Seen many sites that offer 55 percent rakeback. However theres one site that offers 65% flat rakeback called rakemeback. Can someone tell me if this is legit? I emailed them and they said its flat 65%. But every other site seems to be 40-50% flat rakeback for william hill. Is there something i dont get here?

Hi PJ

They are offering a rate based on the dodgy new rake method that iPoker are using where up to 50% of your actual rake may not count depending on whether you are a winning non net depositing player

That will be the same for 50% and 55%

The 40% stuff is based on the old rake method so what you see mid month is what you will get.

40% Old rake can be up to 80% New rake

Hope that helps
Kind regards

Johnny

So basically almost every site that advertises william hill its pretty much 40 percent flat rb no matter what? Does it differ if someone only plays sngs or mtts only? Thus do they ever get those rates that is advertised on that site of 65% flat rakeback if they play sngs only as oppose to cash games which i know the rake is different since you dont pay the rake if u fold preflop etc?

Hey PJ

SNGs are included in the dodgy calculations...

MTTS are not...
If you rake $1 in an MTT you will get whatever percentage you are listed as.

Hope that helps

Best wishes

Johnny

Okay so you are saying if someone only plays sngs... then one does get 65% flat rakeback with them whereas everywhere else is 40 percent? But the only exception is its only sngs and no mtt/cash?


But if u play cash and or mtt, then its roughly the same rb with every rakeback site for WH?

Sorry perhaps i wasn't clear.

If you only play SNGs they are subject to the same new rake calculations so if you are a winning SNG player you will get a lot less rake than you think.

If you only play MTTs then you are better off on a 65% deal.

Hope that's clearer

Best wishes

Johnny

In other words, someone whos plays sngs only, u can pretty much sign up at any rakeback site and its same thing.


Mtt... then this site is best choice.


For cash its about the same and RB site is pretty much the same?


Is that accurate?

Not sure we are on the same page...

If you play only SNGs and you are a winning player and new withdrawer of money from the system, you will end up with about 50% of your normal rake.
Your rakeback will then be a percentage of that.

If you are only MTTS - then the higher the percentage th beter

For cash it's the same as SNGs only as above

Best wishes

Johnny

Disclaimer: I haven't read the official manual on SBR [would like to get it, btw] and the following are my musings based on the explanations I've read in the poker media, in particular, 2+2 threads, about the way SBR works. This month (I hope, in the next one too), I'll be playing on a deal (through a 2+2 advertising partner) that includes an SBR-based race, so I'll have access to my SBR data and shall be able to report by how much the new model will reduce my rake figures. I'm a rather weak player, plus a big part of my volume will be in €10 Twister and €20 Rio jackpot SnGs, which will give a slight 'discount', as elaborated below.

The new 'real player value' (RPV) method indeed results in smaller rakeback figures for regs than the old method, but the impact depends on how good you are at the game.

As far as I've figured out, essentially, from a player viewpoint, lifetime RPV = 0.5 * old rake + ~0.5 * lifetime pre-RB loss. In the terms that RakeTheRake uses, only the second summand is called SBR, while the whole thing is called RPV. (However, other affiliates tend to call the whole thing SBR.)

I.e. if you lose $1K first, then win $5K, then lose $1K, then win $5K, only the first $1K will count towards your SBR.

If you're a reg who wins pre-rakeback, then your RPV is half the old rake. You may get a bit more (0.6-0.7 of the old rake) for a few first months after you sign up with a skin if you go on a downswing at first. (Note that SBR-based rewards reduce the variance, as a by-product )

However, 1) even in non-jackpot SnGs on iPoker, many regs lose pre-RB (survive due to RB only) because they're overraked (e.g. €20-50 superturbos have 8% rake), 2) in jackpot and Twister SnGs, the SBR method ignores the jackpot component, which is to regs' favour.

In a €10 Twister (the iPoker analogue of Stars' Spin & Gos), the jackpot component is €2.60 (and in lower BI ones, it's the same 26% of the BI). For the purposes of the SBR method, a €10 Twister is viewed as a non-JP €6.70+€0.70 SnG with a 3*€6.70=€20.10 prize pool (which is the minimum prize that a winner can get).

Therefore, if you have an ITM of less than €7.40/(3*€6.70)~37% in Twisters, then you generate SBR longterm, i.e. your RPV is more than 0.5 of your fees. E.g. if your ITM is 36%, your RPV is ~0.6 of fees, even though in fact you break even pre-RB [36%*3*€9.30 - €10 = €0.044 ~ €0) because you win a share of the JP component more often than a recreational (while the new system doesn't penalise you for that).

It's not known publicly what the JP component is in normal speed JP SnGs (Rio etc.), but I estimate (basing on how fast the JP grows and how many games are played on the network weekly) that it's 5-6% of the BI and the SBR system regards e.g. Rios as €17.10+1.70 non-JP SnGs with 9-10% rake. I.e. you're deemed breakeven if your ROI is -6% (quite typical of regs of Rios, btw), but again, you're in fact profitable in the very long run this case because you're not penalised for winning the jackpot with a way high probability than a recreational (who, in fact, has almost zero chance, while you might hit it once in several years, at least a few of my fellow regs have).

The bottom line is that, if you're an SnG reg preferring jackpot formats but not a crusher, then 65% RPV can be better for you than old-method 40%, while for winning cash game regs, 65% RPV is close to old 33-35% longterm.

If you play MTTs as well on the side, then SBR is even more in your favour because RPV = fees by definition for MTTs, you're not penalised at all for being an MTT reg.

Oops, I've just reread the OP I'm in no way advocating for the affiliate mentioned there; in fact, RakeTheRake used to offer 50-60% RPV-based rakeback themselves in addition to races, and I'd really recommend RTR to give players a choice between 40% old method and 55%+ () RPV instead of putting everyone on the 40%.

I don't think it will hit RTR's bottom line by much because I keep seeing familiar opponents who I think would be better off on RPV () [I mean, with 1.5x bigger nominal %-ages] switch skins to hop on deals based totally on old rake instead.

40% old method with races is still better than 65% RPV without races (lolfail), no doubt.

Ask them how it is calculated.
As far as I am aware I get 58% on the old method from them (even though others here say that is not possible). Looking at my numbers it appears I am right. I have had this deal before the new rake method existed.

No more rakeback on WH as of June 1.

They want to go more rec friendly according to the email i got. Wont make a difference on ipoker though.

Not sure the previous drop in rb made any difference, and maybe that is why they dropped it further, but that looks more like the regs going to other skins, but they are business men and i am just a poker player.

I have lost many skins there before this also, because of country or no more rb, or the skin stopped, this being maybe 8th, or the 10th but there were all kinds of deals.

Not that the network is my favorite and with the previous drop it has been secondary to me. The next step is the kick of all network rb merge etc. style. I wonder how they have been doing. But as unibet rep thinks, the industry is ever moving to no rb, and will be replaced with bonuses, it seems, and some sort of vip. And there can be bonuses on these no rb skins also.

i hear there is something in offing as well to stop sites poaching players