its at 12pm (noon) today on stars clock (ET), 6.5 hrs from now.

I aggre that SW should be involved. I gave up playing CAP 6 months ago but would play them again if something was done about the rake. I think the very fact that pokerstars aren't explicitly asking for a CAP player to join the talks speaks volumes. They already know their game games are nigh on unbeatable at small stakes and they'd rather not have to discuss the CAP rake when they know the ONLY reasonable course of action is a rake decrease on those games.

ran the script and as a 10nl 6max player i actually benefit from the changes



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however, whats the point in slogging away at silver star getting roughly 10-15% equivalent rakeback when even i can get 55% at ipoker. I moved just before christmas ,signed up with titan through cardrunners, so ill get free months cardrunners,HEM licence and clear a first deposit bonus.then it will be either bonus whoring or just playing on a rakeback deal. for me its a no brainer, stars just aren't rewarding my play enough .

And in the meantime everyone is playing? Lol

Given all the **** we have given Stars over the past week about poor communication I think it should be pointed out how much better things have got. I dont know whether anyone else has noticed the times that Steve has been posting either, but it seems at least that he (and thus presumably others) are working on this outside of the normal work schedule. Even though I made a previous post indicating it should be fixed ASAP, I didnt expect you should have given up your NYE plans if you had any

I think theres a problem as starving identified in that if players come back from IoM and say its a good deal -> are the community necessarily going to just accept that when they cant be told WHY it is a good deal?

As a suggestion to Stars and those visiting the IoM I think each game type should have its own rake schedule. Firstly, I actually think it makes things much clearer than organising by bet type. Years ago as a fish I spent a good twenty mins looking for the PLO rake schedule until I realised it was the same as the NL one. Secondly, it will be much easier to make changes without adversely affecting other games on the site.

nope, sleeping off their hangovers from NYE celebrations. obviously it couldn't start at midnight, people are out. doesn't matter if it doesn't start until 12 hours into 2012, it's more convenient as people will be awake then to start all at once, and shut down 100nl and the most common stake levels.

a few people not on US timezones have played today just to test out how many FPPs they get under the new system, and are reporting 10-30% losses as expected.

Just imagine how awesome it would be for FullTilt to re-open in these days! I am really that desperate, that I'm already downloading Ipoker software, spent last couple days playing Microgaming and the fact that FullTilt stands higher than Pokersars for the first time in my life says a lot.
Stars had the worst rakeback in all internetz and now they just made it worse... Due to players request of course, as they always say

also they removed bronzestar 25$ fpp bonus, so the chance that the extra vpp/fpp which are going to fish is coming back to poker economy as $ instead of shirts or caps is smaller now

rofl seriously?

so now 99% wont even get anything for their fpps? and they dont even have to announce it because it technically doesnt impact high volume players

i must say as far as evil schemes go, this is quite brilliant at this point

+1, Was planning on going for Supernova Elite this year.. but it's worthless now.

I have downloaded an iPoker client and setup 60% rakeback deal, will be playing there while sitting out on PokerStars. I encourage everyone else to do the same.

.......just as I load up my account.

So now it is WC??

such bs and they even got rid of em at the 2011 section too to make it look like nothign happened, all ruined

Guys my point of view might be different cause I am not losing due to WC rake system.
The Wc system is way more fair than the dealt rake. I mean I am more than happy that the 40bb ratholers and nits will get way less as they deserve.
There has to be a way to reward loose player more (cause they indeed contribute way more to the pots).
Instead of trying so desperately to reverse the changes we should focus on lowering the rake. It will be good for everyone.
The dealt system is only beneficial for nits,TAGs and Rats (aka 40bb ratholers).

the 2011 section is there only to let you obtain 2011 milestones in case you missed to buy them. But yea, i would definitely like to see more open comunication from stars, deep lists of changes every time they change something, not just few paragraphs of PR and you players figure out the rest

^ post suggests you haven't done enough reading on the subject, which you should aim to, as you're a good poster. W/C is unfair too, and comes with its own problems. W/C without compensation is well worth striking against. there are 100s of posts hammering out the math and analysing the bigger picture behind every rake method out there, i'd suggest searching by post for 'weighted contributed' and user name 'do it right'. protesting for compensation with W/C is the same thing as lowering the rake, and we're also protesting for lower rake, yes. microstakes rake, PLO, cap, everything will be addressed when the sitout forces negotiations from stars.

+1 absolutely correct

Reduce rake to make games such as CAP and LHE beatable. Give the microgamers a chance and I'm sure you might have a positiver response.

Your chart is wrong: milestones do not cost 50.000 FPP. They cost 1 FPP (they cost nothing, basically)...

That came with the revision of the vip rewards from 2010 to 2011 already and will keep this way in 2012 (they are immediate cash bonus too, once they were a bonus that needed to be "cleared" but not anymore).



Btw, for a regular that pays attention to promotions, rakeback ends being a bit higher cause there are several through the year like reload bonus and other promos. Its hard to estimate in advance, obviously, but they exist and have linear cash value as the rewards accounted there (and I am not counting with freerolls). As an example, there is the "VIP Club Blast Off" in January already which adds up to $300 on bonus next month and extra value in FPPs (with a value that depends on the volume made during happy hours). And will exist other promos till the end of the year, for sure...

I looked in the VIP store at 00.01ET and it had a category called "2012 VIP rebate" and when you clicked on it, it had the $25 cash reward for 2500 fpp.

Anyway they removed it within minutes. But I'm wondering if the "VIP rebate" is going to be a form of new reward that they haven't announced yet?

Deploy please. 60/100/200 6 max plz plz plz.

and 15/30/60/100 9 max plz plz plz

Enough with the considerations! Let's get them deployed already! The extra rake might come in handy this month

+1

+1

Gogogo

I read the thread and I still stay with my point. It isn't true that every reg is losing (I am not). I remember the same discussion when FTP switched to WC. We all know that it is just money grab. They don't do this to protect ecosystem. while I might be naive back then when FTP switched now I am not.
However if we want to find solution the best is to lower the rake. We won't get it all (be realistic). It won't be dealt with low rake.
As people mentioned here rake in Limit Games and CAP games make them unbeatrable pre rakeback. It is just ridiculous. Plo rake is 2. as big as holdem rake up to small stakes( at least there you hit the cap frequently).
Pokerstars still treat the regs the best (I know it might sound ******ed for most of you but Ongame/Ipoker don't even care about us).
There are 2 parts that want to make a profit,regs and company. So basically they has to resign from part of the profit and we too.
They also want to protect their profits+ we all want them to advertise as much as possible cause we all need fish to survive.
low rake>>>>>>dealt
It will be way better for long term quality of the games.

If you'd read the thread you'd know we're striking for compensation to be added to W/C, whether it be via an FPP multiplier increase or otherwise, which is obv the same thing as an effective rake decrease, and where possible direct rake decreases to LHE, CAP, PLO, microstakes, a reduction to 4.5% or better across all games. W/C has a ton of problems which the strike aims to address, it's not a bunch of nits crying about dealt rake being gone at this point. WTA or W/C with compensation >>> dealt >> W/C with no compensation (status quo now)