Lol ... ya, rofl, indeed. Here's a news flash, full stackers don't give a rat's ass about ratholers. It's a travesty you were able to do what you've done for so long and the party is finally over. IF CAP was moved to its own tab, we wouldn't give a rat's ass about how your games are going just like we don't care how PLO, Limit, Stud, or Badugi games are going. We don't need you ... in fact, we WANT a divorce. You're the crazed jilted dumpee that can't move on with their life and doesn't have a life. You just keep trying to hold on ... all of you need to let go and move on. It's over.

Just to adress this tab discussion: What if there would be a 100bb CAP game on Stars? Should this also be under another tab, because it isn't NLHE?

Just hypthetical, I'm interested in what the people say who support a different tab for CAP games.

We're not dealing in hypothetical. CAP exists and it needs its own tab. Once there, feel free to make 30bb CAP or 10bb CAP or whatever the hell you rats want to make. Seriously. Go nuts. Have fun on your playground and sandbox. You've earned it.

And, I'm not entertaining any hypotheticals or "what ifs" that could give you some backward logic reason for staying in our tab. Begone to your own tab and make a name for yourself

This coming from the cry babies who have cried so much stars has had to change the games twice and still you can't stop crying for more. If you are so sure that rec players want to play deep then y'all should have no problem sharing the NL tab. But the truth is that you want the main lobby so the recs see your tables and don't realize there are other choices but to sit at your tables. We all know how it has been when they do have a choice.
And you all keep talking about playing real poker a skill game but that is BS. If it were true then you would care who was playing at your tables. People who play for skill don't try and get the worst players they can at their tables. How many NHL goalies have 7 yr olds shooting pucks at them in practice? So quit lying to yourselves and other and grow up and quit crying.

I can't believe you typed this with a straight face. nearly every single post you make, in threads relevant or not to the subject, has to do with raging about shortstackers and ratholers.

+1 on the divorce analogy. Just leave, start a new life in a new tab.

Having a max buyin amount is nowhere near the same thing as having a cap. You can double/triple/quadruple/ect. your stack and all that money is in play and can be bet without limit (i.e. no limit). Cap games on the other hand, limit the amount you can bet up to 20bb, so because the amount you can bet is limited, it cannot be termed "no limit" DUCY?

See, not everyone who thinks CAP or 20bb is bad for the game of poker or whatever is a crybaby but I think you are probably one of them.

I'm not an ss'er. Sometimes I play CAP PLO alongside full buyin tables. They are different games, I enjoy them both. Should they have different tabs? Meh. I would lean towards no since there are not too many CAP tables compared to higher buyin ones anyhow. If Stars made a new tab for CAP, I wouldn't be choked. It's just that Stars has already made quite a few changes to the games to address ss'ing and I think things are largely okay the way they are now. It seems to me there probably are not enough CAP tables to justify a whole new tab. The game is certainly different but not totally different. I see nothing wrong with bunching those games in with 100bb NLHE. Use filters if you don't like it.

So share the fish a bit. If the fish go to CAP, learn how to play CAP better/exploit the ratholers. Probably better for you than crying.

Oh my god, thank you. This is real humor!

Those people stopped making sense a long time ago. Running out of arguements is never going to slow a self-entitled whingebag down. They'd argue black is white if they thought someone might listen.

Just to clarify, I'm not a rat, all shortstackers should die in a fire or work at McDonalds. If I could decide I would make all tables 40-100bb + deep tables. No CAP or whatever at all. But that's just my personal opinion.

I think these changes made it close to fair for everyone. Pokerstars always sad they won't eliminate 20bb cashgame Poker. We just have to deal with that. But CAP is definitely better than 20-50. It protects recreational players, they now know they're playing 20 bb Poker before they sit at the table (if they elect to play cap). Before, they wanted to play 20-50 but effectively played 20 bb cap with 4 or whatever shortstackers on the table and got instaratholed when some shortdonker stacked them. Feels good, right? Ratholing is now pretty much no longer a problem.

I think there will be less CAP tables than 20-50 tables now. So I like the changes. I estimate that there will be a 2:1 ratio of 40-100 to CAP tables after the changes, at least at small and mid stakes. This would obv be an improvement.

