speculation I read crud every day in tabloids . The other day i read that a study on power naps proofs it increases memory by 5 times.

that could potentially be true, however the article mentions one group took a power nap and then remembered everything just as well as before whilst the control group watched tv then remembered worse then before.

maybe that proves tv is bad for memory rather then powernap good etc.

If however poker earnings do get taxed then I expect to be able to write loses of against winnings for net profit, and to be able to write ICMIZER subscription cost on training videos cost for sharkscope and etc off against my taxable income.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 05:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by davmcg
superdave - the 15% gross profits tax is already in place and has been passed on in terms of reduced vip benefits, stars were actually considering raking rebuys for uk players. You don't seem to be very up to date on the topic.
Quite frankly i couldnt care less about VIP benefits.

The only thing i care about is rake. And guess what? They havent upped it!

Yeh they were considering raking rebuys and what happened?... nothing!

Because they know full well people will just leave to a site that DOESNT pass on the increase, and instead settles for lower profit margins.

Look i cba with people trying to be extreme about UK poker. If your so upset or worried about it then i can only advise you stop playing poker all together. Also you shouldnt be basing your winnings around VIP benefits or anything else. It should only be based around what you do at the tables. And VIP benefits are exactly that... a benefit

Last edited by super_dave31; 03-26-2015 at 05:17 PM.
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 05:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SootedPowa
I don't think Gibraltar would do any better btw but at least we would have more choice and more rewards if everything moved back offshore. They just want the tax and not to actually regulate.
Do you know how ungrateful you sound? Honestly.

Countries like France get taxxed something ridiculous like 50%. Greece get taxxed on their winnings AND losses. USA cant even play poker!!

And your moaning about "more choice and more rewards" - yet you get to play mostly against a world wide player pool... get zero tax on your winnings... can play on multiple sites.... oh, but you get less rewards. lol

And again, why shouldnt the government want 15% tax? If you trade here and operate business in the UK then why shouldnt the government charge you 15% just like they charge every other business here 15%?
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 05:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by super_dave31
Quite frankly i couldnt care less about VIP benefits.

The only thing i care about is rake. And guess what? They havent upped it!

Yeh they were considering raking rebuys and what happened?... nothing!

Because they know full well people will just leave to a site that DOESNT pass on the increase, and instead settles for lower profit margins.

Look i cba with people trying to be extreme about UK poker. If your so upset or worried about it then i can only advise you stop playing poker all together. Also you shouldnt be basing your winnings around VIP benefits or anything else. It should only be based around what you do at the tables. And VIP benefits are exactly that... a benefit
ty for confirming clueless troll status
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote
03-26-2015 , 06:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by davmcg
ty for confirming clueless troll status
ty for confirming short stack nit status that can only make a margin with vip benefits
UK..Will Poker Winnings Be Taxed? Newspaper Article Quote

      
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