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I'm left but the new left going way too far out I'm left but the new left going way too far out

07-10-2020 , 12:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
The issue is, you've morphed the definition of racism to mean discriminative effects.
Can someone please pass the memo to the black people? It's discrimination, not racism.
Everyone can stop protesting and just go home now.

Glad we finally sorted it out!
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07-10-2020 , 12:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5 south
Can someone please pass the memo to the black people? It's discrimination, not racism.
Everyone can stop protesting and just go home now.

Glad we finally sorted it out!

You are not getting the nuance. Certainly you know the difference between racial discrimination and economic discrimination, , or taste discrimination, music discrimination right? Or, do you consider them the same thing?
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07-10-2020 , 12:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
The issue is, you've morphed the definition of racism to mean discriminative effects.
lolwat. Not even discrimination is racist now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
It's no secret the drug laws has a discriminative effect on black people. However, as "white america" gets hooked on opioids/meth, those same laws are now having a discriminative effect on whites.

A law that does that is not racist.
Blacks being incarcerated disproportionately is not de facto racist if they are also committing disproportionately more crime.

What is systemically racist is selective enforcement of laws by police, sentencing disparities, and DA's declining to prosecute whites at a much higher rate than blacks. White's being incarcerated at a higher rate now does not mean the law is now "discriminative" against whites. They are being jailed, by your own admission, because they are breaking the law at a higher rate due to the opiod epidemic. It is also certainly not some zero sum game by which we can infer that whites being jailed more then implies blacks are being discriminated against less.

You are posting literal nonsense.
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07-10-2020 , 12:26 PM
what are some examples of taste and music discrimination?
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07-10-2020 , 12:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EADGBE
They are being jailed, by your own admission, because they are breaking the law at a higher rate due to the opiod epidemic. It is also certainly not some zero sum game by which we can infer that whites being jailed more then implies blacks are being discriminated against less.
You would agree opioid addiction is an extrinsic issue that disproportionately impact whites, right? Do you think there are cultural influences that lead to this?
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07-10-2020 , 12:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
You are not getting the nuance. Certainly you know the difference between racial discrimination and economic discrimination, , or taste discrimination, music discrimination right? Or, do you consider them the same thing?
I'm busting your balls a bit but the school thing is a good example. I don't know the neighborhoods in Las Vegas at all. I think Henderson is the nice suburbs? Are those schools better than the bad neighborhoods? Is funding per capita equal.
I certainly hope so after all these years. If not then how is that explained? Are you getting less funding/opportunity just because you live in the bad part of town?
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07-10-2020 , 12:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by formula72
what are some examples of taste and music discrimination?
Before I answer that, is discrimination bad?
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07-10-2020 , 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5 south
I'm busting your balls a bit but the school thing is a good example. I don't know the neighborhoods in Las Vegas at all. I think Henderson is the nice suburbs? Are those schools better than the bad neighborhoods? Is funding per capita equal.
I certainly hope so after all these years. If not then how is that explained? Are you getting less funding/opportunity just because you live in the bad part of town?
Population density. Budget cuts will always impact the denser populations more. There is an argument it would impact henderson worse than Las Vegas. To be fair, though, probably better to look at counties.

Last edited by itshotinvegas; 07-10-2020 at 12:38 PM.
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07-10-2020 , 12:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
I'm honest
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL itslyinginvegas wants to talk about "honesty" in a thread where like a dozen other posters all can't seem to ever describe his argument accurately. They're all the dishonest ones, itslyinginvegas is the only honest poster here you guys, he's just being honest about the fact that every other poster can only seem to strawman him.
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07-10-2020 , 01:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
You are not getting the nuance. Certainly you know the difference between racial discrimination and economic discrimination, , or taste discrimination, music discrimination right? Or, do you consider them the same thing?
You were talking to a guy explicitly talking about racial discrimination.
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07-10-2020 , 01:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgiggity
Inshot sets up this whole premise: Even if racism didn't exist and true equality did, and enough time passed for legacy effects to completely fade, then there would still be difference in the achievements of different racial groups because there would still be cultural differences among racial groups.

@goofy.

The issue is, people take this, add and subtract things, then pass it off as what I'm saying. If you don't see that, you are not being intellectually honest.

There are cultural differences between white people that live in the south east, those who live in the north east, those who live in the midwest and those differences impact outcomes. Cajun culture has persisted for hundreds of years. Confederate stuff and racism still influence southern whites, and has led to their ostracization (rightly, or wrongly). That's ostracization is an extrinsic variable. Jewish culture persist, in any number of communities, largely due to their religion. I've explicitly cited a sociological study about farming habits of different groups.

