Lol what is this. Do you just sit around imagining possible scenarios going yep that one sounds like a good one. Grow up.

.

Boom

Can you elaborate on why his post is so stupid? is it so dumb that I should just know? because I think that loaning money at the table to a degenerate gambler is is in fact analogous to supplying drugs to an addict, and if you think that is stupid then I would be interested in hearing your counterpoint.

The only part where I differ is that the drug dealer fronting to the addict is much more likely to receive payment than the guy feeding the degenerate gambler, since the addict has a much greater fear of being barred from the source.

Guys like EE, Chino Rheem and many others are living proof that anyone can find action, even known scammers and guys with a long history of not paying.

I know it's been said multiple times but in 2010 was EE just regarded as a scummy gambling addict and all knew it? Despite carrying on as a FT pro and part-time business man that by all accounts was playing in Bobby's Room daily. Surely your not suggesting it's immoral to swap/loan/sell in the world of gambling period?

I don't know what else to say to posts like this other than , booooohoooo, this is a game played for lots of $$, humans are involved, hopefully most of the time everything is as perfectly ethical, but that's as good as can be expected. It's always the idealists who have never actually played poker seriously that get this critical about things like the isildur situation, I don't recall basically any serious players agreeing with the opinion that isidur got "scammed" at the time. I mean sharing HHs? sharing action? strategizing together how to beat him? This is probably standard procedure at ultra high stakes games, live and online, if isildur was really so naive to not assue this was happening his $$ wasn't lasting long anyway.

If Eli was some complete fish who was just dumping $$ and cts was the beneficiary I could MAYBE be somewhat on board with this. But aren't we in a thread where the guy in question is writing a ****ing poker book? Claiming to be some big shot high stakes winner?

People loaning money in the poker room need to watch The Sopranos first, you add points right away and have the juice running always and have muscle to break legs and arms or worse when the scum bags are slow to pay.

I think poker message boards are the only community that would say how lending money to Eli Elezra during a poker game in 2010, when he would continue to play in that game for years afterwards, is predatory, but the poker game itself somehow isn’t.

Perhaps you don t get that the other peoples who told him it was a mistake to lend Eli money were all scumbag who lended him money when he was drunk and won back the money themselves few hours later ? I think it s only fair that they didnt get paid either .

Not at all. Swapping or loaning with people you know is not uncommon. Loaning to someone you don't know at the poker table and then getting stiffed is not unheard of either. I was just responding to the post saying the other guy was stupid.

It always annoys me to see such a lazy post, just "Oh, you are so stupid," with no elaboration or counterpoint. Why is he so stupid? I think he makes a perfectly legitimate point and his analogy is fair.

It's clear that EE must have already had a sketchy rep at that point, if other people were coming up to CS and telling him that he had made a bad loan.

I don't know the people involved here except by reputation, but the scenario is not unfamiliar. I scoff at the idea of a professional gambler claiming the moral high ground in these types of situations, when his entire business model is based on taking advantage of other peoples weakness and stupidity.

You win all his money. You loan him some back and you win that too. Then you cry to mommy when he stiffs you? I'm not saying he doesn't owe you, but I'm saving my tears for African orphans and American Blue-collar workers.

How can anyone defend Eli for stiffing on 40K?

I think there are people out there that view Eli's move as a +EV financial decision, since he got to free roll the guy.

They somehow rationalize that he gets to screw over the guy that loaned him money because the lender is a "shark". Eli out "sharked" the loan shark by being even more scummy and disgraceful. It's the race to the bottom of who can be the biggest scumbag.


You think CS is a scumbag. Too ****ing bad. You took on the debt you have to pay it. If you don't then fine, but there should be consequences. You should be black****ed from poker. At the very least, you certainly shouldn't have a book promoting you.


End of story. Career= over. No more Bobby's room Eli. You're banned.

Ooooh. I got one.

It’s a chilly January night in Las Vegas, January 2010. A tired, drunk Ei Elezra flips over his cards, raps the table and says “nice hand.” He stands and walks away from the 4-8 table.

From his perch in the high-limit area, Cole South watches the bedraggled figure drag his weary body from the room. “Jackpot” he thinks, twirling his mustache.

“Leaving so soon, buddy?” Eli turns his attention way from the row of nickel slots where he was hoping to find a few forgotten credits. He pauses for a moment; surely this famous and skilled player can’t be talking to him, could he?

“It’s a hot night in there, pal. Lots of fish ready for a couple of sharks like us. In fact, a seat just opened up in the 400-800 game with your name on it...”

“But Mr. South,” said the man, adjusting his broken glasses. “This must be some kind of a joke. I’m just a poor, completely broke player who is well aware of my limitations who would never try to exaggerate either my wealth or skill level, and who can’t afford to lose even one cent more and will never play poker again.”

