Normally I don't believe in cheating ... but all of these hands just keep holding up:









EDIT:

Ah, I put a couple of the hands twice by mistake. The doubles are right next to each other though.

I bet villian was Russian.

Now my fav riggie theory

BTW those hands I posted two posts above this one are all from March of 2011 .... though they are far from all of the hands I played in March of 2011.

this is mostly wrong. I realise that it can be tempting to just 'make stuff up' on the internet, but your comments above are fundamentally wrong.

The Isle of Man, for example, is a democratic government with an independent judiciary. If you had ever contacted the regulatory body with a concern about how you were treated I'm sure you would have been satisfied with the process and resolution.

AFAIK, no one has ever started a thread on this forum complaining about how they or the issue they raised was treated by the IOM Gambling Commission. That says something in itself, imo.

Are you saying that you would have greater confidence in this if people living in certain regions had no chance of winning?

LOL

Ok this is long but here’s my take on online poker. First some background – I am NOT some newbie who just started playing poker last month. I have been playing & involved with poker for more than 45 years and have won more than my fair share at live poker games and online poker, both tournaments and ring games. I don’t have any illusions about being the greatest or most knowledgeable player around. But by the same token I’m not afraid to play in a large live game either. I grew up one mile from Churchill Downs (where they’ve been legally gambling long before there was even a place called Las Vegas) and my family ran the local B&M card club where there were some pretty big live games with many of the big name horse owners, trainers, jockeys & gamblers playing. Back then seven card stud was the game of choice. I started dealing at these games when I was 12 or 13 years old and playing at the smaller games when I was around 15. We had many good players, guys like Stu Unger show up to play in the big games when they were in town for the races. And I’d bet that many of the other well known “rounders” remember playing there at one time or another as well.

I am not at all comfortable on computers and my typing skills are easily the worst, so I usually don’t participate in posting on any online forums/discussions although I do routinely read them. But I feel compelled to spend the time to compose this post in order to foster positive change in the online poker industry, which from reading many of the posts currently has a less than sterling reputation. I’m sure I have every poker book ever published in my library and I’ve read every one & studied the good ones. What I lack in computer skills I more than make up for by being blessed with above average math skills. I’m pretty sure that even at my age I can still calculate outs, pot odds, EV, etc faster than 98% of the players.

When online poker started becoming popular in the 1990’s the lure of being able to “play in my pajamas at home” was enticing so I decided to sign up for an account I believe around 1997. Since my family lost a LARGE amount of money before I was born in the Stock Market crash of 1929 I was raised to trust no one with my money, especially “those banks”. So being somewhat skeptical about sending my money to some unknown and unregulated company in a foreign country I decided to make a small initial deposit of $20 at Party Poker just to “try it out”. I started winning and since U.S. players could use Neteller back then it was easy to move all or part of my bankroll from one site to another. I had accounts at all the major poker sites and cashed out winnings from every one. By the time the UIGEA went into effect I had cashed out thousands of dollars, all from my original $20 deposit including a real nice cash in one of the big Sunday guarantee tournaments. I wasn’t comfortable leaving a fairly large bankroll (by my standards) deposited with any online site so I usually cashed out most of the winnings at least to Neteller. But then my suspicions about trusting them with my money was confirmed when Neteller froze my funds same as they did for all U.S. players. I eventually did get my funds returned but only after waiting more than a year. After the Neteller fiasco I still had a relatively small amount of money on deposit at Pokerstars and Full Tilt and I decided to just play with it. Since then my “luck” has been so bad that it is scary.

