Do conservatives want to ban transition care for all transgender people, not just children? - Page 23 - Politics and Society -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

I'm not attempting a gotcha & certainly not attempting a "moral" victory, no need to get all defensive uke. It's a valid point to make when you have the likes of wpath endorsing it. At the very least, one can argue that Transgender advocacy attracts ideologues as well as those with genuine gender dysphoria.
But rather than weigh in you choose to run away instead, which I find interesting.

It would be super easy for Uke (or anyone) to be like "no I disagree with wpath stating that eunuchs should receive gender affirming care and I don't recognize that as a valid gender". The issue is that he can't because that opens the door to all sorts of problems. Wpath is supposed to be the experts and we're told to trust the experts-- so you can't disagree with them because that opens the door up for people thinking for themselves and being allowed to have their own opinions, amongst other problems.

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06-22-2023 , 12:17 PM

#552

ganstaman

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 10,921

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Originally Posted by Dunyain

In a vacuum if someone told you we started an experimental practice to give children chemicals to block normal brain development, you would of course be very hesitant and demand a high burden of proof that the practice was justified, and be very interested in there being studies as to the short, medium and long term ramifications.

This medicine blocks the release of hormones that typically occur during puberty. Sure, this impacts the whole body but just in that it's delaying all the effects of normal puberty. We already give this in other situations, so it's not as though we don't know what it's doing. I would love long term studies but we rarely get good ones of those for much of medicine, in part because that just takes a long time.

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06-22-2023 , 03:31 PM

#553

57 On Red

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 5,948

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Originally Posted by ganstaman

We do not do that in other situations. Those drugs are only approved as puberty blockers in girls who experience precocious puberty. The drugs are stopped when normal puberty is due. Preventing normal puberty, a quite different act, is wholly harmful in terms of brain, bone and organ development and is not a trialled or approved medical procedure. Almost all children placed on blockers for that reason will progress to cross-sex hormones, because they have been 'put in the system', so it's not about pausing or delaying puberty -- which is in any case impossible, because the body cannot pick up where it left off once the time has gone.

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06-22-2023 , 04:45 PM

#554

ganstaman

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 10,921

Quote:

Originally Posted by 57 On Red

We do not do that in other situations. Those drugs are only approved as puberty blockers in girls who experience precocious puberty.

You say in one sentence that we don't use the medicine in other situations, and then in the very next sentence give an example of a situation in which we use the same medication. It is also used for some with short stature and for some cancers.

Anyway, you say it is "wholly harmful" to give but doctors who are experts in endocrinology seem to feel it safe enough to prescribe, so how could we possibly know who to trust?