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Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread)

08-19-2022 , 10:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson
OK, buddy.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_David_McAtee

On June 4, videographic analysis by The New York Times' visual investigations unit of surveillance and bystander videos from four separate angles reconstructed a synchronized chronology of the sequence of events leading to McAtee's death.[8] This analysis concluded that police first fired at least two pepper balls from outside McAtee's restaurant toward his relatives and him, in violation of LMPD policy requiring pepper balls be shot at the ground in front of the crowd (rather than into the crowd) during crowd dispersal operations, and that "law enforcement officials shall avoid the use of force" when trying to disperse non-violent crowds.[8][21] One shot hit and pierced a bottle on an outdoor table, knocking it to the ground, and the other struck the doorway, almost hitting McAtee's niece in the head. At the time, the pepper ball shots may not have been distinguishable from other ammunition.[8] In response, McAtee grabbed his gun and appears to have fired.[8] The Guardian wrote that the video shows that McAtee "raises his arm in the air", which is "a motion consistent with firing a warning shot".[22]

On June 9, the governor's office said that lab tests from the case concluded that McAtee was killed from a single gunshot by a National Guard soldier.[15] In total, two officers and two guardsmen fired at least 19 shots in McAtee's direction.[15][16] McAtee was determined to have fired twice with a 9 mm pistol.[15] According to officials, McAtee's shots prompted law enforcement's return fire, which killed him.[15][23] The officers involved in the shooting were identified as Katie Crews and Austin Allen[24] while the identities of the soldiers were not initially released


bad example. he misread nonlethal ammunition and fired 2 shots. the whole thing is a sad misunderstanding. f man f cops. how can they shoot a man who is waving his hands up?

why didn't Biden just dissolve the protests?

oh wait! trump was president at the time right? so trump should have done it. then all posts there are faulty.

fml. these protests happened in 2020 and Biden got sworn in in jan 2021.

my bad.

Last edited by washoe; 08-19-2022 at 10:21 AM.
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 10:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tame_deuces
You are both circling the same issue, albeit from very different angles.

Even democratic countries already have wide-ranging powers to intervene into the right to assembly. This usually in the name of public safety.

I'm very much opposed to these powers being expanded upon, being made easier to use or requiring less justification.
Obviously this.
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 12:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tame_deuces
You are both circling the same issue, albeit from very different angles.

Even democratic countries already have wide-ranging powers to intervene into the right to assembly. This usually in the name of public safety.

I'm very much opposed to these powers being expanded upon, being made easier to use or requiring less justification.
All you have to do is look at Canada were the PM invoked the emergencies act over a trucker protest. It was within his power
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 12:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lozen
All you have to do is look at Canada were the PM invoked the emergencies act over a trucker protest. It was within his power
"Why can't these Covid denying nazi pigs block the roads as they please, waaaaaaaaaaah. Trudeau bad man!"
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 12:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by InJuiceWeTrust
"Why can't these Covid denying nazi pigs block the roads as they please, waaaaaaaaaaah. Trudeau bad man!"

I never commented here if what he did was a good thing or a bad thing Ill leave that for the Canada thread. As well one Nazi flag at a protest which the protesters told the person to leave and you have the whole group as Nazi's just as many say all Trump voters are racist
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 12:34 PM
lozen do you actually do that exercise from your avator? whats it called?
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 01:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by washoe
lozen do you actually do that exercise from your avator? whats it called?
Absolutely not and never will be able to
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 02:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lozen
Absolutely not and never will be able to

ahh thanks, I was always wondering if that was your fav exercise. I think you are being too modest and you could do it btw, it only takes practice.

Spoiler:



zlatan is doing them too.





Last edited by washoe; 08-19-2022 at 02:06 PM.
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tame_deuces
I don't think the Fox News article was a good, but I don't really doubt that the economic damages that it mentions actually happened.

I think it was convenient for a lot of pundits and GOP politicians to pretend protests were riots, and I think it became inconvenient for a lot of democrat politicians to talk about the riots at all.

Personally I suspect the civil unrest had little to do with party politics or people's views on liberalism or conservatism.
Trolly seems to overlook that many of the BLM protesters and rioters were white, so it's hardly a case of blaming solely the black protesters and rioters.
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08-19-2022 , 07:18 PM
Many were white, where did the money go, where did the money come from, they're a hate group, what's with their hair, how many were from out of town, how many were criminals, why is their skin diffferent than mine, why they trying to ruin amurica?

