Grusch said in an interview that he wants to be a "thought leader" on the topic of UFOs and plans on launching a non-profit this year to help study the phenomenon. Sounds pretty griftery.

Yeah and I'm not rehashing things either just because you can't be arsed staying up to speed itt.
Show me an official statement by the Pentagon stating they have indeed material of non human origin and them making it available for public scrutiny and I'll be convinced.

You've yet to specify how Grusch's claims are any more significant than previous claims by various sources.

I assume they are doing an information game that will help us catch some leakers

I don't think they put an awful lot of effort into it. It makes a certain amount of sense to record and where possible analyse sightings of unidentified flying objects, mainly in case it reveals new technology being used by foreign powers. But only the US Government seems to make a big deal of it, and popular belief in alien spaceships and alien abduction does seem to be stronger in the US than elsewhere. 'Flying saucer' mania just after the Second World War did coincide with fear of the Soviet Union, the first foreign power to present any significant threat to the continental United States, particularly once the Russians were known to possess jet-engine, rocket and nuclear technology. West Europeans, living much closer to the Soviet Union and well used to the concept of hostile neighbours, don't seem to have developed the same paranoid sensibility.

For instance, I live in a 19th-century London street, but 100 yards away there's a wildly out-of-place 1950s house. That's because of wartime bomb damage, and it's normal in London. I've seldom lived more than a few hundred yards from the nearest obvious bomb site. I used to live near Highbury Corner, where there's a huge traffic roundabout instead of all the pre-existing 19th-century buildings, and the roundabout marks the impact crater of a German V-1 cruise missile in 1944. This is normal round here. The US has never been bombed, so the American popular imagination has a very different, fantasy-based and politically paranoid approach to aerial intrusion on the inviolate domestic realm.

Good post but you forgot American exceptionalism, both national and personal.

Aliens landed in my back garden! I called 911 but didn't bother taking any cell phone footage!!

ah right, you're just a troll. Good luck with that

The other (4?) whistleblowers have started to talk anon to the press, backing up Grusch with some extraordinary details. Mental

https://public.substack.com/p/us-has...en-space-craft

Yeah like "The Aviary" whistleblower group in the 1980s.


How are Grusch's claims any more significant?

Not trolling at all and if it's so different and significant you should have no problem specifying how, instead of deflecting and evading the question.
So whenever you're ready mate.

Barring actual presentation of compelling proof of Grusch's claims, his claims are no different or more significant than the claims of Bob Lazar, Phillip Corso and the Aviary. Nothing new is being brought to the table here. Please specify how Grusch's claims are any different or more significant, thanks.

Yeah but I can't help you if you're not digesting my repsonses.

I spent several paragraphs outlining how interconnected and consistent they all are and how if one cog goes then they all go. Grusch's testimony isn't only spectacular because of who he was (confirmed) nor necessarily because of what he's saying (long discussed in ufology circles), it's the fact he's backed up by so many key players and confirms their narrative too, on top of everything that's led to this point. It's called corroborative evidence. It's not a black and white science, it requires the ability to handle and balance incomplete information.

You have to contextualise. This isn't Bob Lazar, some loner even your dad can tell he's not a proper physicist and the coumminty splits on whether he's legit. Or Corso some mad old git. This isn't even Luis Elizondo who only really came out originally saying 'we see strange things'. This is high stakes, the motherload level heart-of-governement disclosure: either ufology as it is understood by ufologists is real or it 100% isn't. We're going to find out, soon.

By testifying in this way they're effectively trying to FORCE the governement to fess up one way or another. Either these guys are bullshit artists or they aint. They can't spin this ambiguity forever, and if that was the intent this only makes that less likely. Hardly the actions of grifters looking to surf the wave of ambiguity for an early retirement.

You might disagree. Good, skepticism is good. But don't pretend there is zero argument just because you can't conceptualise it or approve of it. There are plenty of valid logical reasons, him being under oath is another one, why Grusch's testimony is game changing and exceptional. To pretend otherwise is just an opinion that ignores the facts.

bob lazar is 100% lying. you can tell if you watch his body language.

Thanks for the good reply. I think you are probably right it is more a cultural thing which explains the U.S. obsession with UFOs. Good points. It's interesting though one of the most well documented military sightings actually occured in your country.
https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna32451823
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rendle...orest_incident

But I agree for sure the history and culture has a lot to do with civlian hoaxes and fake gurus just making money off the stuff like Steven Grier Jeremy Corbell etc. Yeah it is strange how the UFO's seem to show up more in the U.S. more than any other country.