I have read a lot about the “online poker is rigged” speculation. Here’s my take on it after more than 12 years experience – I am 100% certain that not all players currently have the same fair chance to win at either PokerStars or Full Tilt and here is why:

1) I continue to read the posts laughing at the skeptics because the believers claim that the online poker sites must be ethical because they “have too much to lose”. This is the most ridiculous argument I have ever heard. These sites are clearly lacking in ethics as they are willfully, knowingly and blatantly violating the laws of the United States by allowing players from that country to play even though they KNOW IT IS ILLEGAL. Thus it is a given that Pokerstars and Full Tilt Poker have questionable ethics before we even discuss poker hands and outcomes. It is no secret how the United States government would like to prosecute the people behind these sites for breaking the law. I personally believe that players should legally have the right to choose where and how to spend their entertainment dollars. But the fact is that online poker for real money is still illegal in the U.S.
2) Anyone who believes that money – especially in large sums – will not influence people to commit seriously immoral and unethical acts is just a naïve idiot. Look at the elaborate schemes concocted by executives at companies like Enron & Tyco in order to screw people out of large sums of money. Bernie Madoff shafted thousands of people including his friends because of greed. Since there are obviously huge sums of money involved in online poker, greed alone dictates that there is a real probability that “questionable and unethical” things will happen. One only need to look at Absolute Poker for evidence of how far the people involved in the online poker sites will stoop ethics wise when large sums of money are involved. The old gamblers like Doyle and Slim still talk about how far the cheaters and thieves would go in a live poker game to get the money. The online poker sites operate in a complete vacuum. They operate without any legitimate regulation or oversight (lmao at some ridiculous KannyWhacky gaming commission). We are supposed to just accept their “promise” that things are ethical. I personally cannot count the number of times I’ve seen players attempt to cheat in live poker. Any player who just assumes it doesn’t happen in online poker is not only narrow minded, but just downright stupid. I personally know several kids who play at our live games who claim to have a good way of “beating the game” (cheating). I don’t know if it’s true or not but they do always seem to have plenty of cash, although they’re not that good at live poker. I’m pretty sure that collusion is part of their scheme, but I don’t play at the same limits or tables as they do so I have no dog in that fight. I do know that Full Tilt Poker even goes so far as to address suspicions about the integrity of online poker in its television commercials and has one of its paid shill pros try to make light of the situation.
3) The online poker sites are like all businesses, they’re about making money. They’re primary concerns are about the rake and continued deposits. Many believe that the players that have the most “luck” are the players that deposit the most money. My experience is that once the online poker sites knew there was a good chance I would cash out my winnings, they FOR SURE influenced the outcome so they could retain the money until they could grind it out in rake. There can be no other explanation for why I was able to slowly but consistently win before UIGEA, why I still continue to win at live poker, but have been rarely able to win online for the last several years other than mini amounts that don’t matter. The online poker sites are all about keeping the deposits flowing in. Every bit of their advertising and marketing is geared at deposits. They constantly offer what at first appears to be very attractive deposit bonuses and depositor freerolls. Is anybody really stupid enough to think they will give you a large deposit bonus and then realistically allow you to win with it? No! It doesn’t work that way. The casinos don't offer bonuses do they? No because it doesn't make any sense. Online poker is all about greed. Their intent is to grind every dollar out in rake and they’ll do whatever it takes to continue the almighty rake. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying that nobody ever wins and nobody ever cashes out. That would become apparent immediately. But I am saying that the number of players who do so is very small. They have to have SOME players who publicly win or else everybody would figure out quick what is going on. I read about all the “pros” who claim they are making large sums of money at online poker. It’s like the live players who brag about winning almost every session and then try to hit you up for a stake or a loan. My guess is that most are not telling the whole truth and the percentage that actually does win AND gets the money out is very small compared to the number of players. I’d guess it probably is less than 1% of the players. Of course they will make sure their paid shill pros have positive outcomes. But I’ve heard many successful name pros complain at the live games about how bad their “luck” is online. The bottom line is it’s all about getting and keeping the money and if you believe they won’t do whatever it takes to assure that you’re going to be in for a rude surprise.
4) The believers also use the logic that hand history and statistics assure the integrity of online poker. Again this argument carries no weight. I have been around the game long enough to know that it would be very easy to influence the outcome of ANY POKER GAME without altering the statistics beyond acceptable variance. I mean really how hard would it be in any live game to ensure a desired outcome if the dealer was allowed to go into the back room to shuffle the cards, deal the flop, river & turn? Nobody in their right mind would EVER play in such a game. But EVERY HAND at online poker is dealt and played exactly that way.
5) My hand history and statistics. As stated, I am not good with computers. And unfortunately I didn’t start saving my hand history/statistics until it became apparent that something was wrong. There was a very clear change in my “luck” over the way things happen live or early on in my online poker play. At first I chalked it up to a run of bad luck. But after several years and many thousands of hands played a clear and recognizable pattern started to emerge. So my nephew, who is also a poker player and computer programmer for a government contractor created a database and spreadsheet for me to track my results. The following is my real data since I started keeping track. The data was startling but not surprising to me. Although I won’t hesitate to go to a live game and buy-in for as much as $1,000, I only play online for small stakes for the reasons outlined above. Most of the statistics are from hands played at small buy-in (less than $25 buy-in) MTT’s.
Total # Hands Played = 12,976
Total # Flops Seen = 2,552 (19.67%)
Total # Hands Won = 1,164 (8.97%)
Total # Hands To Showdown = 657 (5.06%)
Total # Showdowns Won = 289 (2.23%)
% Showdowns Seen Won = 43.99%
# Hands I was dealt pocket AA = 26 (0.20%)
# Hands my pocket AA Won = 8 (30.77%)
Pocket AA = Negative EV
# Hands I received pocket KK = 51 (0.39%)
# Hands my pocket KK Won = 31 (60.78%)
Pocket KK = Negative EV
# Nut Flushes I made & Won with = 1

