also for reference my stars xfer history:

This about sums it up. I mean what are we supposed to do? What recourse do we have? This is pretty much the most silly thing I've ever seen. There's really no point in emailing them anymore because all they're going to say is "can't release info on other ppl's accounts due to our privacy policy"

bump

so confused. When I deposit on Stars, it fells like about 3 weeks before I can transfer funds, and I'm assuming that Stars is verifying that the funds were legit.

how does this happen? How are some people depositing bad echecks then xferring money? Is it a bad echeck/chip dump/ xferr combo?

Why can't FTP and Stars work together on this? Shouldn't FTP be able to reverse the transfers as well? I mean, it's an obvious scam.

I'm in talks with scotty, it doesn't seem like it's going anywhere...but at least he's talking to me.

I just don't understand how players can play with fraudulent funds received via echecks or whatever, and we the honest poker players can be expected to know this somehow.

My theory: They allow players to play on credited funds before confirmation in hopes that
A.) the check clears
B.) the check bounces but the player has won money and they can simply deduct cash from their account and let them continue paying rake.
C.) the check bounces the player has dumped or lost their fraudulent funds, pokerstars finds out where the funds went and fist****s everyone else who ever played with or transfered with the fraudulent funds.

Correct me where i'm wrong.

another question that needs answering is how stars determined what transfers and how much of the transfers with ivanm/barry1212 would be sent back to ivanm. Because it appears we all traded with them around Dec. 21. All of us were contacted about the "disputed transfers." However, only certain ppl had their funds transferred back, and for some, only part of the total transfer was sent back. There seems to be no consistency in how different players in the same situation were treated.

Jesus christ this is bull****. I hope you guys are able to get Stars to reverse this or at least change the policy. You guys should xpost this in other forums as others need to be warned. Pretty much anybody would've fallen for this.

Good luck and let me know if there's anything I can do to help.

tbh I think you guys should ask a zoo mod to edit the title- so this stars specific issue reads as such. they're going to say in all likelihood it's not their issue- that you lost the money on another site- but the way they handled it absolutely makes it their issue. they've given you no reason to believe or understand their position aorn.

Stars- how does a transfer with one account name go back to someone else? There's no excuse not to give some non-player specific details that clarify the why.

also... bump.

Have any of you tried to dispute the FTP transfer?

Surely FTP can take the same stance that Pokerstars has and return your transfer on FTP.

Maybe they could, but its now been several weeks since we initially got involved with these players. If it was ever an option I can't see it being one now.

I've talked to scotty. He says he's talking with his manager tomorrow about whether he can post in the thread. He assures me that the head of security has seen this thread and i s looking into the matter. I've also asked to post the PM convos we've had, and he said he'll let me know tomorrow. Hopefully we can get some friggin clarity in here.

Its worth a shot. The money may be gone on FTP but at least you can try and get the accounts shut down/prevent another cashout.

^fwiw, i just sent ftp an email, can't hurt anything

After all this is said and done I will be emailing FTP with the email history with PokerStars and the two screenshots I posted. I don't expect to get anything back but I do want their names added to their list of known scammers.

Just posting in this thread so it's known that this issue and it's resolution is important to more then just the players involved.

Pokerstars, please DO post an explanation in this thread. Thank you.

The sheer lack of response and protection of information to players involved here is horrendous. The reputation of Stars is being serverely tranished here imo, if they still refuse to give any help, I don't see how they believe this will be okay. People have been scammed of a good amount of money here, and I only know one player who has been scammed, but id assume the others also have good track records with transfers and the pokersite.

Stars really need to step it up here because its pretty appaling, they dont involve in disputed transfers generally, yet this is exactly what they have done for the scammer(s?) here, right..?

This is a horrible scam and this guy or these guys, whatever, need to be pressed at all costs by stars for the good of their rep, as i previously mentioned and the name of online poker in general i think..

Really hope this gets sorted out guys :/

indeed stevie indeed.

got an email from stars:

Hello Levi,

Thank you for your email. Firstly, I do wish to apologize for the handling of this matter which may appear as though
it could have been handled considerably better and in the majority of cases would probably have been done so. This
particular matter, at a great inconvenience to yourself has been more complex than our standard hack claims due to
the number of accounts involved and numerous transfers. We are trying to get to the bottom of the matter.

You are correct in noting our stance that we do not get involved were any inter-site deals are made. In this instance
the funds that were transferred to your account originate from fraudulent deposits to account 'Barry1212’
and ‘ivanm’. The entire balance that was transferred to your account and subsequently removed from you originated
from fraudulent deposits in account ‘ivanm’.

If this had been an inter-site transfer between yourself and ‘ivanm’, were player ‘ivanm’ reported that he had not
received the funds form you, we would not have become involved. Because the funds that were transferred to your
account originated from fraudulent deposits we have no option but to get involved and recover the funds were possible.

Again, I do understand that this is of no consolation to yourself since you have undoubtedly lost funds through
transfers upon Full Tilt. I am also sure that you have been in communication with Full Tilt regarding this matter. I
am happy to provide any assistance to a Full Tilt investigation in the hope that there may be some measure of
restitution for your losses. f they do need our assistance in anyway, please have them contact me directly.

Again, I am sorry for your loss and the inconvenience you have suffered. If you have any further questions for me,
please do nto hesitate to contact me.


Regards,

Jason
PokerStars Security Team

p.s. also, ftp security already got back to me (wow fastest time ever?) and said they will look into it, i also forwarded them this email saying that stars security will work with them if they need anything

hey did I call the "you lost the money on the other site" right or what.

edit: just going to say still not clear enough. they should clarify how a hack claim comes into play when they apparently returned all the money to one account despite two accounts making the xfers. did a large xfer to the hacker's own account not get noticed at first? did he play thru the money before passing it on if he just xferred to himself? was it a chip dump?

After looking on sharkscope some images.

Before this scam:



byllis after scam:



ibetforthewin after scam:



As you can clearly see from the above two images, its the same person playing on both accounts. They're playing the same games, same stakes. I should note that the scammer managed to cash a total of 0 times between the two accounts combined.

Ivanm after scam:



And now the best 2

SharkScope after scam:



Barry1212 after scam:



I think the last image deserves the most attention. Despite being involved in a big scam barry1212 is allowed to keep playing... uh wat?

I did a trade with this guy too and pokerstars froze my account.


2+2: BIGjayslick
pokerstars: ivanm
fulltilt: ibetforthewin


I emailed full tilt and they responded saying thats the risk you take and we don't encourage these types of trades.

I just emailed stars my id today.

well at least barry1212 is still able to enjoy the world's largest online poker room, with more poker games at every level, bigger tournaments and more players than any other site. Seriously stars? this guy's account is still open and he is playing with OUR money?

Unfortunately, even if stars and ftp worked together to freeze the ftp accounts I don't think there's any money left on those accounts to seize