At that moment, eight of Eli’s children rushed into the casino and grabbed ahold of his legs. Their filthy rags looked even dingier in the bright lights of the casino. “Father,” the littlest one cried, “please come home. We have run out of coal and we are freezing.”

“Nonsense!” cackled the grinning Cole, reaching into his alligator-skin satchel and thrusting $100,000 into the stunned Eli’s hands. “You will take this money and join us in the high-limit room!”

“But I’m warning you, Eli. Unless you pay back this money, interest free, after some unspecified length of time...” The casino lights flickered and dimmed as the two walked back into the poker room. “I will occasionally send you text messages about it and then after nine years let the general public know.”

Cole then disappeared in a puff of smoke. The scent of sulphur lingered in the air.

I am curious whether those claiming Eli should be 'blackballed' adopt the same approach towards any friends or co-workers who ever filed BK (either personal chapter) or simply walked away from credit card debt...if they don't declare those persons to be social pariahs, where is the difference (especially since they likely walked from far more than is allegedly at issue between EE and CTS).

I've bought the book...it arrived last week but I have not had time to sit down to read it (I expect to do that when I fly back to Vegas next week). I view purchasing the book as something completely separate and distinct from any personal issues EE might have with persons who have lent him money in the past.

I don't view this biography as being any different from other biographies out there, poker-related or not. Simply put, there are likely none ever written that were 100% accurate. They are almost always going to be self-serving in some manner. When I have bought them, it was for entertainment value with the potential to find some educational or informational elements to the writing.

That's fair, but it seems like this is the first time after 9 years that cts made it public and it was triggered after about the 5th time EE stated itt that he always pays his debts. Not like cts made a thread and has been on a war path to get repaid ever since the debt occurred. I would hardly call that crying to mommy.

Perhaps based on the fact that he hasn't brought it up until now demonstrates that maybe he realises some kind of risk in lending in the first place. Regardless he's owed and was well justified to bring it up when he likely felt like he was being needled by EE's BS.

The difference is that is a faceless billion $ corporation that just writes it off on their taxes and in Eli's case, that is 1 person that loaned him money in good faith.

Going back a couple days to this: I think it's important to delineate between "shouldn't publish" and "shouldn't be allowed to publish" (not that you were saying that of course). Obv free press so #2 isn't really a conversation and people calling for that (if anyone) are just wrong, but just because you can do something often still doesn't mean you should. MM is free to do what he wants, of course, and I'll always support that in a vacuum; but it's not at all unreasonable to expect to hear criticism for that decision, much in the vein of the public backlash at "If I Did It."

(Abegnale's book is not at all analogous as others have pointed out; Abegnale never once claimed to have been on the level afaik, and freely admitted his scams on Johnny Carson's show and in published works. If Abegnale tried to publish a book on how to be a successful commercial airline pilot or something that would be a different story.)

ha ha this

Nice catch. so true.


Also, I agree with RR. lol at people that say anyone with any sort of shady past (publicly known or not) shouldn't be allowed or shouldn't publish a book. Free speech, baby.


Finally, the mistake here was not publishing a book, it was starting this thread.

Eli likely has 1000's of rec fans from HSP days because he was on frequesntly, was funny, played crazy hands, and came across as a cool dude. Much like Farha (Farha had more swagger though)

Lots of these fans prob have/had no idea who cts is or any of the prev allegations against him and never will. Of those many would not care either way in decision to buy book or not. Just silly to think they would

Now, for people that are part of the professional poker world, where scamming/not paying debts is the cardinal sin, I could see how for sure they would say eff that, I'm not buying that book.

Cool support a scammer and a liar. Good job.

I don't disagree with any of that. I was just responding to the guy dissing the post that said loaning money to degenerate gamblers was the same as fronting rocks to crack heads.

I think the analogy was reasoned, and the response of "oh, your post is the 5th dumbest ever," was not. If you are going to say that a post is the 5th dumbest in the history of 2+2 you should at least say why.

While I think his claim on the money is legit, I have little sympathy for CS in this scenario.

This is not the same as taking advantage of a drug addict. A drug addict cannot "break you" and win back the money he gives you and more. A drug addict can't mask his addiction the way a high rep gambler can. He didn't loan to some airport scammer, he loaned to one of the biggest poker celebrities in Las Vegas. The burden is not Cole South to figure out Elezra's intention, mindset, addiction, bankroll, whatever, the burden is on Eli Elezra to pay his debts and not gamble money he doesn't have.

He probably got pressured into doing it with the "high stakes players always loan and borrow" bs. Hustled. Anyone comparing him to a predatory drug dealer is a fish.

you two are delusional

nailed it imo

I'm no supporter of EE's in the matter (who could be?), but this is just ridiculous. Pulling some hypothetical bull**** completely out of your ass does not make it a "theory."