Neocons and neolibs are two entirely different groups, and you couldn't define either! Neither of those describe the people Wookie was describing, for example.

(also neither you or Kelhus have ever ONCE attacked income inequality as a wrong, you've only cited it as a thing that BLM or immigrant rights groups are a smokescreen for, you use it as a cudgel to try to shut down debate on the consequences of you both having pretty mainstream Fox News watcher views on every single ****ing issues)

I'm thinking but failing to see where you're going. Where are you going?

Fly you're so smart. You're the greatest politics poster on 2p2. Tell me what makes them so different I'd enjoy hearing this.

What is one of my mainstream Fox views?
(Besdies anything to do with Maduro)
That liberals like you are a bunch of jokers? Got me there.

Man you can't try this bit out literally one day after I did it to you and expect it to land.

Also, no, you're the one who used the terms completely wrong because you were so giddy about contradicting the dang libs. The group Wookie was asking the name of was the GROUP YOU'RE IN! Are you a neolib/neocon?

Neocons and neoliberals are two sides of the same coin. They are the corporate republicans and the corporate democrats who run this country. I don't need to look at wikipedia to know that Paul Ryan and Nancy Pelosi play for the same team.
Why do you think upholding the two-party system is the way to bring about progress?

I edited to get you back on the point that Wookie was asking about YOU, but also,


what substantive policy differences are there between you and Paul Ryan?

Wtf? Policy differences between me and Paul Ryan? Really?
I would end the drug war, expose crimes in high places, stop bombing the middle east, have truth and reconciliation commissions, change our educational system, and probably some other things involving monetary policy designed to help people not Wall St.
I'm sure there are a lot more things but you've really put me on the spot with asking for my platform.

Of course. He was also a progressive. No one's ever denied that Republicans were progressive and democrats were the party of slavers in 1850.

Why would you think this is even some kind of point? Like I give a **** that Democrats were the party of racist scumbags until the 70s or so when they all switched sides, reformed, or retired?

All those things I mentioned were controversial at one time. There were endless diatribes about how they would destroy the economy, or destroy the country - just like you're doing now.

Trans bathrooms and reparations are good causes. Sticking up for historically marginalized groups is a cornerstone of progressivism.

It's not progressives fault that right-wingers flip out about trans bathrooms - something that helps establish an extremely marginalized group as a first class human being - while costing nothing, doing literally zero damage and posing zero risk. I'm not a big fan of shying away from worthy causes because the other side is psychotically irrational about them.

But honestly the fact that you think I'm a standard neocon Republican probably means I should just ignore everything you say to me, since clearly you've never read a word I've written to you as is.

The most outspoken critics of the drug war are liberals and leftists you think are doing identity politics! I don't believe you.

No one claims to be "pro-crime", but I would note that you defend the Trump's administrative lawbreaking in pretty much every thread. So I think what you mean here is "investigate the ties between Jeffrey Epstein and Hillary Clinton", which Ryan is probably OK with.

Uh huh.

WHAT? Mother****er, reconciliation for what?

Uh huh OK like one ****ing post ago you claimed "elites" were boosting Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez so you have to understand nobody believes you about this ****.

OK, so three things:

1) It's bizarre you have to come up with this **** "on the spot". You don't already know what you think?
2) The vagueness here sort of confirmed my suspicions that you couldn't really identify any of Paul Ryan's policy positions at all. He's in favor of changing the education system too, and probably in the same way you are.

You have adopted absolutely mainstream Republican positions almost across the board but these Youtubes have somehow sold you on "liberals are jokers" as being some bold act of rebellious thought.

and


3) WOOKIE WAS ASKING WHAT WE SHOULD CALL YOU. CALL YOUR GROUP. That you named two contradictory groups is only part of how wrong you were about that, because you don't think of yourself as either!

What elites are propping up AOC?

Yeah you don't know who you're talking to and have my confused with the conservative boogeyman in your head again. Perhaps its Kelhus.

So you think I think the drug war is a good thing?

I'm not planning on running for office. Most of my ideas would not be feasible but I would dream big. And lol.
Why do you think that? I don't know what his position is but I doubt I'd be mimicking it.
And your suspicions are correct because Paul Ryan's policy positions I can sort of not give one flying **** about.
Ok. And I figured out liberals are jokers before youtube was even a thing. Probably right around the time Obama was elected and they decided they loved the system. (A few years before that really)

Oh no it's definitely Kelhus, I'm sorry I confused the two of you. You were cosigning his theory here but that particular post was by him.


Do you disagree with him about that?

I think you don't really care about criminal justice reform in any concrete manner. Every meaningful and serious critique of the drug war has to deal with the racial disparity in enforcement, and that's identity politics, right?

Then why the **** did you list it as an issue where you disagree? Christ.

Bc of racism and for profit policing and for profit prisons primarily

I don't think so. You can be opposed to the drug war for a number of reasons. If whites were punished like blacks it wouldn't then make it just. My own opposition to it goes back far enough that it's hard to even say my motives. No doubt they've evolved over the years from a general opposition on libertarian grounds to wanting to selfishly travel in Northern Mexico and have it be safe. Regardless, you can still also be opposed to it due to sentencing disparity--but it's hard to say if you're actually against the drug war if that were to be the only rationale.
Given that I haven't thought out at all how I would actually reform the educational system, I think it stands to reason that whatever I think is different from Ryan. But if the fact that we both think it's bad is a gotcha then you got me.

Do I think Coates and Cortez are neoliberal shills and not fighting for the people?
Coates for sure. Cortez has been propelled from obscurity to stardom but I'm sure it's because she's threatening the system. Pelosi hates her so how can she be bad?

Why are you not of the far left?

This is you not reading carefully, btw.

A protests W et al. P is a subset of W.

Well, she doesn't hate gay people or blacks, so you'll figure out how she's bad soon enough. Pelosi hates her, but so do reactionary Youtubers, my man.


Also, man, can you provide a ****ing example of what makes you think Coates is a neoliberal shill?

Seems like your use of majestic plurals undercuts your argument that you're opposing the elite establishment.

Ok you got me

We've already talked about Coates in the identity politics thread. There isn't a point in making the same arguments again since you don't listen.

Actually it was the immigration thread
https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/s...php?p=55230895