any sort of update would be appreciated

+1 it seems like it has been a very long twelve days.

I'm a little late to this thread and am trying to get a clear feel for "table starters". So you just click what game and stakes you want to play and stars seats you randomly at the table once there are a full 6 or 9 players? Can you see in the lobby other tables running and have a chance to get on those tables?
What I'm picturing in my mind right now are half my tables breaking every 10 minutes. Granted tables break a lot right now but if I'm picturing this correctly I think it will be 3x as much as the current state bc everyone will be constantly trying to click new table in hopes of not missing out on the next fish.
I think the best solution is to ban all software, reward table starters with extra vpps, sit out one sit out all. Like people have stated before, if there's a threat to have your account banned or funds confiscated no one will run these Jesus seat programs.
On days where there are 4 or more table starters working at one stake there can be 30 or more tables running in an hour at 3-6. If you reward this productive behavior, there will be 4 or more willing to start all the time. This will make the games feel like 2006 again. With the software banned, and new tables starting every couple minutes or so the Jesus seat wont be occupied by the 2 most extreme bumhunters with the best script at every single table.
The thought of constantly getting seated at a reg only table and having it break every time makes me cringe. Tables break enough as it is we don't to add to it.

I use TableScan Turbo for basic game selection (not more than 2 pro-40bb-droolers on a table) and mostly to maintain 24 tables open. While 24-tabling, i don't have time to look for tables in the lobby and open them or join waitlists. Sure, some will say "play less tables", but that effects my and Stars' bottom-line. So, Stars, if you role out your Table-Starter-thingy - what you will for obv reasons (not for the benefit of the players, but for yours) - make at least the option to constantly maintain an amount of tables without clicking non-stop in the lobby.

The thing is that current enviroment when it goes to table starting is patological. Regs grimms me all the time or join and sit out, or join and set next to my right so they want to secure better position for the fish to come.
Same when the fish join the seat- scripters will take the best sits.

So currently table starters are getting punished for that by other players that try to use it for their advance. (fact is most of them wont start table with another reg).
There is the issue-patological situation when it goes to table starting and we need solution to fix it. Cause for now I would even take the proposed table started thing than playing the way it is now.

It doesn't reward people that table select most of the time it rewards bunch of scumbags (grimmers, seat scripters, ratholers,etc.)

+3.5

Where art thou Stars??????????

Open discussion they said...
made decision already they did...

honestly, **** you for consistently lying to us if this is true. I remember when stars was lauded for their integrity/honesty. how quickly times change



http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...&postcount=479

i honestly hope that lots of reg will go somewhere else (including me).

stronger 2nd tier sites is exactly what pokerstars needs.

**** you Stars and thx for the open discussion. I really appreciate this....not!

nobodys going anywhere until USA legalizes. then competition enters the market and all of these changes or lack of changes that the players want get handled in a swift and favorable manner

i can respect ruthless business but my frustration with tablestarters is i dont think anyone wins

http://translate.google.com/translat...75#post8982975

Hello Steve?

I'm fairly sure they expected a to find a mixed reception to the idea rather than the near unanimous opposition this thread has shown. With a mixed reception they could get rid of table selection and claim they did it after extensive discussion with players - even though they planned to do so regardless.

This thread was always just a facade, but now they've got themselves in a tough spot since if they go ahead with removing table selection it makes it would make it abundantly clear to even the most ardent believer in Stars 'integrity' that they indeed don't really care at all what players think now that they have their little monopoly.

When Steve does finally make his grand appearance with a novelesque mountain of text, I would encourage people -particularly those handful still 'keeping the faith'- to be sure to read between the lines.

I will still wait to hear from PS Steve (insert sound of crickets ) OR see it for myself on the site that I can no longer table select but if it either comes to fruition, I will withdraw for sure.

No big deal for the site but huge deal for me as I will have lost a lot of respect for them.

Maybe when the realize they c@#*'ed up and offer me ( and others who leave because regardless of what some say, I am sure I will not be the only one hitting the road ) a return bonus SELECTION4U, 100% up to 500, I will come back but until then, best of luck gentleman :P ( the bonus reflecting that once again, players will be able to table select and not be forced into the lottery seating system )

I hope all of the Mega Rake contributors, who were listed in this thread who were equally disgusted with the plans PS was going to implement, also stand up and leave but they have to do what is right for them.