It's definitely a global phenomena. We're just sseeing it through a Western lens.


Brazil. Mexico. Canada. Norway. Italy. France. Russia. China. Africa. Australia. Japan. All have famous cases and ufology movements.

I really want this to be real

Yeah, but how many cases? I know about the Zimbabwee school one. But that's like one case or so per country. One or two cases per country ot even 5 isn't a lot in history. Be skeptical of these "film producer" stories. The best evidence is a military ranking person and documents. There is plenty of that but it discredits the movement talking about these hoaxes like the newest Las Vegas hoax and unsubstantiated witnesses coming forward that aren't verified

Other good evidence is multiple eyewitnesses and simultaneous radar tracking

Loads.


France

https://www.newscientist.com/article...its-ufo-files/

Australia

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/80392...ist/index.html

Brazil

https://old.reddit.com/r/UFOs/commen..._just_started/

Seems to be the same type of activity wherever you look. Obviously getting good stats out of China is unrealistic but there have been droves of stuff coming out of Russia. Plus there are other limiting factors which distort the figures like cultural taboos, authoritarianism and poorer less tech developed countries just having much fewer official or reliable avenues to collate and report to at all.

I believe they got something at Roswell but it's hard for me to believe this latest guy on the story. If they got these craft and even bodies dead or alive how could they know FOR SURE they are extraterrestial like from another planet? Unless there is a log in the craft that says " this craft is from X star system" or a dying alien says im from X planet they wouldn't be able to prove that. Even if the being said it. Unless they are in constant contact with living aliens who communicate with them in some channel i dont see how that part is verifiable. The scientific approach is to say we have unidentified craft and biologic material. On coast to coast w Art Bell he interviewed a guy in the 90s with a heavy voice filter who claimed the bodies "were like a petri dish". The bodies were like synthetic biologic material. Made in a lab. You dont send yourself on dangerous trips first. You send robots like we did with Mars.

You might be interested in this then. Someone posted these on reddit. First some total random commented under a Grusch youtube video the following:






Obviously could be total BS, but interesting them stressing that Grusch is not saying 'alien', only 'non-human', as you are saying Jup. Even Corso thought the Roswell greys were robots/clones.


And here is Lue Elizondo talking about 'Zodiac' on one of his podcasts a while back.



I mean at a certain point people just larp around with public information and urban legends bloom from tiny seeds on the tinternet but equally sometimes these snippets end up being genuine too. Anonymity works both ways fortunately/unfortunately.

No you haven't. You're basically like Luckbox claiming media coverage on ufos is "different" somehow, while refusing to specify how. You're claiming Grusch's claims are somehow different but not showing how with validity. Grusch claimed to have talked to some people, so his claims are no different/significant than previous claims. It's not corroborative evidence, it's just other claims.

Corso was a LT Colonel. An army officer just like Grusch and Richard Doty. Lazar claimed to have worked at Area 51 just as Doty claimed to be part of a group that dealt with crashed alien craft. In the absence of proof, Grusch is currently no different. And Grusch's complaint is alleged harassment he received after making his claims, so even if it's stated there's "something" to his claims, this could be just re the harassment.

I'm currently going with they are actually bs artists. If proof emerges I'll happily change my mind as this would be the biggest development in human history. But currently I'm sceptical and calling bool-sheeit.

Claims- especially claims with sfa to back 'em up- aren't compelling arguments at all.
So I reiterate that this isn't especially big news.

Jasus, ya think???

I think some segments of the UFO community have speculated that the "extraterrestrials" are actually from another dimension/reality, so that's possibly who he's pandering to.
This could be simply disinformation, like Doty (and I suspect Corso) engaged in, for more grounded reasons, which again were covered itt. Have China & Russia waste billions on R&D on what's basically a snipe hunt.

Claims re Zodiac are no different than claims re MJ-12

Outside the US, I think Brazil and England had the higher number of cases but am not 100% certain. The military could very well have their own agenda with such claims

Yeah, pretty much. The military can offer quite a fulfilling career to officers with the right stuff. An old college friend of mine commanded large Royal Navy warships, then UK Joint Helicopter Command, then went on to a high command post in NATO. (Not all desk work, as he was at NATO HQ in Kabul when it came under a 24-hour rocket-grenade siege by the Taliban.) But you can imagine what sort of officer gets sidelined into Project 'Are There Fairies At The Bottom Of The Garden?' I mean it's the military, you can't just fire them, and that kind of thing is somewhere to put them till their time runs out.