Moderation Questions and General Chat Thread - Page 114 - Politics and Society -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

No such thing as a "libertarian culture".

You call yourself a libertarian (though you're not). What cultural practices do you share in common with other "libertarians" that non "libertarians" don't practice? Is there a strange dance routine you do together, do you eat only asparagus for breakfast, or what?

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05-25-2024 , 11:25 AM

#2827

ganstaman

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Ok, this is going to never end, and it's pointless. It doesn't matter if you are classifying people into racial categories, cultural categories, ethnicities, religions, or whatever -- mods are going to draw the lines where we think they are rational and reasonable to be drawn. The lines will be fuzzy. If you don't think you can figure out where the lines are, maybe just be nice in all your posts or accept that you may get banned now and then.

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05-25-2024 , 12:37 PM

#2828

Luciom

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Originally Posted by ganstaman

i am ok with that, keep in mind my only question was if saying the same things about new yorkers, or right-wing voters, or literally any other group however defined by any characteristic would be moderated the same.

can we say worse things about convicted pedophiles than about residents in Seoul? if yes why?

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05-25-2024 , 12:39 PM

#2829

jalfrezi

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I was informed elsewhere (correctly imo) that it's not racist or sexist to make derogatory remarks about Italian males wrt their driving.

There's always the thing about punching down being a necessary component of racism.

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05-25-2024 , 12:46 PM

#2830

Luciom

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I gave up my driving licence and car and live in the walkable historical center of the city because it's insane how people drive around here so I can understand what you mean

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05-25-2024 , 01:11 PM

#2831

ganstaman

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Luciom

can we say worse things about convicted pedophiles than about residents in Seoul? if yes why?

Try it and find out. We're not going to go through all the combinations until you have a complete list of who you can insult to what degree.

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05-25-2024 , 01:50 PM

#2832

rafiki

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Quote:

Originally Posted by jalfrezi

I was informed elsewhere (correctly imo) that it's not racist or sexist to make derogatory remarks about Italian males wrt their driving.

There's always the thing about punching down being a necessary component of racism.

Is that real? Who decides what is up and what is down?

Does that mean that in a place like Miami, the black population can't punch down at the hispanic population (who can in turn punch up at them)?

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05-25-2024 , 01:54 PM

#2833

jalfrezi

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Lots of grey areas of course but when it comes to racism it's pretty obvious who the people discriminated against historically are and who did the discriminating, and the second group should avoid making sweeping derogatory remarks about the first group. I'm surprised this even needs to be stated.

When it comes to black/hispanic people slating each other, I don't think that's really the same as white people slating either group because of history, but generally it's better not to make sweeping statements about large groups of people who've sufferered from discrimination imo.

Making fun of Italian drivers seems like harmless fun really.

Last edited by jalfrezi; 05-25-2024 at 02:01 PM.

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05-25-2024 , 02:07 PM

#2834

rafiki

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Originally Posted by jalfrezi

So in this system, black people CAN make the comments on whites and it's acceptable?

Jews were persecuted by Arabs for almost a 1000 years. Does that not therefor qualify?

What are the dates we use?

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05-25-2024 , 02:15 PM

#2835

Trolly McTrollson

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Originally Posted by rafiki

Try it and find out!

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05-25-2024 , 02:45 PM

#2836

jalfrezi

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Originally Posted by rafiki

I don't know why you do this rhetorical thing where you try to get someone to pin exact values on something that clearly doesn't have any, as if you can then claim victory when they don't satisfy your demand.

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05-25-2024 , 02:48 PM

#2837

rafiki

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I just don't ascribe to these concepts as being remotely universal or well thought out for that matter.

I'm going this route:

https://www.ted.com/talks/coleman_hu...olor_blindness

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05-25-2024 , 02:48 PM

#2838

Montrealcorp

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I think the problem about Luciom is thinking libertarian is solely a right wing affair …
https://study.com/academy/lesson/lib...fferences.html

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The debate of libertarians vs. liberals is rooted in their shared history as ideologies. Libertarianism today comes from the ideas of classical liberalism, a form of liberalism not categorized within liberalism as it is viewed today. However, there are times when the two ideologies still overlap and this can cause some confusion. For instance, both of them hold individual rights and liberty as central concerns.

Having some aspect of libertarians beliefs do not necessarily means u are a full fledge libertarian like Lucian think he is .

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05-25-2024 , 03:07 PM

#2839

Didace

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Quote:

Originally Posted by jalfrezi

There's always the thing about punching down being a necessary component of racism.

I disagree with this.

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05-25-2024 , 03:41 PM

#2840

chillrob

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Originally Posted by ganstaman

I think it should be easy to determine that anything said about practitioners of a particular religion has nothing to do with race or racism.

If it is not allowed to say anything negative about a religion or those belonging to that religion, that should be made clear. It certainly makes no sense to prohibit saying anything negative about only one religion in particular.

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05-25-2024 , 03:45 PM

#2841

jalfrezi

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Originally Posted by chillrob

Is a practitioner of Judaism always of the Jewish race?

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05-25-2024 , 03:45 PM

#2842

chillrob

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Quote:

Originally Posted by jalfrezi

Lots of grey areas of course but when it comes to racism it's pretty obvious who the people discriminated against historically are and who did the discriminating, and the second group should avoid making sweeping derogatory remarks about the first group. I'm surprised this even needs to be stated.

When it comes to black/hispanic people slating each other, I don't think that's really the same as white people slating either group because of history, but generally it's better not to make sweeping statements about large groups of people who've sufferered from discrimination imo.

Making fun of Italian drivers seems like harmless fun really.

It's also clear that none of those people are alive today. But you think it is fine for someone to say derogatory things about me and my sex or race just because some people who looked similar to me did some bad things in the past? But it's not ok the other way?

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05-25-2024 , 03:46 PM

#2843

jalfrezi

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I don't see where you derive that conclusion from.

But if you think it's ok for eg white people to slag off black people without the history of Europeans/Africans hanging in the air then I think you're mistaken.

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05-25-2024 , 03:49 PM

#2844

jalfrezi

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Originally Posted by chillrob

It's also clear that none of those people are alive today.?

Also, though it's irrelevant, plenty of those people are alive today.

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05-25-2024 , 03:50 PM

#2845

chillrob

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Quote:

Originally Posted by jalfrezi

Is a practitioner of Judaism always of the Jewish race?

I don't consider Jewish to be a race. I guess it is an ethnicity according to the definitions given yesterday.

Practioners of Judaism can be of any race, and I think it should be fair game to criticise them for the tenets of their religion or for bad things done in the name of Judaism.

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05-25-2024 , 03:54 PM

#2846

chillrob

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Originally Posted by jalfrezi

Also, though it's irrelevant, plenty of those people are alive today.

Not the ones who "historically" did things, which was in your statement.
I interpret that phrase to refer to times before anyone alive today was born.

There are no Americans alive today who owned slaves. There are almost none left who were old enough to be adults at the time Jim Crow was prevalent in the south, and those few will be dead within the next 10 years or so.

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05-25-2024 , 03:55 PM

#2847

jalfrezi

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There are plenty of white South Africans very much alive who exerted dominion over black people, and still do economically.

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05-25-2024 , 03:57 PM

#2848

chillrob

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Originally Posted by jalfrezi

I don't know what conclusion was referred to here.

I don't think what you mention here is ok, but it also goes the other way, and has nothing to do with history.

I don't know of any modern or historical incidences of black people being oppressed by Asians. Does that mean Asians should be allowed to say bad things about blacks?