It's looking like they really shorted the limit players. i have a friend who played nio nio in the limit games but he def got a refund.

If he is able to get names released, HH's, all money repayed he will be a hero.
Doubt this.

Otherwise this decision will continue to haunt him where ever he goes.
Not worth it.

That's known in the trade as a 'policeman's apostrophe'.

another brilliant UB move to stiff a Radio/TV personality like Ali Nejad and pay off a random limit donk here and there then deny the superusers didn't play limit although I think I was cheated in limit

Just listened to the latest episode of PokerRoad, interviewing Joe about UB. To the casts credit, they did make some superuser jokes. But some things did come to mind.

1. Joe said that #3, the release of names would be tough, b/c of legal reason (fear of getting sued) and Also moral reasons, not wanting to ruin peoples lives.

I would say, UB hasn't been sued by people cheated, or Russ. Why fear these people? Just present why their names are involved, present the facts, and let everyone judge for themselves. Fear of these peoples lives being ruined pales in comparison to those who HAD their lives ruined by losing money due to being cheated. I am sure that Russ isn't the only one who can be named with 100% certainty. UB/Paul Leggett/Annie have said it was an inside job, so surely some people could be found just as guilty as Russ.

Also, I would like to find out what Legal Authority UB/The KGC is working with, or turned this evidence over to? This seems to be ignored and to many the answers seems to be nobody.

If the HH's are now going out, but first a summary spreadsheet, why couldn't this have been done shortly after the settlement?

Also, wouldn't mind hearing from Mr. Norton himself, afterall in the AP case a letter "from him" was posted. Now it is the COO Paul Leggett everyone talks with, meets with, etc. Makes the whole ownership question more valid. I am sure Joe would never comment on the Blast-Off/Tokwiro situation. (Can someone direct me where to go to ask these questions on PokerRoad, I do not have an account there, but would sign up to ask)

mook,

don't we all know for sure it was more than just russ cheating? what happened to the whole story behind nionio? wasn't he the son of an upper level management employee of ub? if so this probably means that more than a few people were involved.

So basically UB's whole story of a rouge employee has now changed to "oh we don't want to release their names because we don't know if they were involved"

I truly think it was a rouge employee to cheat as blatantly as nionio, but that just screams the fact that there were a lot of people involved if it got outside of the inner circle.

I am sure we all know it was more than Russ. From all the info I have went over and been sent, I am sure I know a few others names. As for NioNio, I am not sure it was the mother/son combo you are referring too. I do know those names, but not sure if they are behind NioNio, or even the report. I also have to make an effort not to publicly name anyone, b.c I too do not feel like getting sued for defamation or libel, or slander, or 2+2. Letters from Lawyers, or pissed off people can be scary and/or annoying.

I just know there is a lot to this mess that isn't public or will be made public. I would hope in the end, all players are refunded properly, or feel like they were. I find it hard to believe all the accounts were named or found.

I am awaiting to see actiondan's reaction, he was refunded $240 but thought it would be in the double digit thousands, so maybe he will post his HH's when he gets them

So, less than a week in and he's backtracking already?

And I don't usually go in for the moralistic hang-em-and-flog-em stuff at all, but naming people who've systematically cheated their peers doesn't make *you* responsible for ruining their lives. Rather, it holds them responsible for their own actions. What possible reason can anyone have for not wanting to see that happen?

It might damage their reputation in poker circles, but that's hardly akin to ruining their lives, IMO.

Finally, why would Sebok worry about getting sued? Surely we'd be talking about UB naming the names? They've got deep pockets so they can handle the legal fees, they've got the evidence, so they can mount a proper defence.