Now lets discuss the above stats. The number of hands played is what it is, although I suspected something was surely amiss long before I started compiling the data. The number of total hands won is almost unbelievable. The 8.97% cannot be real since every player at a nine handed table should have the same 11.11% chance of winning. But many of the hands I’ve played were short handed. The fewer players seated at the table, the higher % chance each player has of winning. For example at a five handed table every player should have the same 20% chance of winning. My number of flops seen is also ridiculously low. I believe that seeing 19.67% of the flops would be playing too tight at a 9 handed table (that is basically just averaging seeing the flop every time I’m in the blinds). But considering I’ve went deep in several of the tournaments, a fair share of the hands I’ve played were at short handed tables. So the flops seen % should be considerably higher. I usually play a reasonably tight aggressive game and the reasons for the low percentage of flops seen are the proliferation of small cards. Every player at every table should have the same chance to receive an Ace or King as they do to receive a 2 or 3 preflop. However according to my count I am averaging receiving just under one and one half deuces/treys preflop for every one Ace/King I get dealt. This just cannot be right over a sample of approx 13,000 hands. Every good player knows that seeing a lot of flops with small cards is a fast way to go broke. So my higher than average number of small cards preflop makes seeing the flop an unacceptable risk thereby causing the low % of flops I’ve seen. Another statistic that really bothers me is the % of showdowns that I’ve won. If playing at a 9 handed table, EVERY PLAYER at the table should have an 11.11% chance to turn over the best cards. And yet I can only turn over the best cards 2.23% of the time. Sure many hands are won without going to showdown. But generally in order to win big pots a player needs to win at showdown. In order to win a tournament a player will need to win several large pots at showdown. It is impossible for any player to consistently win if they can only threaten to turn over the best cards less than once every 40 hands. It is only possible to bluff if there is a real threat that the bluffer will turn over the best cards. Also if I am only turning over the best cards 2.23% of the time, that means that there must be other players who are consistently winning way more than their fair share of hands. I also win well less than half of the hands that ultimately go to showdown. I attribute that to the higher than expected number of second best hands coming from way behind to win on the river. I know from my live poker experience that suck-outs happen. But catching a two outer on the river (approx 19:1 underdog) is a rarity at live poker, while expected at online poker. I have not made a deposit at either PS or FTP since the Neteller fiasco and therefore I FIRMLY BELIEVE that they have zero intention of allowing me to win so I could cash out any more of their equity. And I’ll bet there are thousands more players like me who FIRMLY BELIEVE the same thing. But the one statistic that is more than troubling is my Nut Flush winnings. How is it possible to only win one hand with a nut flush out of 12,976 ? I’ll bet you’d be more than skeptical if you only made a nut flush and won with it once every 13,000 hands? And by the way, don’t try to justify or explain the statistics due to the low stakes I play online. The cards have no idea how many chips are on the table and the statistics should run true regardless of the limits. I will say however that there is one very good upside to my unbelievably long run of BAD LUCK online – every time I play live poker I feel like the luckiest player in the world. In reality I am just getting the normal distribution of cards I should expect and my best hands actually hold up like they’re supposed to. But it SEEMS too good to be true.

