Those charts are difficult for me to read the fine print. but the first one seems to show that the percentage of people "Overall" who trust the FBI quite a bit or a lot, totals about 46%. But then the percentage of Democrats, Republicans, and Independents who give the same level of support is lower than that in all cases, which doesn't seem to add up.


But now I just noticed that the horizontal bars are all of different lengths, and some go beyond the 100% level. Whoever made this chart either didn't know what he was doing or was being deliberately deceptive. I don't think those results should be deemed indicative of anything without seeing the actual numbers.

I doubt the majority of Americans know who FBI Director Wray is or what his political history is. The majority of Americans believe what their eyes and ears tell them, and that is the FBI and DOJ in 2022 increasingly operates as the political police apparatus of the Democratic Party. And their relative treatment of BLM and Jan 6 is one of many pieces of evidence supporting this argument. And like I said, the majority of these people dont watch Tucker. His rating are magnitudes too low for that to be the case.

Also, in Portland there was an "insurrection" specifically against the federal govt that lasted for months on end that the local authorities refused to cooperate in combating. You couldn't get more federal than that jurisdiction wise. And the relevant federal prosecutors very quietly dropped the vast majority of charges stemming from said insurrection, even against insurrectionists that were convicted of violent crimes against federal officers. And this is in very stark contrast to their treatment of Jan 6th insurrectionists.

A little trust, Quite a bit of trust, A lot of trust...
all total well above 50% across the board.

From 80% to 67% in the top chart and 82% to 68% in chart 2.


And the dems controlling them?
I don't think so, even though trump thought so and tried.

You are missing the part where Dems/liberals are the group that has high trust for the FBI/DOJ. That is a very important piece of the puzzle. And those liberals that dont trust these institutions, the main source of their distrust is that they dont discriminate enough against Republicans. If you dont believe this you should check out the Merrick Garland thread in Unstuck. The entire basis of their criticism is political persecution of Republicans needs to be more aggressive (for legitimate cause in their opinion of course).

I know it isn't convenient to the narrative, so you guys are going are going to do the raised by wolves routine. But a 3rd grade level analysis of the existing data makes it clear that generally Democrats/liberals feel the FBI/DOJ aligns with them politically, and the rest of the country does not.

Maybe this is an illogical and incorrupt assumption, but nevertheless it is the assumption most of Americans across the political spectrum are making.

when have I ever supported the FBI? thats just an insane lie to say something like that.

and no, ofc Im not a liberal bc words have meaning. your views are much closer to "liberal" than mine.

I guess I wrote that poorly. My apologies. I didn't mean to insinuate you and Luckbox are liberals. My point is that what we call "liberals" in American political parlance dont have particularly traditional liberal positions.

But yeah, the fact that self described liberals (not you) are pretty much the only group that supports the FBI/DOJ shows the bizarre state of partisan US political identity.

I live in Portland and know well what happened here. I don't support the actions of protestors against the federal courthouse, but it is nowhere near the magnitude or goals of the Jan 6 insurrection. Basically protestors threw things at the courthouse building, and unsuccessfully tried to set it on fire a few times, and then fought the federal agents who were there to defend the building. It is also true that after an original minor effort, the Portland government officials didn't offer backup to the federal agents, but I don't know what that has to do with anything.

Regardless, even if the Portland violent protestors / rioters would have been successful, the most that could have happened would have been that one federal courthouse building, which was currently seeing very little use due to Covid-related shutdowns (with most employees working from home) would have been completely shut down for awhile. If the Jan 6 whoevers had been successful, the clear loser of the Presidential election would have been illegitimately installed, and the Vice President and members of Congress would have likely been killed. One of these results would have been orders of magnitude worse for the country as a whole than the other.

I do believe that the federal prosecutors went too easy on the Portland rioters, but I also think they have gone way too easy on the Jan 6 participants.
Personally I think that every one of the violent mob who entered the Capitol should have been convicted of high treason and executed. Instead, I see that the woman who stole Nancy Pelosi's laptop and bragged about it live on the internet has "home arrest" for punishment, but is still allowed to go to her job, and this weekend was allowed to go the local Renaissance Faire. Yep, they've sure been treating those people hashly, huh?

It's only "political persecution" because blatant lawbreaking is now part of the Republican platform. Like we have Trump, on tape trying to get an election official in Georgia to rig an election for him. Do we have to ignore it because Trump is a Republican and that's part of their platform now? Or do we investigate it as we would have with 0 controversy 10, 20 or 30 year ago?

^^^ or as the GOP would scream and demand if this was Obama or Hillary of Adam Schiff or Pelosi, who had done what Trump did?


The fact is the GOP candidates know their agenda will involve constantly breaking laws for some time to come, unless and until they can change those laws. So in the same way Trump knew he needed to get out front and discredit the Press, because he knew they would report on the bad and illegal things he would do, the GOP and Trump are focused on the FBI for the same reason.

Historically having the FBI investigate a politician would cost them with the base and might require them retire. Now in the GOP it is a rally point and a way to raise your flagging numbers.

