I had a look around and couldn't find a previous thread for this. FTP as we all know don't allow rakeback on existing accounts and don't allow the opening of new accounts. They make occasional retagging exceptions for accounts that have never been associated with an affiliate, but the vast majority of us will have clicked on a banner or used a bonus code to sign up and won't have this option available to us.

Many of us opened FTP accounts years ago when we were new to poker and had no idea what we were doing. It doesn't matter whether we're breakeven grinders or boywonder, playing full time on a site without rakeback is throwing money away and those who can't get it simply don't play on the site in question. Perhaps FTP are under the impression they will get our play anyway without rakeback, but in almost all instances I think this is incorrect. It's my belief that FTP are in fact losing massive amounts of revenue due to this policy, and I'm hoping to use this thread to draw their attention to that fact with some actual numbers.

With the arrival of rush poker FTP have the opportunity to take a lot of business away from PS and other sites if only they would rethink this policy, and a number of possible solutions do exist.

So the plan is, not only do we add our name to this thread by posting, but also our approximate annual rake and a running total, the running total to be amended by adding our own rake to the total in the previous post. I think we will get a tally into the millions just from this thread, and FTP will hopefully bear in mind that they should multiply that numbers many times over as only a small percentage of their player pool frequent this subforum.

A few notes about this thread:

1) I read the FAQ and checked the rules on posts regarding rakeback. I believe this thread is okay since it isn't concerned with rakeback providers, deals or comparisons between sites, and certainly I'm not an affiliate myself. It's simply a request for FTP to examine their policy regarding allowing new accounts, and I note that many posts along these lines are permitted in other FTP related threads. In any event I sincerely hope this thread is okay as it could be tremendously beneficial to a great many players on this forum if it makes a difference.

2) I'm obv in no position to dictate who posts where but I nevertheless kindly request that nobody post in this thread unless they are adding their own rake totals. Commentary is welcome when posting numbers by all means, but if it's commentary only I ask that you don't clutter the thread with it. There's always at least one FTP chatter type thread on the go.

3) Most people will have a fairly good idea of how much they rake either from PT/HEM, or from being tracked elsewhere for RB. If you don't know what your rake numbers actually are then an approximation is fine, but please be conservative, I don't want the thread to lose credibility because everyone is posting best case scenario numbers.

Okay so I'll start:

Yearly Rake: $85000

Running Total: $85000

The gist of the problem is that Full Tilt signed a contract with the association that you and others clicked a banner with and it is them that are profiting. They can't just break their agreement. But, I agree something should be done, but I just don't know what.

There are a few solutions to this that don't involve breaking those agreements, plus FTP don't rigidly adhere to their own rules on this anyway. I'm happy to get into this conversation in a different thread, but as per above is it possible to keep debate out of this thread?

sighned 3betu on ftp idk i prolly rake them 1500 -2k a year.small stakes player without rakeback.

Really?

yea this is the first "petition" in the history of 2+2!

I mean in this form, ie petition with rake totals. Obv there are tons of general threads about the problem.

Seems like it's not going to be possible for this thread to run without other discussion, so can I just ask that anyone posting their numbers + new total bolds it so the next guy doesn't have to hunt for it.

maybe dont play on FT?and im sure ft dosent care at all about any petition made on here

The point is for people who are raking somewhere other than FTP to post their totals, ie money that FTP would be getting if they they were to move their play there. If you're playing there anyway without rakeback it should prob even be a minus...

I don't play on FTP, other than occasional donkaments. But if I could get rakeback I would move all my play there now they have rush. IDK if they will care or not, but if it becomes apparent that they're losing tens of millions in rake I'd hope they would care.

Apologies, misunderstood your post! In that case:

Yearly Rake: $2000

Running Total: $87000

Ok i understand now.probley give around 2kish in rake to stars a year.guessing but believe iam close.if anything thats a conserative #

email them telling them ull move ur play over and idk give them what u pay in rake or something

Okay ty, I've edited last post.

Why not petition for Stars to give rakeback? I know I know, their reward program is just like rakeback. Well it's NOT!!!!

You're right. It's not. It's better than rakeback.

Dont think op wanted to start a debate about rakeback!!! plenty of those threads.

ORLY? Only if you are a high volume player. But us small stakes grinders, I'd rather have rakeback.

Well, he should realize that FullTilt has no problems giving rakeback, but the affiliate he signed up with won't let that happen. Why can't people understand that? Hence, if you want rakeback, find your affiliate and request for a rakeback through them.

FFS, we've had these debates a million times, and your info is not correct anyway. There have been plenty of people that have had their affiliate agree to release them (because the affiliate got a one-time CPA payment and couldn't give them RB if they wanted to), and FT wouldn't budge. Let it go.

Also I'm pretty sure FTP won't tell you who your affiliate is. Most people have no idea who they're tracked to, in my case I probably clicked on a random banner five years ago.

Anyway I'm aware there are a lot of points up for debate here, but as above there are numerous existing threads on this, including some active ones. There are also better places to discuss stars VIP program. I really just envisaged the purpose of this thread being to list our own rake numbers and tally them in the hopes FTP might take note of actual numbers. IDK if that's a realistic hope, but if there's a 1% possibility it influences them it's worth a try, and cluttering up the thread with other observations even if they're good points makes that more difficult.

So to keep it on track we're here:

Running Total: $87000

I like this petition....no debates just numbers guys....

Rake Paid: $3000

Total: $90000

yes they can....

signed

rake paid: ~ 40k
Total: $130,000

signed
rake paid ~10k
total : 140,000

For me its easy. I asked for rakeback. I got the response that I was tied up with an affiliate, who does not offer rb.

So I moved to stars.
Fulltilt future rake=$0. Affiliate income=$0.


for 2008,
rake paid: $6500