I have already covered some of the reasons why I believe there is unethical activity at online poker. Greed is the number one reason. Every day some idiot walks into a bank risking their life and other peoples with a gun in order to rob them for a couple thousand dollars. To expect people in an unregulated business with a real low risk opportunity to pilfer millions of dollars to NOT take advantage is just plain blind and stupid. As Gordon Gekko said in Wall Street, “you’re blind walking around without a cane”. Eventually online poker will be legalized AND REGULATED by legitimate sources in the United States. I believe before that happens many of the players trusting these unregulated overseas sites with large sums of money are going to get a surprise when their money does a “Madoff” and just disappears.

Now lets discuss the ways the online poker sites could manipulate the outcome without straying beyond acceptable variance or creating undue suspicion.
1) People talk about bots and everybody seems to be worried that other players might be using them. But nobody seems to address the issue that an online poker site could use them to earn extra money above the rake without drawing any suspicion at all. If I sit down at a live game I can look around the table and see the player sitting in each seat. But how can anybody be sure that every player at an online table is in fact a real player? I mean all you can see is some “cartoon character” that may or may not represent a real player. What would prevent any online poker site from using “ghost players”? They could use one and have it win exactly as probability would dictate thereby drawing no scrutiny and allowing them to not only keep the rake, but also the winnings. How do you know that the last time you got knocked out of an online poker tournament it was by a real player and not a “ghost player” placed by the site? If the “ghost player” wins the tournament or even just cashes the house takes not only the rake, but also the prize money. Since poker is played online in a vacuum and every players true identity is kept secret, there would be NO WAY to discover the discrepancy. If I had to make a guess I would venture to say that this is a certainty to happen. The online poker sites only allow their random number generator to be inspected. But who knows whether every seat at your table is occupied by a real player?
2) It would be very easy for them to manipulate the outcome and skew the win statistics without drawing suspicion. The poker sites count a chopped pot as a win. They count everybody folding to your big blind as a win. In my case, even though my hand win % is already low, it is much lower than it appears due to the higher than normal number of times I “win” a chop or everybody fold to my blinds. Most of my hands won are small pots. I lose the big pots and win the small ones way more often than I do in live play. The online sites know if you are using tracking software to track the cards & statistics. Every time they do an “update”, they scan your hard drive and know every program installed on your computer. If you don’t believe me read the fine print in the user agreement.
3) Bait. Bait?? Yes. You know what I’m talking about. It’s when you are set-up by being dealt a made hand that no player would ever fold only to have it come up second best. My best example was in the last big event I played online where I was dealt AA preflop and raised with the blinds getting big. I was happy when I got called by the maniac at the table that was playing almost every hand (I hadn’t seen the flop more than three times in the last 20 hand). I made a set of Aces on an A97 rainbow board and checked. The maniac made a half pot bet so I raised. He reraised me all-in and I couldn’t call fast enough. He turned over a set of 9’s and I was 100% certain about what was going to happen and so are you. He caught the one outer 9 to make quads on the river. I know that bad beats happen, but it is almost guaranteed that it happens TO ME in a huge pot that could lead to a large cash. Never happens FOR me though in a large pot. The last 7 tournaments I’ve got knocked out with my big pocket pair preflop running into either pocket AA or KK. One of them was when I had KK preflop ON THE BUBBLE and got knocked out when I ran into the usual AA preflop. I run into AA preflop better than once every 50 hands while I’m dealt AA preflop about once every 500 hands? My pocket AA ends up winning once every 1442 hands?? Does that sound reasonable to you? How ethical would you think they are if that kind of “luck” happened to you?
4) Ever notice how at almost every tournament there is one player at the table who seems to be able to win almost every hand regardless of their pocket cards? You watch them get it all-in time and again against players who usually have better hands and yet they still win. It’s like they see almost every flop and double up at will. Then when you finally wake up with a playable hand they turn over AA. How come this happens TO ME but never FOR ME? The online sites have a vested interest in seeing that the bad (ghost?) player knocks out the good players who probably would cash out their winnings.