But if I'm wrong and fish love the CAP games, well than we had our chance. I won't cry, nor should any other fullstack player do.

@Phatty
To return to my example: How should 100bb CAP tables be treated? As NLHE or not? Where is the borderline?

I just counted 16 1/2 cap games as opposed to 80 or so each for 20-50 and 40-100. I would guess the number of cap games will double once 20-50 is eliminated. I am pleasantly surprised that cap seems relatively popular.

My main fear was that there would be little cap action and people who like buying in short wouldn't have anywhere to play.

fyp

What does ratholing have to do with cap? Could your arguments get any worse?
It is clear in nearly every single post that the reason you and others want it to be in a different tab is that you don't like shortstacker and shortstacked poker.
In a cap game there is no ratholing. There is no leeching. People who win at 20bb or 30bb cap games do so, because they play better than their opponents. If people can overcome the small edges that 20bb cap offers and win at it, they are just as good at what they do than a winning fullstacker in his games.
It's like flaming jorj for playing and winning at hyper turbos instead of normal sngs.

Whoever says the cap is not your whole stack just doesn't understand cap and probably has never played it. Cap is just an agreement all players at the table make, to never bet more than a specified amount. You could achieve that by taking all money over that amount of the table before each hand starts. That doesn't in any way change how a hand can be played, cap is something that takes place prior to a hand. After the cards are dealt it exactly plays like a NLHE hand. You can compare cap to games with antes, straddles or 7-2. It's all something that players agreed on prior to a hand. You can't compare cap to fixed limit, pot limit or stud.

You're really just raging against shortstacked poker and everyone who isn't must be a stupid ratholer. If your logic would really be based on what cap is, then 40-100bb 100bb cap would be some silly form of poker which is not NLHE while 20-20 would be the real deal. So much fail.

I wouldn't worry. I rarely had trouble finding fishy .25/.50 CAP games before the change, and that's competing with 20-50, 40-100, and microstakes CAP.

plus, the regs in 20-50 are used to everyone having 20bb. The only players we really lose are the people who were fullstacking those games, who i presume would rather play deeper but just went where the action was/fish were.

And well, as far as i can tell over the last 100k hands or so, cap is just about the loosest, fishiest game on stars.

I'm for for anything that sends SS'ers to McDonalds where they can work among a staff with similar intelligencia. hopefully this does the trick. thanks Stars.

this has so much win but it's going to fall on deaf ears.

By far the best post of the thread. A fish is a fish until they watch a few Cardrunners videos and learn how to play preflop, 3betting light, and cbetting tons like all the cool kids. What is the turn or river I forget. So really it doesn`t matter if it`s 20bb or 1000.

Your post is fine in general but I don't think this part gets to the heart of the matter.

They just don't want the fish to play CAP, and putting it in a ghetto is the best way to accomplish that goal, and they will grasp at any straw to do so.

There's quite a bit of skill in shortstacked games, otherwise everybody would be needbeer'ing it up for ridiculous amounts of money every month. However, comparing shortstacking to the complexity of deepstack play is pretty silly IMO, especially in a game where quite a good part of the strategy is basically learning charts and adapting to the chart your opponent is using since there's little room to maneuver postflop and/or come up with creative strategies when you're bound by pure math.

How is the cap/tab debate still going on? NLHE got popular from big stackers (>20bbs) so why should the small stack coin flippers get to leech off the fish that play because they watch there pros playing deep stacked.

Do I want the fish at 100bb? Yes, I'm not going to lie, but short stackers are leechers, nothing more.

leeches ghana wanna leech

Yeah right man, and how dare you cash players leech off us tourney donks when it was coverage of the WSOP that caused the poker boom in the first place? etc etc

I am loving this thread. Same ******ed ******** gets smacked out of the park each time it's posted and still the tards queue up to post it.

lolololol

tournies = ss, always have been.

cash games = not ss, always should be.

tthric..........

i think the best solution was posted a while ago. same tab for about 3 or 4 months and then reevaluate based on feedback, but likely making a seperate tab for cap.

while we are on the subject of plhe btw i feel like it should really just be eradicated. it just serves to confuse people, almost noone plays it seriously.