Um, you're the one making the claim that they're neo nazis, onus on you to back that claim up, not on me to disprove it for you, that's not how it works. I already linked them condemning violence racism and neo nazism.

So now you show me yours.

So now it's gone to them being neo nazis to them possibly plotting terrorist acts or a coup huh? Wow oops I mean okay.

No offence but don't waste my time with guilt by association fallacies.Back up your claim that they're neo nazis with something better than that please, thanks.

This thread was created because I wanted to cut down on the noise in the Floyd thread, and creating a containment thread seemed more likely to succeed than asking you to stop posting, deleting everything, or whatever else.

Of course you are not obligated to actually keep posting on this topic, and if it devolves into complete uselessness I can just lock it.

I'm just saying it doesn't pass the smell test. I'm not going to go researching this, I don't care that much.

Doubt that, but it wouldn't surprise me if they partook of a little drugs or arms trafficking here and there. From the limited info I've read, they sound like a 1%er motorcycle gang by any other name.

Seeing as I got my very own call out thread I'd like to clarify a couple of things

I never said Trump wasn't a racist and on three occasions opined it's quite possible he is one.

My issue was with the false actual quote attributed to him, the backpedaling from that position to amend that he really meant it when the quote couldn't be provided and the unsound reasoning given to justify this as well as the summary dismissal of pertinent counterpoints against the unsound reasoning.

On an objective level I think it's quite possible Trump is a racist.
On a personal subjective level I suspect he's probably as opposed to possibly a racist but not for the reasons you all think he is, as in the ones given so far but for reasons of my own.

However this doesn't justify the falsehood that he called for the murder of African Americans on twitter or the falsehood re his both sides comment. And I would appreciate better arguments than the ones given and non repetition of already rejected points such as use of the word thugs when that was already counterpointed a bunch of times over as was the both sides comment. This was simply hand waved away so if nobody is willing to engage in proper honest discourse then we'll leave it at that.

But again even if I personally suspect he's more than likely a racist, again for reasons of my own, it doesn't justify falsehoods in order to peddle a narrative. I will have no truck with false narratives as I've seen the damage they can do in criminal cases, which is a topic in itself. I won't be a part of such things.

So hopefully that clears things up regarding my position and what I had an issue with to begin with.

I would be interested to hear what your reasons are for thinking Trump is probably a racist.

cv, at least when it comes to racists, seems to believe that words speak louder than actions. "See, they SAID they're not racist, so pay no attention to the fact that they marched with Nazis, they totally don't support those Nazis, despite acting in a supporting role for them. See, he SAID he was chasing burglars, so despite the fact that there was no reason we should believe him, we must conclude that was a reasonable explanation for what happened despite it looking like they ran down and murdered a black guy over nothing."

That Larry King says trump is not a racist is interesting. Then it must be true? I was leaning trump is a racist too,
But this makes me reconsider.

I mean, these guys just look like your friendly neighbourhood suburban dads to me. Probably dress up like Santa at Christmas (and like Arnie out of commando every other day).

Some trump supporters scare the crap out of me.
And I don't like what republicans or the far right stand for in general.
Just wanted to point out that donald as stupid he might seem sometimes might not be a rascist.

technically, not sure trump has made that many overtly racist comments. hateful, ignorant, xenophobic comments for sure.

in spirit and tone though, trump's comments are highly racist..... basically, dog whistles for white nationalist types

He had that Steve Bannon guy as his chief strategist and Bannon is a much more valid case of a person denying they're white nationalist that doesn't pass the smell test. Here is a guy who endorsed the BNP, EDL and if that were't enough the Le Front National/French National Front with a pep talk that apparently got a standing ovation from Le Xenophobes.
The NAACP expressed appreciation for Trump's condemnation of neo nazis but requested Bannon's removal on account of considering him "a well known white supremacist leader".
There's also reports that Bannon allegedly suggested the both sides comment although I can't attest to the veracity/lack thereof of this or not yet anyway.

"Ah but Corpus" I hear you all cry "surely President Trump can't be blamed for picking one bad apple I mean c'mon brah"

Well it's not just one. Trump also had Sebastian Gorka as his assistant. Gorka is imo undoubtedly a white supremacist and probable anti Semite who kinda makes Bannon look warm and fuzzy by comparison. A former Hungarian gov official he supported the Historical Order of Vitez, who according to the US State Dept were "under the direction of the Nazi government of Germany" during World War II.
https://fam.state.gov/searchapps/vie...l#M302_7_4_B_7
Plus they gave his dad their title due to his opposition to the Glorious worker's utopia of the Soviet Union during their occupation of Hungary. He also got a Vitez medal from exiles. Which Gorka wears...in memory of his dear old dad natch.(and not cuz he's a nazi)

And not content with this Gorka also endorsed the Magyar Gárda (Hungarian Guard), a nasty little anti Semitic neo Fascist paramilitary group that theHugarian fgov proscribed in 2009

And not content with these instances of douchebaggery he was also detained for trying to bring a gun through a US airport in 2016. He also faced firearm/ammo charges in Hungary.