Now lets talk about what needs to happen to ensure the fairness and ethics of online poker. There is one very simple way of 100% preventing any online poker site from influencing the outcome. It is called third party shuffling. Currently the poker sites control the money AND the cards. They have the opportunity to influence the outcome and the monetary motivation to do so. With third party shuffling, the poker site would control the players, BUT NOT THE CARDS. A third party agent is used to shuffle and provide the cards. The poker site doesn’t know what cards are coming and to whom they are going. The third party shuffling agent doesn’t know who the players are or how the betting is going. It is a win-win for the poker sites AND for the players. The players know they are being dealt a fair game and the poker sites no longer have to worry about a tarnished reputation. But there’s one big problem. The online poker sites WILL NOT consider this system and I know why. Anybody else figure it out? It’s WAY more profitable for them to control the money AND THE CARDS. Their reluctance to adopt such a system is proof positive that they want to influence the outcome. Otherwise why would they not seriously consider such a system. I know why and so do you.

My intent in publishing this is that a system is developed so that every online player will have confidence that they have the same fair chance as every other player.

I will not publish any hand history as I play live poker for reasonable stakes and I am not interested in providing data on my playing style, hand ranges and betting/raising patterns. That is the same reason why I won’t disclose my identity, whether my real name or my online moniker. Plus I believe I would suffer further retaliation at the hands of the online poker operators. I understand that there are “believers” who wouldn’t change their opinion of or allegiance to online poker even if there was positive evidence to the contrary. But I am tired of the usual posts making fun of any player who has an opinion that there is some ethics issues with online poker. Everybody asks for statistics as proof. That is what I provided. I also understand that the “know-it-alls” will try to explain about how I am using too small of a sample to come close to reaching true expectation blah blah blah. Maybe so, but my “luck” has been so rotten online it is hard to believe and it has been that way for several years. I only wish I had been tracking my statistics for a longer period. I am certain that they would be even more unbelievable.

Good luck to the unlucky players. May god curse you with losing to a hundred one-outers if you are already "winning" so you know how it feels.

That is ridiculously long. I don't care enough about this joke thread to actually spend my time reading all of that ..... especially since I noticed that any work you did was over a sample of like 12K hands. That's a fairly statistically meaningless sample size. It takes me like 17 hours to play that many hands so collecting a bigger sample size is not difficult.

EDIT:

Happened to glance your third party shuffling thing. Third party creates accounts with the poker site and then program the shuffle to favor their own accounts. Obviously this would still be noticeable through analyzing the hand histories .... but just because a third party shuffles doesn't mean the third party will shuffle fairly.

You are missing the point of a regulatory body. Its not primarily to intervene in issues between players and the site, but to protect both the player and the site in all ways. Protecting players from players and the site, as well as protecting the site from the players and the site itself.