So many limitless, deflective questions. Really any question except the ones that address grievances, bias and the like. Oh btw do not bring up double standards bc that's woke bro. Lol @ woke trauma and triggers but that's another post
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08-19-2022 , 08:32 PM
1% of the gazillion BLM PROTESTS were violent so that's better than 100% of 1/6

a special kind of dumb
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 08:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bundy5
Sorry there needs to be an encroachment on that. Usually I would agree with you but when violent riots start to become more normalised behaviour and tolerated more by city officials you know something needs to be done about the right to assembly in general. It is yet another one of those examples where the minorities spoil it for the majority that do the right thing when protesting.
Sure, but Jan 6 is completely different from opportunistic rioting during a protest. It was an inherently violent cause and numerous people ho'v been convicted have told us they were motivated by the big lie.
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08-19-2022 , 11:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by natediggity
1% of the gazillion BLM PROTESTS were violent so that's better than 100% of 1/6

a special kind of dumb
It’s typical on Republican side .
1% covid risk is meaningless , 1% of studies denying human are responsible for climate changes means everything .
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-19-2022 , 11:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by natediggity
1% of the gazillion BLM PROTESTS were violent so that's better than 100% of 1/6

a special kind of dumb
Math checks out
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08-19-2022 , 11:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by washoe
alright, so here is how I count things and imo things could and should be counted.

trump jan 6th riot cost 4 people their lifes, which is bad.

Biden, on the other hand didn't do anything to stop the riots efficiently neither, and it cost many more people their lifes. probably more than 100s of deaths.

trump riots, (which he could have stopped)= 4 deaths

<

Biden riots (which he could have stopped)= 100s of deaths

both men didn't do anything to stop jackshit, due to politics. shame on both.
When were Biden riots?
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-20-2022 , 06:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lozen
I never commented here if what he did was a good thing or a bad thing Ill leave that for the Canada thread.
LOL, "it does not count if it's in another thread" is some wicked ****.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lozen
As well one Nazi flag at a protest which the protesters told the person to leave and you have the whole group as Nazi's just as many say all Trump voters are racist
"I did not see many/no nazis at this protest".

"Not all of the Trump voting racists are racist"

From "The Right Wing Compendium of deflections" page 1.
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08-20-2022 , 08:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nutella virus
Many were white, where did the money go, where did the money come from, they're a hate group, what's with their hair, how many were from out of town, how many were criminals, why is their skin diffferent than mine, why they trying to ruin amurica?

So many limitless, deflective questions. Really any question except the ones that address grievances, bias and the like. Oh btw do not bring up double standards bc that's woke bro. Lol @ woke trauma and triggers but that's another post
Many were white so the point remains. Some movements attract bad elements and protests can attract opportunists. The movement itself might be addressing important or indeed crucial issues and protests turning violent doesn't diminish the issue any more than the issue diminishes the loss of small business owners or justifies the destruction of property and assaults.
Condemning rioting, looting and assault is valid critique of the behaviour of bad elements movements and protests attract, Doesn't lessen the issue or movement itself.

Critique that some elements of BLM are far left isn't necessarily baseless critique either and again said critique doesn't nullify the relevance of issues regarding the Black American community.
Such issues need to be viewed in a nuanced, rather than absolutist manner.
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08-21-2022 , 02:58 PM
Jam 6 was so ****ed, the Vice President didn’t trust his secret service detail and refused to get in the car with them as they were going to take him to a secure location which would have kept him from certifying the election results.

