I have heard of this from more informed source than me. And they will kick out other botters and confiscate funds as it hurts the bottom line. Was on a site other than asian apps.

Genuinely I cant believe this isnt getting more interaction and attention. Between these type of things and seating scripts. Cash games online are going to continually deteriorate. Especially so at 500nl and higher. The general online poker playing public vastly underestimates just how significantly seating scripts have hurt cash games online.

Agreed ... this should be like the #1 thread ... instead it's a bunch of drama trash and rampant speculation. There have been several threads on 2p2 and other places about this issue & something really needs to be done about it. The online poker ecosystem would be so much better (for everyone) without this scourge.

The hope for poker is in regulated sites and live, a ton of ppl are going to get screwed and not have access to games that make poker as viable as a more traditional career path, at least for everyone in the lower/mid tiers.

Sites that do proper KYC/forced policing through regulation are gonna be the only things that are worth it in a few years and this isn't gonna be a massive problem for them.

tbf ppl have been saying onlines death was around the corner for like a decade now, but eventually that day is coming and this just seems like another death rattle (even tho apparently we've been dealing with it for years already)

I'm not trying to be doom and gloom, i personally hope to be able to play poker for several more years but i just think operators dont care about rescuing a dying industry, they just need to maximize the time they have left bc most of them aren't gonna make it anyway.

Maybe you could get an answer from one of these forums focused on poker bots *mod note: links removed* There are plenty more and it's just ****ing annoying. There are lots of discussion about different profiles and how they are doing in games. There are lists of poker sites security levels.

You can find **** like this:
So yeah, I'm pretty sure there are bots on MTTs too, and the sites are sending friendly emails if detected.

Hey Chris,

Thanks for taking the time to respond and thanks to the person who alerted you as well!

Your name was on a page of their American website which listed you as part of their advisory board. The website was up for several years, but it seems that it was taken down sometime in the last couple of years.

I recall the headquarters for their American branch being listed at a Nevada location. It was 251 S. Green Valley Pkwy #721 Henderson, NV 89012

I have no reason not to believe what you're saying and that they were probably just using your name without authorization.

As you can see from the post below made earlier in this thread I was not the only person in this thread who seen your name listed on their website.
And this was the link to the website, which is now gone.
https://neopokerlab.com/

Things I recall noting from the website.

1. They stated they were experts in poker AI.
2. They could identify bots in your poker room.
3. They had a product that provides bots for liquidity.
4. They could identify the sharks in your room and provide advice on proactive measures to take against them.

With the Wayback Machine website I was able to get a screenshot from their old American website.

Chris has always been a pretty good dude so I'd guess they were just using his name/likeness to lend themselves legitimacy. After playing with him a bit, I can also say that he's definitely not using a bot <3.

https://web.archive.org/web/20210621...opokerlab.com/

crazy, I guess you can just put anyones name on something. Also have no idea who those other two people are

is it (largely) known on which sites and games these farms operate?

are the larger regulated sites (stars gg ipoker) also infected with these botfarms, and does this hold true for cash games and/or tournaments?

or are these farms only active in unregulated sites like wpn and pokerbros?

I'm not sure how much the effort is worth it to you to track them down, but if they profited off of using your name to lend themselves legitimacy I imagine they owe you some money.


At different points in time I believe they could have been found operating on most sites which had significant traffic. As you can probably imagine Stars was probably the first to rid them from their tables followed by the other sites with decent security teams. The last I heard was that they were focusing on the app clubs.

To see what sites were most bot infected by them not too many years ago read through the thread linked below.
Bot farm uncovered and exposed

I'm no expert on these matters, but i seem to recall that for example the PLO botring on stars was uncovered mostly due to the fact that people found a couple dozen accounts with near identical stats.

So how exactly are sites supposed to detect botting done by a 2PC setup, using an array of bots with differing stats?

I'd like to believe Stars has a firm grip on the situation (and/or anybody else running online poker for that matter), but I really don't see how...

I don't think it's very likely anybody smart enough to make multiple unique winning bot profiles would only have each profile run on single accounts at the lower stakes. It's just not worth their time and effort for the small profit, so they'll run their own bot ring or sell their bot profile to a bunch of customers to run it on their own accounts, which makes them easy to detect for the sites who care enough to stop them, and profit from the sites that don't. At the higher stakes bots are easy to detect because they stand out like sore thumbs.

The tougher thing for sites to detect these days is RTA lookups on second PCs, but there are things sites with good security teams do to detect and deter it and have also implemented features to reduce the effectiveness of it, but there's certainly more almost every site could be doing to deter it even more.

My suggestion for a long time has been to play on and support the sites which put the necessary resources into maintaining an effective security team and to call out and steer players away from the sites that don't.

how can a site detect you using rta on a second pc not connected to the internet? I think the people who have been caught for rta wee caught because sites saw them playing like robots/perfect over a huge sample not because they actually had real evidence. so if someone wanted to rta and not get caught the solution would be to only rta some of the time

Sites with good security teams have their methods, but they're obviously not going to share everything they do to detect it with the public.

The Finding Equilibrium guy had some good suggestions in a video he made a while back, but obviously it's mostly stuff that sites which care would ever implement.



You can also find some more discussion about solutions in the thread linked below.
Ideas to avoid cheaters using RTA

You might be underestimating the greediness of the players who are willing to cheat.

botting on multiple networks would take care of that. and using RTA through a 2 PC setup is exactly what I was referring to, let's not get caught up in semantics re RTA/botting.

It would be a slight improvement to the situation if the sites could catch and ban at least the bots that are using multiple accounts and playing high volume. With the data and information they have, it should be very doable.

Having 100 people running 100 bots is better situation than having 100 people running 2000 bots.