I wouldn't get too hung up on analyzing one chart from one poll. This is a consistent phenomenon that has been around for a few years. Here is another poll from 2018. I dont know for sure, but my sense is the way the federal government handled the Russian collusion investigation is what really got the ball rolling where the majority of Americans (including A LOT of people who didn't vote for Trump or register Republican) started to become suspicious the enforcement arm of the federal bureaucracy was becoming a Democratic Party aligned political police apparatus. And obviously many high profile events since have just reinforced that suspicion.

Like I said, you a part of a group that believes if there is political bias in the FBI/DOJ it is completely warranted. Just understand in the country as a whole this is a minority opinion. Which is a problem just as big as the Trump problem IMO. And you shouldn't just hand waive it away and blame Fox News and Tucker, because most of these people dont watch Fox News.

gotcha...thanks.

heres my take, first I think you massively underestimate the FBI and state violence, enforcement, surveillance of far left groups. I mean, the Feds were straight up disappearing people off the streets of Portland (remember the unmarked vans?). Many of the organizers from Ferguson are dead with multi-bullet suicides.

and ofc this is leaving out the civil rights era other than to say, I really dont think things are all that different.

but I dont think BLM and the Floyd or Ferguson protesters can be called liberals.

bc liberals do believe in the FBI and the state. and they support it just as much as the conservatives do. idealogically, American liberals and American conservatives are very close. esp when it comes to Law Enforcement (and War).

FBI isnt gonna go after Jon Stewart and the pussyhat protesters. they will absolutely go after anything to the left of that. this is the first time that the FBI has gone after the right so its jarring to you.

57% think investigations of Trump should continue. You’re completely misreading the data. Just because someone says they don’t trust the FBI doesn’t mean they trust republicans when they say these investigations are political. A much stronger majority than any person or institution’s approval supports the investigations based on the public evidence. A small minority agrees with you that these specific investigations are political persecution.

https://www.axios.com/2022/08/21/tru...tigations-poll

You are confusing political bias with an organisation e.g. the FBI carrying out its function.

If republicans are breaking the law, and the FBI is attempting to mitigate that, that mitigation is not political, its simply the system working as intended.

Actually I don't get how anyone would blame the FBI for the Mar-a-lago raid. That's like blaming the footsoldiers for an invasion. The raid was approved by the Attorney General (who of course is at least somewhat political) and a federal judge. I don't think it matter whether or not anyone in the FBI supported the raid, they're just following orders.

The Trump Derps has expectations that the Police and FBI will stand down and do the right thing when given orders by the Deep State to act against 'MAGA' (read White people) interests.

That is why they showed such a deep sense of betrayal on Jan 6th and again, in this FBI search, because they feel these people need to defy the Deep State ad stand down. Many of the MC and upper middleclass Trump supporters who flew in gave voice to it on Jan6th proclaiming they would not be arrested or go to Jail as they were "white"! They knew what they were doing was against the law but they expected the police and prosecutors not to act upon it as historically that has often been the case.

Imagine being a mod and ignoring all these lies you post. What was the point in asking you for evidence for one of your many lies, banning you for a few weeks after you did not deliver and now it's back to normal....

Where is the lie? The data, or my interpretation of the data? I assure you that there has been a number of polls on this issue attacking it from slightly different angles and they all show the same trend. Republicans and independents (who combined make up over 50% of respondents to polls and by proxy the majority of Americans) generally dont approve of how they perceive the FBI/DOJ has been politicized and Democrats/liberals do approve. And I assure you that my interpretation of these results in genuine. So where is the lie?

I am not sure you really understand what the meaning of "lying" is.

Again, whether it is actually true the DOJ/FBI have become too partisan Democrat is a different issue (I personally believe they have, but that isn't relevant). The point is the majority of Americans are losing faith in these institutions (justified or not) and that is important.

Yawn, the ole "Liar demands you explain his lies to him so he can say nuh uh in the end".

Also: My interpretation of your posts is "Lies and garbage". And I assure you that my interpretation of your posts is genuine.

Of course it never gets mentioned that the FBI has arrested and charged nearly if not all individuals the organisation suspected of giving it false information that led to the investigation about Trump and Russia.

Also of course the fact that Muller found that Russia had interfered in the election "in sweeping and systematic fashion", and outlined 10 times when Mr Trump possibly impeded the investigation is ignored by trumptwats.

Are you able to recognize it may be a party platform to shake the "faith in these institutions" and thus there is really nothing that can be done to rectify that short of driving those intent on doing it out of power?

You have top GOp officials still refusing to say Joe Biden won the election fair and square and just repeating 'he is the POTUS', while then saying 'people have doubts about election integrity', gaslighting that they are not the ones causing those doubts and pretending that their calls for yet another investigation is not designed to just cause ever more doubts.

It’s a lie that a majority views the investigations into Trump snd Jan 6 as “ partisan persecution”. A strong majority supports them.

Do you have data that supports this, or is the way this works is we can say anything we want and present it as incontrovertible fact as long as the mods ideologically align with our opinions?

I recall seeing a poll that if you focus squarely on trumps putative role in Jan 6th you get 57% approval, which is nowhere near a strong majority.

But most polls tracking fbi/doj approval show under 50% overall approval for both entities, with only liberals/democrats supporting. And I showed data to support this.

Lol…57% nowhere near a strong majority!