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Israel/Palestine thread Israel/Palestine thread

10-12-2023 , 01:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metod Tinuviel
And I will continue to do so as long as people keep falsely claiming Israel is trying to exterminate Palestinians.
Well they just killed about 350 children.
why do they do that?
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10-12-2023 , 01:23 PM
Intent is not as important as what’s happening. Israel can claim it’s not trying to kill kids but that is irrelevant if they are killing kids. Y’all need to grow tf up. This isn’t a game. In 20 years the world will judge us for how we act today.

In 20 years your kids will ask “what was Palestine?” “What does remember Palestine mean?”
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10-12-2023 , 01:29 PM
Don't kid yourself pointless.
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10-12-2023 , 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by campfirewest
A serious question, if you were suddenly the dictator of Israel and had a free hand to create any policy you wanted, what would you do?
I would stop being an hypocrite by stopping the expansion of the colonies …
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10-12-2023 , 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by PointlessWords
Intent is not as important as what’s happening. Israel can claim it’s not trying to kill kids but that is irrelevant if they are killing kids. Y’all need to grow tf up. This isn’t a game. In 20 years the world will judge us for how we act today.

In 20 years your kids will ask “what was Palestine?” “What does remember Palestine mean?”
In 20 years a lot of the people shrugging about the impending massacre of Palestinians and the inevitable ISIS 2.0 this will create are going to pretend like they never really felt that way, just like they have with their bad takes immediately after 9/11.
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10-12-2023 , 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Karl_TheOG_Marx
"Genocide" is a more accurate word, although of course Israel WOULD eliminate all Palestinians from the area if they could (without risking continued perma-support from USA). Unless you want to tell me Bibi and the rest of the ultra-right maniacs just love that proposed two-state solution and would never blow up a Palestinian school again!

Let's make a deal. I apologize for somewhat inaccurate language, and you apologize for supporting that powerful terrorist organization known as the IDF/Israel military-industrial complex.
Israel has always has the capability to eliminate Palestine and they have never done so. Hamas has it in their charter to eliminate Israel and would do so if they had the capability. I don't support Bibi and never have. I agree he is a far right extremist and Israel would be better off with another leader.
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10-12-2023 , 02:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metod Tinuviel
Israel has always has the capability to eliminate Palestine and they have never done so. Hamas has it in their charter to eliminate Israel and would do so if they had the capability. I don't support Bibi and never have. I agree he is a far right extremist and Israel would be better off with another leader.
There's a difference between capability, desire, and what's politically acceptable. Just because they've never done it even though they technically could have doesn't mean they didn't want to (not speaking about all Israelis obviously). They've been slowly grinding away at the Palestinians for decades because that's what they could get away with without too much political fallout. Now that they've got carte blanche it looks a lot like ethnic cleansing is on the table. North Korea might want to glass the South but they know they can't get away with it. If they were suddenly the only country with nukes there's a pretty good chance South Korea wouldn't exist for very long. The U.S. could never have invaded Iraq/Afghanistan without sufficient cause, despite lots of neocons licking their chops. You better believe some of those same guys are salivating at the thought of Iran getting involved in this conflict so they'll have justification to regime change them as well.
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10-12-2023 , 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Karl_TheOG_Marx
I didn't say Israel was GOOD at it. They have yet to figure out how to stop the Palestinians from breeding. You got me. Anyway, let me know if you want a couple dozen more instances of Israel committing genocide on an oppressed population.

(extermination is the final step, Israel is not there yet, my most profound apologies for inaccurate language in describing the genocidal government of Israel)
There has never been a genocide in Palestine. Various Israeli politicians want the Palestinians to disappear, and some have stupidly suggested moving the Arabs of the West Bank to Sinai, but there has never been a genocide or anything approaching that. The Palestinian population has surged in recent decades. Israel suffers from 'proportional representation', meaning a permanent hung parliament where fringe groups always hold the balance of power, putting the (far-right religious) lunatics in charge of the asylum, but, while there has been systematic 'ethnic cleansing' in the West Bank -- irrelevant to the current situation, because Hamas couldn't care less about the West Bank, hates the Palestinian authority in the West Bank and murders its representatives wherever possible -- there hasn't been any genocide.
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10-12-2023 , 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by washoe
Well they just killed about 350 children.
why do they do that?
If you really do not understand the nature of warfare -- and Hamas very deliberately provoked a war -- then perhaps it is time you did.
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10-12-2023 , 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by King Spew
Stop this line of discussion please immediately. Doesn't belong ITT
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10-12-2023 , 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by 57 On Red
If you really do not understand the nature of warfare -- and Hamas very deliberately provoked a war -- then perhaps it is time you did.
What if Hamas was responding to Israeli provocation
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10-12-2023 , 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by PointlessWords
What if Hamas was responded to Israeli provocation
This lead to nowhere .
They both guilty of it depending which point in time u chose to start from .
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10-12-2023 , 03:29 PM
the Egypts back Hamas. What about them?