Take the Nevada gaming commission and you'll see a proper example of a regulatory commission engaging in their responsibilities:

1 - A list of excluded or criminally sought after cheaters, hackers, etc is publicly maintained and coordinated with law enforcement. See: http://gaming.nv.gov/loep_main.htm How many cheaters has the IOM sought criminal charges against? Where's the list of excluded and criminally sought cheaters?

2 - A list of penalized, revoked or otherwise unsuitable organizations and individuals who sought regulation but were ultimately refused or revoked. See: http://gaming.nv.gov/documents/pdf/d...tions_list.pdf Transcripts of the proceedings and other material specifying exactly what they were denied/revoked are also available upon request.

3 - A publicly available list of all complaints related towards a site, or the players of a site. See:http://gaming.nv.gov/complaints.htm or http://gaming.nv.gov/documents/pdf/complaint_1005.pdf for the complaint regarding somebody dancing on the high stakes baccarat tables that was reported in NVG.

4 - Surprise inspections of both the hardware and the software of a sites' operations with procedures and results both made publicly available. See: http://www.gaming.nv.gov/documents/p...lines_0109.pdf / http://gaming.nv.gov/Web%20Trial%20L...tering_etc.pdf /etc for examples of procedure , http://gaming.nv.gov/documents/pdf/a...v_overview.pdf for a brief. And http://gaming.nv.gov/publications.htm / http://gaming.nv.gov/documents/pdf/nonrestrict_full.pdf or any agenda (such as http://gaming.nv.gov/documents/pdf/0...genda_disp.pdf) for a list of not only for certified operators, but also their names/address and a constant update on any pending changes to their status.

Taking the Isle of Man I can find basically no public information. I see no list of revoked or refused licenses. Have they ever refused or revoked a license or have they accepted every single licensee who approached them? I see a mention of 188 player complaints against sites in one of their few reports with a mention of a number of them remaining unresolved, but no public record of the complaints or resolution.

Their auditing process and information seems to be limited to this: http://www.gov.im/lib/docs/gambling/...rification.pdf which lays out the super harsh penalty of a fine not to exceed $5,000 if a site operator doesn't abide by one of their regulations. To say nothing of the fact that that verification is obviously basically 100% geared towards lottery type games.

It does indeed seem to be just another regulation for sale scheme.

Wow, I really have to say - third party shuffling sounds like one of the best ideas I've heard. I'm really surprised nobody else has suggested it before. It takes away all potential motivation to manipulate the deal from the business doing the dealing, substantially eases the burden of technology put upon site operators and protects players all in one. The third party could trivially audit that the cards they dealt were the ones being used by the site, actually even players could do so by submitting a hand to the third party site which could then instantaneously/automatically verify that was indeed what was dealt.

When poker is regulated and we start seeing some real competition it would be an even bigger benefit to players and site operators. The players wouldn't have to worry about the integrity of smaller sites, and the smaller sites wouldn't have to worry about the complexities of ensuring a completely unpredictable and fair RNG.

This is a very legitimate point, no system will ever be 100% secure. I am sitting here touting the merits of the The Nevada Gaming Commission, yet one of the biggest cheating scandals in slots came from one of the primary agents of NGC turning 'rogue'. During inspections of slot machines he was actually injecting software that allowed him to cheat the machines.

However, there is one huge difference here with a third party. The business of the third party has zero motivation to cheat. There will always be a motivation for individuals representing the third party to cheat, but this is massively more challenging to accomplish and generally more trivial to detect.

Right now there is a massive motivation for the sites to rig the deal. If new players run well at the beginning of their career they are more likely to end up addicted to gambling. If bad players stick around longer the not only pay rake longer but also bring in more grinder type players seeking to exploit the 'softer' games, in turn resulting in substantially more games and rake overall.