I can see why they wouldn't want their operations scrutinized in a court of law, mind. But that's just one more reason not to represent them.

not sticking up for UB but we know from the AP scandal that they used "dormant" real accounts and chip dumped - those dormant accounts are not the cheaters - just like the IP address of Scott Tom's (sue me Scott) office at AP they got Russ's IP address in the UB case - what Joe has to ask for is the IP address of the superusers and it probably went like this - someone maybe Greg Pierson told Russ about the software that can see hole cards they hired 30* pros to play the superuser "dormant" accounts - Russ coordinated the superusers each one covering a high stakes table,cheat the table then dumb the money back to Russ who paid off the right UB employees to keep their mouths shut so Russ could get the money off the site,everything was going well for four years (since '04) until a kid in the office nionio stumbled into the software glitch and decided to get rich for himself but didn't know how to make it look real and got busted and blew the whole gig SO the problem for UB is if all teh HH are sent to a central location for analysis a lot can be learned

Just stopping by to say boooooooooooooooooo

I used to like Joe Sebok

Where even is Russ now? Is he in hiding or something? Surely he has to be, there are so many people out there who hold him responsible for a lot of $ and would want to seek some sort of revenge (partly due to the fact the justice system has let them down)??

Rollo, Is it for sure that dormant accounts were used in the AP case? How is this know for sure, I missed this. I also do not believe much in the AP case.

Also amazing how Mr. Pierson ignores interview requests and also fails to try to defend his companies of IeLogic or Iovation. Oh well.

Joe is going to have a hard time with getting the names out, but I hope he does (or rather UB finally agrees and lets him do so)

you can find Russ on the golf course with Layne Flack

http://www.rawvegas.tv/watch/russ-ha...953f0613af9438

http://wickedchopspoker.com/?s=russ+hamilton+golf

using dormant accounts is brilliant - just change the password - the original owner of the account would have no clue - chip dump HU to a Russ account and bingo but I don't see why Joe naming a professional gambler as a UB cheat is a problem it's part of the business just ask Mike Caro or Barryg for that matter

http://www.russgeorgiev.com/rec-gambling-poker.html

seen joe Sebok the espn 's inside deal
he's so full of bs
hope he goes busto

And I assume that he can still be found on this golf course?

If so, I am quite surprised there has not been any attempts of revenge on Russ? I mean, so many people lost LOTS of $, and he is a primary guilty party, and if it's so easy to get to him, surely there would have been a couple of incidents were victims have (through pure anger and frustration) attempted to release their anger upon him in one way or another??

He obv. is busto for taking a deal like this...

$$ is a crazy thing.... Someone's "word" and "character" means everything... For him to be a "public poker figure" and have been ON RECORD of talking about UB so negatively and allowing people to talk so badly about people that signed with them (around the time Rizen and some other guys did i think)

and to sign with them himself, is just absolutely sick.. I think he is a cool enough dude, i have met him in person and he is always nice and always cordial.... But this shows that the $$ means more then his word and character which i just cant stand for..

Sell out... Sad day....

I listened to every Big Poker Sunday at LEAST once and watched every Life of Ivey, I participated in a few other ways on Pokerroad.com as well over the years and once I heard this I removed the website address from my bookmarks. I will never go to Pokerroad again, no matter what crazy Ivey content they have. F you Sebok, sellout.

wow a selfish,greedy,arrogant,hypocritical playa of the live pokaz that has lost all credibility ......perfect fit for UB

is it a bit much to draw an analogy with the dark knight and suggest that joe sebok is the hero the poker community deserves but not needs right now? is he sacrificing himself for the greater good?

It is possible that what he is doing is admirable and with the best of intentions? How much can the likes of Mookman (who i admire greatly for his efforts) and others actually achieve at this stage?

Surely Joe will be in a position to get the truth out better than someone looking in?

Give the man a chance ffs.
disclaimer - only read first 300 posts, ignore if vitriol towards Joe Sebok has subsided.

Yes it is

+1

F UB, F Sebok, and F Pokerroad.

I don't mind. I like Seebs and I like pokerroad.

I don't give a flying f if someone got cheated on UB, only reason I won't play there is Phil Hellmuth.