I do not recall any BLM protests or riots having anything close to this effect on the executive branch.
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08-21-2022 , 03:50 PM
I wasn't aware anyone was comparing the two as if one one-upped the other and while some BLM protests had riots, Jan 6 was terrorism, so I don't think a comparison can be made anyway as they're two different things.
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08-21-2022 , 04:21 PM
My quote in the OP was responding to

Quote:
Most people at trumps speech had/have zero interest in attacking the capital or the govt just in the same way that some at the blm riots weren't interested in killing or attacking other people or destroying property. I think the main difference is that for a year the blm riots were primarily about violence and a much higher % of the blm protestor/rioters supported violence where a relatively small % of the 1/6 protestor/rioters supported the violence.
That gets it exactly wrong as Jan 6 was terrorism and a pro violence event inherently.
Riots vs protests (excised from Trump-thread) Quote
08-21-2022 , 06:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tame_deuces
Right to assembly is a cornerstone in any democracy. If you start encroaching on that, you might as well recycle the ballot boxes.
All the assemblies I care about were banned for about a year and a half for Covid; seems like it has been proven that the Right To Assembly no longer exists in this country as a fundamental right. I don't think that "protests" should be protected any more strongly than other types of assembly.
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08-21-2022 , 07:59 PM
My biggest problem with Jan 6th is the cynical (IMO) manner the federal govt has handled it. With their vigorous prosecution of the Jan 6 protestors/rioters compared to their relative agnosticism towards the left wing political violence that did happen (and an agnosticism towards left wing crime in general), a majority of Americans (including myself) feel the enforcement arm of the federal government has been weaponized by the Democratic Party to attack their political adversaries and give their allies a pass. And this is a big problem.

https://nydailypaper.com/five-polls-...gn1490ito1490/





Approval for the FBI and DOJ is currenty below 50%, which means A LOT of people who didn't vote for Trump, register Republican or watch Tucker Carlson feel this way. And IMO this widespread distrust (completely earned IMO) in such an important institution is just a big a danger to our system/nation as Trump.
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08-21-2022 , 08:15 PM
The BLM protests being talked about happened mostly in the summer of 2020, during the Trump administration. The head of the FBI is still a Trump appointee. Do you really think that the Democratic Party is in control of the FBI, and was even in control during the Trump administration?

The violence during the BLM protests was certainly reprehensible, but really was no different than riots that have gone on in various parts of the country on and off over many years, and for the most part should be under local jurisdiction. The Jan 6 actions were an attempt at overthrowing the federal government, and included calls for the murder of the Vice President and several members of Congress. I think that is a much more appropriate place for federal law enforcement agencies to be concentrating.
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08-21-2022 , 08:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chillrob
The BLM protests being talked about happened mostly in the summer of 2020, during the Trump administration. The head of the FBI is still a Trump appointee. Do you really think that the Democratic Party is in control of the FBI, and was even in control during the Trump administration?

The violence during the BLM protests was certainly reprehensible, but really was no different than riots that have gone on in various parts of the country on and off over many years, and for the most part should be under local jurisdiction. The Jan 6 actions were an attempt at overthrowing the federal government, and included calls for the murder of the Vice President and several members of Congress. I think that is a much more appropriate place for federal law enforcement agencies to be concentrating.
Not just me, but the vast majority of Americans believe this. Self described liberals (cue Luckbox or Victor claiming they aren't real liberals) are pretty much the only group that favorably views the FBI. Do you think that would be the case if they believed the Republican Party controlled it?

The only logical conclusion from polls is that the majority of Americans, across the entire political spectrum, feel the Democrat Party controls the FBI.
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08-21-2022 , 08:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNoGod2
Not just me, but the vast majority of Americans believe this. Self described liberals (cue Luckbox or Victor claiming they aren't real liberals) are pretty much the only group that favorably views the FBI. Do you think that would be the case if they believed the Republican Party controlled it?

The only logical conclusion from polls is that the majority of Americans, across the entire political spectrum, feel the Democrat Party controls the FBI.
Well, then I would have to conclude that the majority of Americans are illogical, if they believe that the Democrat Party can control the FBI while under a Republican administration and a Trump-appointed director.

If the Democrats can manage to control the FBI under those situations, then I would think the blame should be laid at the incompetence of Donald Trump and his administration, if they can't even control their own appointees and agencies.

I really do doubt that majority of Americans think the FBI is "controlled" by any political party. I am pretty sure that most members of the FBI are people who do their jobs as directed by their superiors, without consideration of their own political beliefs. But again, if you follow the chain of command all the way to the top, you reach a Trump appointee.

Do you personally believe FBI Director Wray is under the control of the Democratic Party? If so, does that imply some level of incompetence on the part of the Republicans who nominated and confirmed him to the office?
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