Last night at The Wynn there were < 10 games going. This is not an anomaly. At one point it was down to six games. IIRC, it's the start of Chinese New Year, it's a 3day weekend, and none of those are the reason why, they're just the reasons why it's even more confounding that the room is dead. But it's been dead. For a very long time.

I've been in Las Vegas for over 3 years, coming here since Wynn opened. I've seen the trends of poker populations. Here's the bottom line; The manager of the Wynn poker room does not seem to exhibit the desire and work ethic specific to poker to do the job. She doesn't entertain ideas that build player bases and above all else she doesn't understand Las Vegas poker. I am sure she is more than capable of running a poker room that doesn't have to fight for it's share of the player base, but in this market, there needs to be someone else at the reigns. I'm not alone in this opinion. Remember several key floormen that are now gone? Management. Middle limit hold'em players? Bellagio, Venetian, all of them. I was told by one player (a lady who is a lawyer and an active player) that she ahd 12 other regulars took a meeting with the manager and asked her to spread 40-80 LHE. They were denied based upon this reason; "It'll kill the 15-30". Something else killed the 15-30 and every other limit hold'em game you've tried to spread over $4/$8, I suppose. Full spread is something you'll rarely hear when you call the Wynn these days, but if you call other rooms, you'll hear it regularly. There's no excuse for that.

I'm outting the room as a remarkable failure because the leadership of the room (they're reading this, they stalk me on twoplustwo b/c of my ties to half their employees) is not getting the job done.

You have a handful of the best dealers in town, you had some of the best floormen in town, you had the single best chip runner in town who is now at Aria because he was denied a well deserved promotion for years, and your player base is dwindling. You can read this and view it as an attack or a wakeup call, I suggest you view it as the latter.

How do you explain your bottom line to the board? Everything @ Wynn is the best. The poker room is a stain on the balance sheet. I'm writing this because it isn't extremely far fetched to see a possibility of the room closing in this market, whether temporarily or permanently. We all know Steve Wynn's feelings about poker rooms.

It doesn't take a genius to run a poker room efficiently, but it does take someone who is connected to poker and understands poker players, what they want, what works, and what doesn't.

Stop the free rolls- they serve a very small group of players.

Advertise the lowest rake in town on all games...an empty table is a dealer on break and no rake going into the box. Bring the locals, and the tourists will come.

Continue your excellent comp service.

Don't lose your excellent dealers that have been there since Day 1 because you've had to put everyone on 4 day work weeks b/c of your surplus of dealers. Recruit players. Recruit personnel. You've lost half a dozen critical employees in the past year and a half. You cannot afford to lose anymore.



From Texas with love,


Tex



Note: If you have a problem with this post feel free to speak with me personally. Use the same method you used last time to communicate your displeasure with my opinion and I'll find a reciprocating vehicle of personal measure, nothing more personal than one's self, but that would perhaps be foolish. Surely for you. Consider your first attempt understood ignorance and cowardice that isn't surprising to me. I've been an ardent supporter and advocate of the Wynn poker room for years. What is happening to your room and your employee morale is a shame. Stop the bleeding.

little story of wynn incompetence:

friend gets everyone to agree to kick up a 30 game to 40. they play for 5 minutes before a floor notices. floor then starts yelling at the players, demanding the game go back to 30 or everyone color up to 20$ chips. first, 2-4 structures are ******ed for limit holdem. second, why the hell would you yell at the players? third, why would you impose anything on the players who are paying full price, causing no problems, and keeping things going smoothly?

seems like most people i talk to have at least a few crazy wynn stories. which is too bad because the room is nice and the staff is generally nice but it seems like nobody in management is a real poker player or a real businessman.

In my most recent 2+2 Magazine article, Status of Las Vegas Poker, Winter 2010, I have a section titled 'Is Wynn Collapsing?'

Wynn's been losing it's players steadily for a couple years and may be getting hurt badly by the opening of Aria.

Stayed at Encore last Saturday. Looked to play my usual $10/20 Omaha game. Where did it go?