The people you are defending are assuming these cultural things I'm talking about that lead to different outcomes are intrinsic. Everytime they do that, they are lying.

Last edited by itshotinvegas; 07-10-2020 at 01:24 PM.
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07-10-2020 , 01:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5 south
I think this guy presents ihiv's perspective pretty well

I love this guy. hes the best. I cant stop watching his videos.
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07-10-2020 , 01:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
You would agree opioid addiction is an extrinsic issue that disproportionately impact whites, right? Do you think there are cultural influences that lead to this?
You realize multiple factors can be contributing to an issue no?
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07-10-2020 , 01:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrWookie
You were talking to a guy explicitly talking about racial discrimination.
I knew it would not take long for you to return to your manipulation.
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07-10-2020 , 01:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wet work
You realize multiple factors can be contributing to an issue no?
Yes, that's what I've been arguing the entire time.
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07-10-2020 , 01:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
@goofy.

The issue is, people take this, add and subtract things, then pass it off as what I'm saying. If you don't see that, you are not being intellectually honest.

There are cultural differences between white people that live in the south east, those who live in the north east, those who live in the midwest and those differences impact outcomes. Cajun culture has persisted for hundreds of years. Confederate stuff and racism still influence southern whites, and has led to their ostracization (rightly, or wrongly). That's ostracization is an extrinsic variable. Jewish culture persist, in any number of communities, largely due to their religion. I've explicitly cited sociological study about farming habits of different groups.

The people you are defending are assuming these cultural things I'm talking about that lead to different outcomes are intrinsic. Everytime they do that, they are lying.
The first bolded does not imply the second. If I a make an assumption about your argument, that does make me a liar.
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07-10-2020 , 01:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
Yes, that's what I've been arguing the entire time.
And each of those factors can also be impacted by racism as well.
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07-10-2020 , 01:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wet work
And each of those factors can also be impacted by racism as well.
Among other things.
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07-10-2020 , 01:27 PM
Quote:
There are cultural differences between white people that live in the south east, those who live in the north east, those who live in the midwest and those differences impact outcomes
What different outcomes do these specific groups experience.

How do you relate this to racism having NOTHING to do with black people joining gangs.
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07-10-2020 , 01:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
Among other things.
Trying to knock other aspects of those variables into line w/o addressing one of the other big ones doesn't seem like a smart idea does it?

I'm going to sit here and sand this scratch until it's smooth--then we pull the camera back further and realize I'm standing on a giant bump
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07-10-2020 , 01:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.A.F.K.1.1
What different outcomes do these specific groups experience.

How do you relate this to racism having NOTHING to do with black people joining gangs.
Because kids join gangs.
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07-10-2020 , 01:30 PM
Jesus christ.
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07-10-2020 , 01:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.A.F.K.1.1
Jesus christ.
You are acting like it's some bizarre thing.

They don't join gangs becasue they can't get a job. They join because of the gangs influence in their community, and recruit them. That lifestyle is alluring to kids.
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07-10-2020 , 01:35 PM
I mean, why do you think white people become neo-nazi's or join the KKK?
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07-10-2020 , 01:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by itshotinvegas
@goofy.

The issue is, people take this, add and subtract things, then pass it off as what I'm saying. If you don't see that, you are not being intellectually honest.

There are cultural differences between white people that live in the south east, those who live in the north east, those who live in the midwest and those differences impact outcomes. Cajun culture has persisted for hundreds of years. Confederate stuff and racism still influence southern whites, and has led to their ostracization (rightly, or wrongly). That's ostracization is an extrinsic variable. Jewish culture persist, in any number of communities, largely due to their religion. I've explicitly cited a sociological study about farming habits of different groups.

The people you are defending are assuming these cultural things I'm talking about that lead to different outcomes are intrinsic. Everytime they do that, they are lying.
All of the cultures you list have their cultures persist due to either geographical seclusion (the regional cultures), or self-seclusion (Jews). I would argue that those respective cultures are now all much less distinct as physical mobility as well as the mobility of information and communication have both increased and partially homogenized America. The seclusion of Black people in this day and age is overwhelmingly due to racism foisted upon them via redlining and other factors. It is quite silly to think that Black culture would be as distinct from that of white people in the places they live when they were fully integrated with society and no longer minoritized and excluded, that is unless you think "culture" is something intrinsic. You keep saying how you don't think culture is intrinsic, but you also keep asserting that it has intrinsic properties.
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