Last edited by washoe; 10-12-2023 at 03:38 PM.
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10-12-2023 , 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Montrealcorp
This lead to nowhere .
They both guilty of it depending which point in time u chose to start from .
since when are they doing this?

5000 B.C.? right? what year exacly?
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10-12-2023 , 04:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metod Tinuviel
And I will continue to do so as long as people keep falsely claiming Israel is trying to exterminate Palestinians.
The attempts at moral equivalence by some of the posters here are ridiculous.
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10-12-2023 , 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Karl_TheOG_Marx
The support of Israel by the US' military-industrial complex seems directly relevant to the topic of the thread. Where else do you think they're getting these insane weapons from? I guess focusing on the evil of the US military ITSELF is kind of a tangent...
Yeah your musings certainly don't sound like whataboutism at all....
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10-12-2023 , 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Bubble_Balls
There's a difference between capability, desire, and what's politically acceptable. Just because they've never done it even though they technically could have doesn't mean they didn't want to (not speaking about all Israelis obviously). They've been slowly grinding away at the Palestinians for decades because that's what they could get away with without too much political fallout. Now that they've got carte blanche it looks a lot like ethnic cleansing is on the table. North Korea might want to glass the South but they know they can't get away with it. If they were suddenly the only country with nukes there's a pretty good chance South Korea wouldn't exist for very long. The U.S. could never have invaded Iraq/Afghanistan without sufficient cause, despite lots of neocons licking their chops. You better believe some of those same guys are salivating at the thought of Iran getting involved in this conflict so they'll have justification to regime change them as well.
Translation: Israel bad.
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10-12-2023 , 04:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by washoe
since when are they doing this?

5000 B.C.? right? what year exacly?
Doing what exactly ?
Each camp can enumerated actions made by their opposite, a justification on why they used bad actions , depending which date u start to look at since the creation of Israel post WW2.

I’m leaving out the religious reason out of it which yes I guess could start couple millenniums years ago .
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10-12-2023 , 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by corpus vile
Translation: Israel bad.
Fascists elements of Israeli government bad.
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10-12-2023 , 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by corpus vile
The attempts at moral equivalence by some of the posters here are ridiculous.
The lack of equivalent empathy is what’s appalling.
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10-12-2023 , 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Bubble_Balls
Fascists elements of Israeli government bad.
Are the Israeli government as bad as Hamas?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubble_Balls
The lack of equivalent empathy is what’s appalling.
Oh I have empathy for innocents killed but unlike you I can recognise the reactive context and how Hamas are using the Palestinians as shields by hiding among them.
You don't because Israel bad. Even if you'll never admit it.
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10-12-2023 , 04:51 PM
Settler Colonialism is the root of the problem.

Death and violence are the symptoms.
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10-12-2023 , 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by corpus vile
Are the Israeli government as bad as Hamas?




Oh I have empathy for innocents killed but unlike you I can recognise the reactive context and how Hamas are using the Palestinians as shields by hiding among them.
You don't because Israel bad. Even if you'll never admit it.
Doesn’t Israel do the same thing by having civilians in contested areas
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10-12-2023 , 05:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by corpus vile
Are the Israeli government as bad as Hamas?




Oh I have empathy for innocents killed but unlike you I can recognise the reactive context and how Hamas are using the Palestinians as shields by hiding among them.
You don't because Israel bad. Even if you'll never admit it.
Fwiw if bibi was so great , why hamas is so popular ?

https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/opinio...e-palestinians

“this government is bent on expanding Israel’s illegal Jewish settlement and deepening its system of apartheid throughout “the Land of Israel” or historical Palestine. And it is determined to increase its terrible repression and violence in order to keep the Palestinians down or force them out of their homeland.”
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10-12-2023 , 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by wazz
People sometimes talk about this idea of the mask slipping, when people say stuff they're not supposed to say out loud, and we get to see the real motivations behind what they're doing - a great example was that aussie billionaire a few weeks ago admitting that higher unemployment is better for him. What I find interesting is that during times like this, when emotions run high, people seem to feel a lot more confident in just removing their mask and admitting that yes, they do value life differently according to nationality, or religion, or whatever, because other people are doing so, and because they expect they will get a free pass to do so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubble_Balls
Yup, the climate feels exactly like that after 9/11 except now we've got social media so it's very apparent how widespread the phenomenon is. I imagine many of the same people would point to instances of mob justice in developing countries, (other) instances of colonialism, Nazism in Germany, etc and shake their heads in disgust and think, I would never. It's pretty terrifying.
It is very scary but we also shouldn't judge people by the worst thing they say in very emotional times. Many are literally not in their tight minds in these periods. I hadn't realised unemployment being good for the rich was a secret. The mask slipping would be saying the unemployment should or is being deliberately created for their benefit.

but yes the fact is that many do value lives differently based on nationality, race etc. even if they hadn't realised it. And they do think the germans must have been different in some deep way when that makes no sense. They're deluded but so are we if we think that's not what lots of people are like (and always will be)).
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