For a third party dealing the cards there would be zero motivation for the company itself to cheat. They get paid based exclusively on how they deal the cards. Who wins or loses at the end of the day is irrelevant for their bottom line.

Actually it would be practically impossible for the third party site to cheat. The sites being serviced by this third party dealer would have access to complete information, all 52 cards that would have been dealt out and their order. With this it becomes trivial to perform a wide array of randomness analysis. The reason players can't perform such tests on their own right now is that we only get to see 2 cards. Any time we see more than this, there are massive and unpredictable biases in play.

Man, I really don't see why this hasn't been done yet. It could also be used by the wide array of online casinos currently out there ensuring their integrity from a player perspective to ensure the site isn't cheating them, and their security from a site perspective to ensure the players aren't cheating them, as well.

You should've kept the idea to yourself "igotscrewed" and started a business around it. If a startup in this business wasn't already being created it certainly will be now! I wonder what the legal status of such a business would be. Imagine of they could be based and regulated in a generally trusted location such as the US. It seems selling randomness used primarily for [what the DOJ considers to be] illegal gambling seems like it should be no more illegal than selling bongs used primarily for smoking illegal substances. The latter being completely legal if the cultural reference is lost on anybody.

FTP had to crank up the doomswitch. They were getting their asses handed to them and actually still are from PS. It's total greed and nothing more. I have been playing for 4 hours and am going through my endless AK losing to A4, AA to A10 every way the site can crush me it does. Knowing they are totally in no danger of prosecution. It's fine. It's coming to an end. Good ol man boobs himself Howard is aligning himself with the people he has to and is probably hiring good lawyers and accountants since he will actually have to start paying taxes now.

Ok, Chicken Little. If Howard Lederer wasn't paying taxes already, he'd be in PMITA prison. The IRS doesn't **** around.

How exactly does the IRS have jurisdiction over something happening offshore? Or know the true amount Howard takes in from that site?

BTW another late run in a tourney and my AA goes down to KQ yet again. 70 and 80% hands losing 80% of the time. I have no shot even before the cards are dealt.

Hmm I guess I work for Bodog because they love me and give me the suckouts. Amazing. They send me paychecks in the mail. I take an occasional bad beat to keep people from noticing. Nah seriously, this thread has been going on for 3 years. If you think that its rigged then why the hell would you play. This is absurd. You have to be an awful player to begin to think like this. You obviously don't know how to play a high variance game. I'm just spewing words now because I don't even know how to begin to respond to this. Good day.

Yet you continue to play....really says all anyone needs to know about you really.

U.S. citizens have to pay U.S. income taxes on income from foreign based businesses. That's how the IRS has jurisdiction.

To find out how much they could probably look at things such as Full Tilt's earnings statements and Howard's interest in the company. They could also follow the money trail as the money has to be transferred around. Look at Howard's bank accounts, his spending habits, etc. If they decided to they could audit him and they would spend a lot of time and resources poking into everything.



Also:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...ostcount=31105


69ish hands were the favorite won. So we have your one hand where AA lost to KQ and 69 hands where the favorite won. Perhaps it is rigged in favor of the favorites ....

Made a false assumption.

Actually .... I have absolutely no affiliation with Leggopoker, the training site.

Check out this thread (proves it pretty clearly):

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/55...g-site-449450/



You know what they say about making assumptions. Maybe you should look into things before making accusations and snide comments.

wrong

Not at all, I'm just surprised it hasn't received any comment yet in this thread.

Fwiw, it's no more suspicious to me than someone from the Isle of Wight winning

if it isn't suspicious, why bring it up?

Josem - Sorry if it offended/upset you, not my intention. This being the poker is rigged debate, I thought I'd tweak the riggies up with another morsel for them to hang their hopes on.

I'm just surprised the foil hats have not already been all over this like a cheap suit.

Once again, sorry if it brushed you up the wrong way

i'm not offended in the least.