"
Guns smuggled into Mexico are sometimes obtained at gunshops in the United States and carried across the US-Mexico border. In other cases the guns are obtained through Guatemalan borders or stolen from the police or military. Consequently, black market firearms are widely available."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org › wiki
Smuggling of firearms into Mexico - Wikipedia

and they smuggle these weapons over the border in the many professional tunnels underneath the border and in subways in the ocean and in speedboats and and.

planet of the feral pigs. goddam them all to heck

He did, and I'm not either, because I think real racists are more subtle about things. Troll seems most likely IMO.

You spelled it wrong, thus the irony. But FWIW, if you spelled it correctly, I believe it would be filtered, so you might want to make a different word choice in the future.

I made the same argument yesterday, and also included the massive US incarceration rate to counter any "more law and order" responses. All I got back was a "find the groups committing all the murders and target them", one of which was soon revealed to be, surprise surprise, black people.

The argument Ins0 made today, while I don't agree with it, had much more thought behind it.

FWIW, it's not just any particular European country, it's all of them, except Russia and one or two neighbours. And Canada, Australia...basically all of the "western world".

I think you're right to point out that this isn't a homogenous problem across the entire US, but I don't know if that really changes the discussion all that much.

You're never going to be able to draw a straight line from Jimbo and his ilk (I'm assuming Jimbo is a responsible law-abiding gun owner) to the homicide issue, because there isn't one. But that doesn't mean that gun availability isn't part of the problem. It also isn't the entire problem, of course. It might not even be the biggest problem. That doesn't mean it shouldn't be addressed, especially since it will take generations to fix it.

Well, the US already excels at the former, and it doesn't seem to be helping. If the latter is more social programs for those who need help, that sounds like a great place to start.

I can understand thinking this isn't the only problem, but ignoring it seems a little insane.

2020 stats: 79% of murders are by gun and 53% of suicides are by guns. That's 43,500 deaths by gun.

I mean there's no doubt cities are an issue. But there are also a hell of a lot shootings outside them--seeing every one mapped to the location is pretty interesting to me anyway. I would imagine domestic issues etc account for way more than livestock disputes

You can get to the map in 2 clicks and a little scrolling fwiw.

thanks bobo.

So Wiki indicates "sometimes" they are straw purchases which is a far cry from all of them are straw purchases.

One thing is sure: making a case for how easy it is to get firearms into Mexico, which has some of the strictest gun laws, isn't helping the "more gun laws will keep the guns out of criminals' hands" argument here.

I don't think comparing the US to Canada, European or Asian countries that have similar means to deal with such a problem is lazy. Certainly no more than comparing the US to a narcostate.

Crime isn't evenly distributed in countries with lower gun murder rates so I don't think that the local aspect in the US is disqualifying for comparisons. Local gun problems aren't going to be improved without gun control on a national level as seen in those countries. Doesn't do much good if your city bans guns but the state next door has little to no oversight.

I know your penchant for punishment so we don't need to discuss that but I am curious what your good behavior program looks like.

Every time this discussion about guns and/or gun control comes up, people seem content to ignore the fact that most gun crime is committed by, well, criminals.

Criminals don't give a **** about your gun control laws.

Sorry for the driveby URL, but here's a somewhat recent report from the DOJ:

Department of Justice - Source and Use of Firearms Involved in Crimes: Survey of Prison Inmates


So the actual fix for this is not more gun control laws, but in fact the wholesale confiscation and destruction of all the guns in the USA to make it so the 93% of criminals who used illegally-obtained guns in the commission of a crime can't get them in the first place.

So it's pointless to have this discussion when I'm over here like, "You can't just take away all the guns" and you're all, "That's not what we're suggesting!"

The only logical conclusion that we'll be able to come to is that you don't truly care about eliminating gun deaths then, because you're not willing to do what it takes to make it happen, which is the wholesale confiscation and destruction of all the firearms in the United States.

There are no half-measures to be taken here, because they're only going to apply to the people you aren't and shouldn't be worried about in the first place.

Cute.

Ah yes, white man's burden strikes again.

I'm pleasantly surprised that he's gone from all stick to stick plus carrot.

I just don't agree with this.

I believe you start by requiring strong background checks. The second part is mandatory registration of every firearm. We register cars and it seems work. You don't confiscate all guns, just ones that aren't registered. And, you don't just go door to door searching folks for unregistered guns. It's a slow process.

It took us over 200 years to get here, it will take a while to get where we need to be. I just don't believe you throw up your hands and say nothing can be done because it is difficult.

I think it's a great idea, Inso. Once all of them have been destroyed, then we can start again with very, very strict laws on who can own and for what reasons.

The problem is going to be when you try to take jimbo’s ar15s. Whether Jimbo believes in the Bible and Armageddon or if he thinks the day is coming the communist are going to disarm him, Jimbo and his boys been training in the woods for a long time and aren’t going down without a fight. And Jimbo done not a thing wrong to this point besides maybe fly an oversized confederate flag and poor hygiene and dress.

Are you American or Latvian or both? Where do you live now?

We already have the background checks and registrations, if not entirely universal. It doesn't matter, however, since people who go through this process generally aren't the ones out there committing crimes. If you inconvenience the 7% of criminals who are committing gun crimes with a legally-obtained firearm, what's the more likely outcome in your opinion: they decide not to commit the crime because it's mildly more annoying to obtain the gun, or they do what the other 93% do and just get one by some illegal means?

Also, you don't need to register your vehicle unless you intend to use it. Not that vehicle registration is in any way applicable to this situation. The government registers cars because that's a source of ongoing revenue and only under the guise of some implicit agreement on the part of those vehicle owners to help pay for the roads they'll be driving on. You can't make that same argument with regard to firearms.

When is the last time you saw a vehicle owner charged with anything because someone committed a crime using their stolen vehicle?

Is this really your response? I swear it seems most the anti gun people in this thread are more about wanting to boss people around like spoiled children rather than talk about anything that has to do with rights or logic.

There is definitely a leak in our current system of background checks and registration. Like a big leak. Do whatever it takes to plug that leak.

The leak is hundreds of millions of guns available. It's absolutely insane.

Would love to hear who the “Latvian assassin “ thinks should be allowed to own a gun.

Y’all’s fascism shining way brighter glow than any of my racism

Yes, that's really my response.

Dude comes in and says, "It's not practical to talk about moderate gun control measures... the only practical gun control measure worth talking about is confiscating all firearms in America."

Like as if that could ever happen or would even make a difference. I could print a Glock handgun and have it functioning within a day or two.

Let’s see you do that

Confiscate my guns first.

I hate multiquotes since tangents beget tangents, but you're all over the map here so forced, no choice.

I've held off accusing you of being dumb, but we're getting to the point where there's no other conclusion to be drawn.
The legal basis for the right to keep and bear arms isn't 'traditionalism', nor has it ever been. Its totally fair to say "I don't accept the argument that tradition is a valid basis for the continuance of the current gun law regime", but that's not what you said.

Right, just like I'd much rather have access to what a modern physician has, compared to what Hippocrates had to figure out, but that doesn't negate his philosophical observations that still apply today, nor does it mean that 'the guys in charge of medicine' 100, 200, 300 and 400 years later were equally important.

Fair, but then you shouldn't be so fast and loose writing off historically significant parties that you don't understand (to any depth) why they're historically significant.

You said this:

Quote:

the idea that the guys that were in charge in the late 1700's were somehow significantly smarter than the guys in charge at any other point in history is pretty silly.

... and that's how I know you're either super ill-informed on that precise topic, or informed but just dumb and don't understand any of it.

Why’re you lying to people. You can’t print the slide or barrel can you