[Mod note: excised from the Trump thread...]

Is it possible to be critical of Islamic practices and institutions without being an Islamophobe?

If it is, name one public person who has gotten away with being critical without being labeled an islamophobe.

So like one public person who no individual has ever called an Islamaphobe? Basically the right wing is like this. Look, look, look, this one college kid at Oberlin called their professor an Islamophobe! Here's the YouTube! It's out of control.

Ok. Name one person that maybe a college kid called an Islamophobe, but most leftists and Muslims would say, "you know what, that is a fair critique, you're an alright guy."

I don't know why you replied to my post there. I don't see an answer to my question anywhere in this post.

Not analogous at all. Criticism of the actions of the state of Israel isn't at all criticism of the practices of Judaism. People can and do criticize the state actions of the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia all the damn time without getting called Islamophobic.

Name one person that maybe a college kid....?? Are you serious?

There's plenty of people who I guess you'd call "left" who disagree with each other over the Islamophobia or lack there of from Bill Maher, Tulsi Gabbard, Hillary Clinton and lot of other notable figures.

Grouping 'leftists' with 'Muslims' there is weird. Are you trying to say that Muslims are leftists or that leftists are the people who try to see things from other people's perspective?

For the record, although my assertion was attacked by several persons, not a single person could come up with a single example of a public person who has been critical of Islamic practices or institution who hasn't been attacked by the left as an Islamophobe for their criticism.

I mean if Bill Maher is your example, than LOL. He has been attacked a lot from the left as an Islamophobe. And I know in the previous incarnation of this site he was perceived extremely poorly for his opinions, and called a lot of mean, nasty things.

It's because it's a nonsensical point, as I and others indicated.

If you criticize praying towards Mecca or celebrating Eid, you're Islamophobic. If you criticize the brutal murder of Khashoggi, you have a basic sense of justice and humanity.

And yet,

HBO has not been boycotted, he still has his job, his slot, and his money. What exactly is the "Severe punishment" Maher has earned from a small group of people calling him an Islamaphobe again?

What if you are critical of forced marriage, honor violence, child marriage and female genital mutilation? Does that indicate you have a basic sense of justice and humanity?

The **** is it with these people and their concern over the well being of 90’s comedians.

Uh because seinfeld is the greatest comedic achievement of all time and these kids today with their youtubes and their jake pauls just don't understand the craftsmanship required to explain that airplane food sucks in a humorous way. They gots no respect!

You have to give Mahr some credit for recognizing the untapped market of mediocre Libertarian white guys who need to be told how independent they are. He never got anywhere as a comic but he was a pioneer in the art of chuffing about liberals decades before podcasts even existed.

I'll have to check Vox.

Seriously though, do you have an example of a person who has criticized just one of those things and got called Islamophobic?

We aren't theologians, what the **** are you even talking about?


One of the funniest parts of the Trumpism of reactionary thought is that they still like to call the left "snowflakes" but they also harbor grudges by proxy for getting called "mean, nasty things". For YEARS. He's never met Bill Maher, and let's be honest, he doesn't actually know what Maher said or did to get criticized.

But Kelhus' feelings are still hurt over that ****.

The constant need to look down on people not in your group is telling.

The constant need to look down on people not in your group is telling.

Sterling work being down to prove that the craftsmanship required for humour should be respected.

Mostly I only look down on progressives and dishonest people.

But why repeat yourself amirite?

You didn't answer the question, but I realize I didn't either. I can say I am very critical of the Saudi regime murdering journalists (and the administrations reaction to this). As well I feel one can (and probably should) be critical of practices such as forced marriage, honor violence, child marriage and female genital mutilation without being accused of bigotry for it. Do you have a soft spot for any of these specific topics where you think there is some argument to be made in favor of it?

Anyways, I find it interesting the way you are able to morally condemn Saudi Arabia so strongly (making sure to make the distinction you are condemning the monarchy and not the theocrats who also have tremendous power in Saudi society and are responsible for a lot of very bad things), but are very hedgy when it comes to the other topics I brought up. I think this is actually very telling, in that the way the accusation of "Islamophobia" is utilized is often very politically motivated.

I also find it a little amusing that all the usual suspects that are pretty quick to shoot me down for everything are napping this discussion out. Seems like this forum possibly has a lot of fans of forced marriage, honor violence, child marriage and female genital mutilation.

Do you know? Do you think he was being criticized fairly? Do you think he meets the standard of advocating Islamophobia?

The forced child marriage fans have no truer foe then the “actually it’s hebeophilia” sexual redistribution IDW guys.

Quit lying