"But Corpus"I hear you all cry again, "surely this is just smears by the lie-brul media against Stevie and Seb" to which I reply "Nope, they're supremacists and probable actual nazi sympathizers"

All of which begs the interesting question, wtf is Trump doing surrounding himself with neo goosesteppers?

Then there was the lawsuit by black tenants regarding alleged bias by Trump due to them being black tenants.
So that's why I suspect Trump is a probable racist. I also consider these far more valid arguments for him being a racist than his use of the word thugs to describe rioters in general and his both sides comment.

See also: Stephen Miller

I'm glad you're aware of this backstory - just so you know, so is everyone else here. Both Bannon and Gorka were discussed and criticised heavily for the reasons you enumerate and others in the prior incarnation of this forum, by the same posters who are arguing against you now.

Also, don't forget that asshat Miller, who's is still around, weaving his xenophobic little schemes in the shadows.

Edit: WN beat me to it, I was typing this as he posted.

He might be an evil businessman but not a racist.
Why does he have so many black friends being Steve Harvey etc. And voters? This is the old religion vs religion imo this has nothing to do with blacks or racism only about power.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Bannon

can't believe i'd defend trump...

but the black tenant lawsuit was from the 1970's and i believe all large NYC landlords were served with it.

trump has "so many black friends" and then 1 is listed?!?

Gosh. They must be neo nazis so, I mean look at how they dress...

Have you ever considered the possibility that they're akin to those Fiftysomethings who splurge on a Harley and think they're in a biker gang? That they're kooks who like running around the forest shooting guns and drinking beer with each other? Oddballs but harmless oddballs?

I will happily debate the issue but you need to provide more compelling arguments, sorry and support your claims with validity. Your argument is basically pig headedly insisting those militias are nazi ones despite evidence to the contrary refuting this. And sorry but that just simply doesn't wash. It's mere repetition so can be disregarded.

Despite my personal suspicions re Trump, he mostly certainly never made the actual quote attributed to him re murdering black people. Nor do I believe he meant the word thugs as a racist dog whistle due to the context. Whether you like it or not people of different races were rioting. Whether you like it or not Obama used the same term and while he got critique over it, it was nothing compared to the semi hysteria that ensues when Trump used the term.

If you're gonna hand wave away such things and willfully ignore the context then there's no point in continuing here. Not to blow my own trumpet but I actually made a more compelling argument for Trump being a racist than you did by ragging on some weirdo militias and accusing them of being nazis when there's no evidence to support this.

I also made a more compelling argument refuting the specific claims regarding his tweets and both sides comments than you did defending such falsehoods, sorry.

Debate properly please and honestly and with consistency, all of you, that's all I ask. Otherwise again, no point in continuing.

It's pointless to argue with you when you just reject evidence out of hand, like marching with Nazis, or killing black people, that most reasonable people consider very strong evidence.

CV - pretty much what Wookie said. You are rejecting all relevant context and history and focusing on specific actions and statements. It's just not interesting as far as debate is concerned. I don't disagree with you on any of your very narrowly crafted points; I just think you're missing the bigger picture.

You probably think you are doing what good lawyers do, but you're not. Your arguments are pedantic and entirely unpersuasive. Good lawyers persuade people.

Sounds like landlords in general are racist af.

I would take Trump to be a narcissist. I doubt he can be bothered to formulate any doctrinal racist views. He just doesn't give a rap about anybody who isn't Trump and doesn't suck up to Trump, and if his fans like a bit of racism that's what he'll give them (and then deny it).

He advocated for at least three actual hate groups. He called Tommy Robinson, a known UK hate peddler "The backbone of Britain" and called for his release from prison. He endorsed the Austrian Freedom Party whose first leader was an honest to God former SS officer. Another leader the happily late Jorge Haider often openly admired Third Reich policies and he referred to the nazi death camps as "punishment camps" with its implication that the people sent there to be murdered did something to deserve "punishment".

Maybe he considers them useful idiots or uses them to hide his true agenda?
Here's what he said to the French National Front:
I doubt he was including his black friends with his use of the word "we".

Trump is an evil angleshooter who luckboxed his way and binked the highbroller with 64 entries. What do you expect?

Bannon is an economic nationalist, not a white nationalist. There is a difference.

He's a grotesque buffoon and a danger to the republic and one hopes he's gone in November. If he isn't, it's not the end, but the country's affairs will assume a doomier character.