If you want to play omaha 8 in Vegas you're only going to find a consistent game at the Orleans. Bellagio is next, but it's bigger than most people will play. From there it's day to day, Venetian will run a small game from time to time, and The Wynn probably won't have that game for quite a while. Myself and at least 8 other die hard O8 players have wanted The Wynn to spread a 20/40 w/ $5 chips for a long time but trying to get something accomplished like that would require management involvement, and obviously as stated above management is seemingly indifferent to the status quo of whatever games happen on their own, and those games aren't protected, either.

Along with The Orleans, Venetian has been getting both 4/8 and 8/16 O8 going on a mostly day-to-day basis.

As with many things at the Wynn/Encore, middle management hands are tied. I've been in a few meetings where they say, "we can't do that because we want to be different per Mr. Wynn"

I asked, "so you don't want to follow the hottest trends, and deliver what guests want, and capitalize on some of the other successes found at other properties?"

"that's right, if someone else is doing it, we don't want to."

So they throw out any good ideas if another property is having success with it.

the arrogant Mr. Wynn would rather throw money away than implement a good idea if it wasn't his. Almost no one at a middle level can make changes or decisions without approval. they're trained to be followers, not leaders or entrepreneurs within the organization. very sad.

at least they don't use those god awful $3 chips in the 1/3nl anymore

Wynn/Macau poker room seems well run and is the busiest floor on the island. I was told that Wynn moved floor managers from Las Vegas to Macau to run that room. Maybe they should move 'em back...

Hey now Ben. As much as I miss some players and co-workers and especially family in Vegas. I think I will be happy staying right where I am, at least until some of the economy bounces back.

Hey! I was there last Saturday night. Played in the 25/50 PLO and the 50/100 NL games until about 2 am. I spoke with several of the floor managers, prob including you. Thanks for the great time!

8/16 runs at the Venetian almost every day now that they've started spreading the game with a $2 max. rake.

Hi Tex:

Unfortunately, I happen to agree with you and quit playing at Wynn a while back. I believe the solution is new top management and it's also my opinion that this should have been done a while back.

In addition, in the current market, especially with the opening of Aria where they are doing things right, it will be tough to turn it around at Wynn no matter who is running it. But in my opinion, the best shot at doing so is to change management.

Best wishes,
Mason

The venetian $4-$8 Omaha game is pretty steady. I rarely am there when I don't see it running. The $8-$16 is not as steady.

can't tell you how many times I've expressed the same feelings about the wynn, it was always my favorite when it first opened, and each and every year i've returned for my annual vegas trip, i've seen a steady decline

Great, you've tried to help them.
Now vote with your feet and play poker somewhere else.
Why try to save the room ,when they don't care.

My 2 cents.

Wynn does suck ...esp cannot stand the girl in her late twenties with long brown hair that works the podium...what a rude nasty miserable person she is....she should work in the DMV with that attitude...

To hire someone like that to work the podium shows management does not care or is totally incompetent.....

I was there about a month ago and they had about 5 off duty dealers playing in the 1/3 game ......without the dealers playing the room would have been dark and it was a thursday night!!!!

Couldn't happen to a nicer group of people IMO.

I played there shortly after it opened and became really angry with the floor. About a year later maybe two, they did an interview on Holdem Radio and I thought the poker room manager and the other party came off as arrogant bastards.

Don't know about this one. We all know Steve Wynn has never had any good ideas. hmmmmm

I used to be a permanenet fixture at Wynn, if I was playing poker, it would be at Wynn. I knew the games were perhaps better elsewhere but I enjoyed playing in the room.

Due to circumstances, I can mostly only play day shift and got to be 'friendly' with most everybody on that shift. I would look forward to playing there.

Slowly but surely the choice of games and limits has dried up, to the point where the Wynn is now a convenience room vs a destination room. They basically spread 4/8 LHE 1/3 and 2/5 nl and sometimes games in the top section (I dont follow these so dont know what stakes they are).

8/16 is long gone, 9/18 was a passing phase, 15/30 is gone, 10/20 with a half kill is gone 10/20 08 is gone etc etc and on any given day table selection at 1/3 and 2/5 is gone.

The player attracting promotions are lousey. The $100k 10 players paid freeroll is silly, I am sure a majority of the player pool are not buying into the WSOP ME as was suggested by the tournament director.

The Orleans recently had a promo where they gave away multiple amounts of $500. Tourists and locals alike enjoyed this promo and I am sure that far more of this promo pay out gets back into the poker economy than a $10k payout.