Again, holding out 'some' hope that this Russian support email is still not 'official' and PS is still keeping an open mind but if the decision is written in stone...Thank You for wasting our time with this senseless thread.

EDIT - Just realized...this is from PS Russian support? I mean, what the hell are they talking about anyway, I thought 95% of the players from there buy in 40bb anyway. They have had "complaints"? That cannot be for real.

This 'I rake $xxx, I am very important to the site and I will leave for certain' argument have been used countless times but youre only important if you

- play in games that otherwise wouldnt be running

- are a net depositor

- play from seats that otherwise wouldnt be taken

I play Zoom so the table starter stuff dosn't effect me. I think it's kind of silly. But what would be more of a problem is if they resrict ratholing in Zoom when buying in for 100bb.

That statement has been indeed stated countless times and people have made good on their word. Stars has been taking their regulars for granted, especially since they picked up their little monopoly. But what has it gotten them? They've all but destroyed the reputation they spent nearly a decade building. And are they swimming in pools of new money? I doubt it. Given people have making good on their word to quit - Stars player figures have been plummeting rapidly, after years of rapid growth. As has been said now a days Stars are undoubtedly making more money per player - but they have far fewer players and instead of growing as a company they are now shrinking. A trend that is going to rapidly accelerate should they choose to remove table selection as it's the one thing keeping many of their players around - whether or not they (the players that is) realize it.

ill believe it when i see it

if it happens i look forward to seeing how the games are on party etc. i see a lot of midstakes plo players already at ongame anyway.

outside of it not happening, or it not being too hard to just rejoin tables 50 or 60 times in a row.... gg stars and thanks for all the fish

if this is correct then steve should be banned from 2p2
if it is incorrect then he should at least ****ing post in this thread

seriously steve, wtf?!?!
does your credibility mean nothing to you? your reputation? if removing seat and table selection happens then i hope that stars realise that you ****ed them in the arse as well as us and take an appropriate look at your employment situation

+1

As you dont provide actual numbers to back up this claim that net winners are more responsible for traffic declines than net losers I'd say its more due to the market has matured just like every market does eventually as well as black friday obviously made a great impact.

Read this thread - read any thread. People are quitting Stars left and right. Or just play in the games. I can't count the number of regs I've played thousands of hands against that just disappeared. Sure that's anecdotal but given the preponderance of it I think it's relevant. If you'd like a more objective figure look at the number of SNE - and that was in 2012 when they made it much easier for SNE to maintain their status.

Of course I'm not saying it's only regulars. The games are just terrible and I'd be very surprised if casual players weren't on the decline (at least compared to previous growth) as well. The huge rake means paired with low rewards means to show an edge in today's games you need not only be skilled at playing but also at seeking out weak opposition and defeating them as efficiently as possible - the fewer hands it takes you to beat them, the less rake you pay. That's going to lead to a terrible environment for new players. They not only get basically 0 rakeback as they'll be unlikely to put in sufficient volume but are faced by tons of players actively seeking them out - players that have become very skilled at destroying these players. Of course I'm sure combating that issue is Star's very idea with removing table selection but they're being incredibly short sighted there - that medicine is very likely to end up being much worse than the sickness. This terrible state of the games has been caused by the lack of edges available (as a result of high rake paired with increasing average skill) - making the max attainable edge even smaller certainly isn't going to cure it.

I'm hoping that message of table starters being implimented is not true. From a personal standpoint I think it would benefit me, but the way it's happened (if true) is just not right.

Steve started a thread in an act of good faith to open communication and has abandoned it. It appears that peoples protests about this change were never part of the consideration.

I would take a wild guess that this, and Lee Jone's "roundtable" threads, were indeed started in good faith by Steve and Lee (who both seem to be decent people), but their superiors have put their foot down, made this decision and blocked all further communication from them regarding these matters.

Hope Steve comes back to this thread and proves me wrong.

fwiw I'm a micro rec player and I've very recently left, for 888 of all places, the rakes higher and the rewards system is rubbish, but there are tables full of bad players with 70-100bb stacks, while my hands per hour has dropped and my raked bb/100 has gone up, my wr has gone up with it. I think poker for me now will be about multi-siting and concentrating on a good wr, I don't play a huge amount of volume anyway so **** knows why it's took me so long to realise that chasing silver/gold every month isn't the ideal plan for my circumstances.


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