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12-19-2023 , 04:37 PM

#10026

David Sklansky

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Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 17,206

Quote:

Originally Posted by grizy

But part of being a liberal state is giving up some safety for freedom.

What you and Ben Franklin don't realize is how small the amount of safety the average person is willing to give up for that freedom.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 04:40 PM

#10027

microbet

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Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 57,077

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Sklansky

What you and Ben Franklin don't realize is how small the amount of safety the average person is willing to give up for that freedom.

It's more about fear than safety. You know people are wildly irrational about safety and inconsistent in evaluating risks and adjusting behavior.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 04:41 PM

#10028

metsandfinsfan

banned

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 159,821

Quote:

Originally Posted by 57 On Red

No, you're thinking of the UN Partition Plan, which assigned quite a large area of Palestine (larger than the suggested bounds of 'Israel') to the Arabs.

And then the arabs asked for Armistice lines in 49 and said the actual borders would be decided by ear

Quote

12-19-2023 , 04:43 PM

#10029

metsandfinsfan

banned

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 159,821

Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

It's more about fear than safety. You know people are wildly irrational about safety and inconsistent in evaluating risks and adjusting behavior.

If there was no iron dome there would be no Israel

This isn't a game

Quote

12-19-2023 , 04:45 PM

#10030

microbet

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If partition in itself didn't sow the seeds of perpetual war, the '49 lines being a lot worse than the partition plan did. In the original partition the Arab area was continuous.

Last edited by microbet; 12-19-2023 at 04:52 PM.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 04:48 PM

#10031

microbet

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Quote:

Originally Posted by metsandfinsfan

If there was no iron dome there would be no Israel

This isn't a game

There's no way this is true. For one thing, the rockets have been fired for like 4 decades and the Iron Dome is 1 decade old. For another, obviously, especially in hindsight, Israel was going to flatten Gaza at some point.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 04:52 PM

#10032

washoe

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Join Date: Oct 2019 Posts: 8,526

Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

There's no way this is true. For one thing, the rockets have been fired for like 4 decades and the Iron Dome is 1 decade old.

Hamas did not have the firepower back then.

It all started with a crazy jew blowing up about 40 muslims in a muslim mosque. Then the palestinains of course retalitated by suidice missions, blowing up buses etc, by the use of suicide bombers, mainly children and women. no rockets mainly, just bombs back then.

and then they had rockets shipped to them, by idk iran and whatnot,
which is now and 10 years ago. iron dome was not needed 10 years ago imo.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 04:57 PM

#10033

microbet

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Iron Dome supposedly intercepts 90% of rockets. The number of Israelis killed by rockets since Oct 7th is in the tens. So without the Iron Dome it would be in the hundreds.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 04:59 PM

#10034

microbet

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And Israel is going to kill 100 Palestinians for every Israeli killed, so the Iron Dome has mainly saved Palestinians.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:00 PM

#10035

washoe

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Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

hundreds.

no, hundreds of thousands.

they shoot or shot something like 4000 per minute.
per minute!!!

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:10 PM

#10036

microbet

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Quote:

Originally Posted by washoe

no, hundreds of thousands.

they shoot or shot something like 4000 per minute.
per minute!!!

Then the 10% that get through should be killing 10s of thousands.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:14 PM

#10037

microbet

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The most deadly attack on Jews in America ever was just 5 years ago in Pittsburg. How many people in Pittsburg should have been bombed to get that guy? How many of the people in the groups he associated with should be killed? Like, all the people who went to the march in Charlottesville and their families? All Trump supporters?

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:15 PM

#10038

Victor

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ofc many liberals do think that they all should be killed

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12-19-2023 , 05:29 PM

#10039

David Sklansky

Administrator

Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 17,206

Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

It's more about fear than safety. You know people are wildly irrational about safety and inconsistent in evaluating risks and adjusting behavior.

True. Now explain that to the people wo are against guns. And in favor of them.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:31 PM

#10040

metsandfinsfan

banned

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 159,821

Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

Iron Dome supposedly intercepts 90% of rockets. The number of Israelis killed by rockets since Oct 7th is in the tens. So without the Iron Dome it would be in the hundreds.

You can't be this dumb

It intercepts the ones into the highly populated areas

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:33 PM

#10041

microbet

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Quote:

Originally Posted by David Sklansky

True. Now explain that to the people wo are against guns. And in favor of them.

I've tried.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:36 PM

#10042

microbet

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Quote:

Originally Posted by metsandfinsfan

You can't be this dumb

It intercepts the ones into the highly populated areas

I doubt your apparent contention that it intercepts nearly all the ones going into populated areas (and Israel is tiny) is accurate. It expect most of the missed rockets are because the system is overwhelmed. But, I doubt there's data easily available to get this deep into it.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:37 PM

#10043

microbet

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The rocket attacks do predate the Iron Dome though. They go back at least to 2004 and they've never killed more than 2 digit numbers.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:40 PM

#10044

lozen

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How many of those rockets fired by Gaza end up falling in Gaza as well?

Or is that western propaganda?

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12-19-2023 , 05:41 PM

#10045

microbet

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Iron Dome started in 2011. In 2008 there were 2048 rockets fired and I think resulting in no deaths. In 2023 there have been about 10k rockets fired. That certainly would not have destroyed Israel if there were no Iron Dome.

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:41 PM

#10046

microbet

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Quote:

Originally Posted by lozen

How many of those rockets fired by Gaza end up falling in Gaza as well?

Or is that western propaganda?

Some. I don't know how many. Do you?
(propaganda is not synonymous with lies btw)

Quote

12-19-2023 , 05:53 PM

#10047

washoe

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Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

The rocket attacks do predate the Iron Dome though. They go back at least to 2004 and they've never killed more than 2 digit numbers.

Somthing doesnt add up with the dome youre right.

If it stops 90% and they shot 9000 rockets at it, that means 900 rockets hit. and what did they do? nothing apparently. It also doesnt do nothing when its overwhelmed, so there should be more hits.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_Dome

Quote

12-19-2023 , 06:05 PM

#10048

BOIDS

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israelis all have bomb shelters and the country has effective early warning systems. this is because they live next door to a lot of people who consider it their godly duty to murder and rape jews. so, the few rockets that get through generally land on people that are in shelters

we know however that their rockets can kill a lot of people, for example the one which landed on the palestinian hospital

Quote

12-19-2023 , 06:09 PM

#10049

Trolly McTrollson

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Quote:

Originally Posted by rafiki

In Canada when we find first nation artifacts or remains that are 500+ years old, we don't build. Whatever it is is totally stopped. That is their ancestral land. It's respected now as much as can be.

You say a few polite words, but you still take the land. The US does this too, everyone admits indigenous people were here first but no one seriously entertains giving half of Florida back to the Seminole tribe or whatever and kicking out the current residents, regardless of who was there first. We kind of accept that the people living in Miami now have a right to be there.

Last edited by Trolly McTrollson; 12-19-2023 at 06:20 PM.