Last year the promo was multiple entries into Wynn Classic events and whilst I won an entry, I would have preferred cash, but at the same time, I appreciate that the free entires perhaps make the player pools look more attractive and in turn attract players for the series.

I agree with a previous poster that the swing shift podium girl is extremely rude and worthy of a DMV job. Many times I have wanted to report her surly behaviour to the management.

I also agree that the Wynn will find it very hard or nigh on impossible to turn the room around without somethign radical happening. The room will no doubt get busier if the north end Strip development takes place, although thats not happening anytime soon, so the room has to look inwards.

A jackpot would be interesting, especially if like the Orleans they kept the rake at $4 total, imo increasing the rake is not an option.

If there was someway they could make their daily tournament more attractive, that would bring in players and buzz to the room, it's often said that this is how the Venetian became so dominant.

There are a few comments in this thread about Omaha 8 or better at the Venetian. I'm there every weekend and many weekdays. So, I've got a good read on what's happening.

4-8 O/8 runs every day.

8-16 O/8 has been running every day(?) during the current Deep Stack Extravaganza and often gets two games going on the weekend.

15-30 O/8 ran yesterday for the first time. The players in the game seemed to think the Venetian and it's $2 max rake were the greatest thing since sliced bread. They were regular O/8 players who were talking enthusiastically about getting the game going regularly there.

It saddens me to learn of the demise of the poker room at Wynn. I'm an east coast player (spoiled by Stan at Borgata) but used to travel out to Vegas a few times a year to play. When the Wynn opened, I would only play there and Bellagio. I preferred the Wynn. This is when Daniel Negreanu was the poker host, more on that in a sec. The 15/30 games were sick (often three soft games going), dealers were awesome, and the floor actually gave me food comps! Never once did I get a comp at Bellagio. It was during my third or fourth visit that a floor person named Carmen actually went out of her way to greet me (by my first name) and welcome me back. Little things like that go along way in my book. During the next few visits, the game struggled to get off and wouldn't last. My last visit was just over a year ago and I didn't play one hand there. No more 15/30. Sad.

More and Daniel Negreanu at Wynn. So, I'm cashing out something like five or six racks after a stupid long session and as I get up from the table, I bump into Daniel on way to the cage. Back then he had to play exclusively at the Wynn and issued the $500,000 heads up challenge to anybody playing any form of poker. I think he was player of the year, he definitely was one of the first rockstars of poker back then.

So I say, hey Daniel, mind if I ask you a few questions about poker? He says, sure and we chat a bit and tells me I'm doing alright if I'm cashing out that much from the 15/30 game or whatever. I turn back, get my jacket, and approach the cage, where he's walking away from the cage with a large puffy manilla envelope tucked under his arm. I say Daniel, one more question, he says sure, I say what's in the ****in envelope? He looks unsure at me for a half a sec, smiles, and gives me a fist pound and heads out into the vegas night with more cash tucked under his arm than most of us have probably ever seen at one time.

It sounds like all the same reasons I stopped playing at wynn a few years ago have simply festered to the near breaking point. I suspect that in part this is due to the self-fulfilling prophecy syndrome of "poker doesn't make any money" which results in upper management completely ignoring the room, allowing incompetent and unconcerned management to run the room into the ground, or even actively hampering any efforts to make the room a success so they can say "I told you so."

Thankfully venetian has taken a terrific approach, maintaining quality staff and giving them flexibility and freedom to figure out what the players want, what works, and run with it. The development of the V's room over the years really is a model for poker rooms everywhere.

And the wynn, whilst being right down the street, can't seem to open their eyes and see what works. Nothing wrong with copying what works when it comes to poker. In fact a very trusted adviser once told me that if he was going to open a new room in vegas, he'd go around to every room in town, see what worked and what didn't, and model his new room based on that, adjusting and changing as time went on. Maybe that's what the venetian's secret is.

al

I know this old news, but why did DN and the Wynn part company? Was it because he did not want play there exclusively anymore, or did the Wynn think he wasn't worth paying what they were paying him to be the host?

From the Wynn's POV, it's too bad they couldn't have worked something out.

Dude, think about all the action he was missing in Bobby's Room.