right, so with your line of thinking, a dealer who has misdealt 3 times in a row now burns a turn early that would NOT have hit your nut flush draw. reshuffles and turns your nut card and you stack two players for a 1200 pot, would you mind....um....rewarding that bad dealer? thought so. You cant be a hypocrite and only exaggerate when it suits you. in this case, how could you not reward a "bad" dealer?

i guess u tip that dealer nothing for misdealing 4 hands in a row even if it benefits you because your not results oriented

i tip if i win pots. i feel confident in the fact that 90% of dealers are good enough to deserve the tip. i don't lose sleep over tossing a bad dealer a buck here and there. after all, if he is a bad/slow dealer and deals less hands per down, he loses money just based on that. the rewarding good/bad dealers isn't sound because most dealers are good, therefore when you win pots, theres a 90% chance your tipping a dealer that does a good job. if a good dealer deals me a cooler and i lose KK AA preflop, he doesn't get the tip. If a slow dealer takes 30 seconds to deal a flop and i hit two pair and stack someone, ill tip that bad dealer til the cows come home. after all, hes the one who shuffled/cut. joe shmoe or jillian morecock may be better dealers, but they didn't cut the deck that made me 500 in their down, now did they?

That dealer would get $0 from me.

Nice that you know what everybody thinks. And it is very easy to stiff a consitently incompetent dealer.

You got it.

i def don't know or care what everyone thinks. i just think its hilarious you have no issue winning a huge pot and not tipping a dollar. would love to find one person ITT that defends that type of BS. instead most people play poker to win and make money, not to be the Judge Judy of dealers.

i don't even deal and its sickening to me that you would triple up, rake in a 1200 pot, and not tip a dollar out of 1200 that YOU WOULDVE NEVER GOT had the dealer been incompetent.wow

So, if a rude dealer shoves you a $2K pot, you don't tip.
So, if a dealer flips your ace and does not apologize but deals you a $2K pot the next hand, you don't tip.

Or, am I missing something Your Honor?

correct. if a dealer is rude to me i don't tip if its a BBJ. nothing that was referenced in our discussion was that of a rude dealer. those are the ONLY times i don't tip. rightfully so. that goes with anything, not just poker. i also mentioned its so RARE that it happens that they are either blantantly rude or flip cards and don't apologize, its unfair to assume that it is the case in the examples discussed.

Some dealers do all of this, I don't.
Other players will notice it, can't imagine it would help my tips.

And just because he didn't tip doesn't mean he won't later.
Look at you. Dealer gives you attitude for no tip on $40 and he
might not get the redbird when he pushes you the $1000 pot later.

For the known total stiff (never ever tips) the most I'll do is
not hesitate if he folds when the other player is playing the board.

That hand is going right into the muck, while for most players I'll hesitate slightly
and drag his hand to the muck giving him a second or two to notice it's a split pot.

And I'm not gonna be buddy buddy with the total stiff
and shoot the breeze or talk sports while I'm on break.

In a 9-18 LHE game I once had a dealer accidently flip and ace, looked at my other card, it was an ace, the replacement card was an ACE!

I laughed out loud, "what a dealer!", and mucked my AA face up. Threw him $3 for being so awesome.

As mentioned by maybe Psandman? not sure. I have seen more players in 10-20nl and higher, all the way up to black chip games, trying to catch the pitched cards cause them to flip this year during wsop. Yet they always want to blame the dealer.

Git yer hands out of the way! I've got fluidity in motion pitching to the table then you suddenly put your facking hands in the way and in the middle of it all I'm supposed to change my pitch?

What? Dealer misdeals 3 times and then burns and turns? I wouldn't tip. Nope. You're the hypocrite because you tip based on random events and not on the competence of the dealer.

Dealer deals well = tip. Dealer deals poorly = no tip.

C'mon, really? If a dealer prematurely burns and turns, thus causing you to lose that pot, you will NEVER tip them? Ever? And if a dealer flips up a card (not just any old card, but an Ace or face card, mind you!) you won't tip them unless they apologize profusely? Wow. So, they can flip up the 4 of clubs and that's okay, but an Ace or paint card will cause you to have such a tizzy that you won't tip them unless they gush apologies?

People make mistakes. Life goes on. Trust me, dealers already feel bad when they make a mistake. I know I do. But when players have an attitude like yours, I feel like a whipped puppy who now wants to go **** in your shoes.

You could've simply said that you make a comfortable living at your real job, and that you play poker recreationally. Now you're just bragging. And I find it amusing that someone who doesn't play poker for a living actually has a set list of "rules" for tipping. Lol. Most people who play for fun just kinda tip whatever they feel like tipping at that given moment when they've won the pot. You, however, must sit there and think it through first.

so the phrase "apologize sincerely" means to "gush and apologize profusely" to you? cool. to me it just means saying sorry...

Bolt's Guide for Tipping:

Well I don't really have a system. I tip what I feel like tipping, and as a dealer, I certainly tip better than most, but not as well as some. I could share some great stories about over-tippers, but that's for another post.

My room wasn't very busy last night and I was cut early, so I went to another room in the hopes of supplementing my income. This was more of a business trip than a recreational trip, so my tipping probably wasn't up to my usual levels (no over tipping).

And none of the dealers at my table were a friend of mine, or play in my room, so I didn't feel obligated to tip extra generously (I definitely tip to excess when the dealer also plays at my table and tips me well).

I was at a 1-2 NL table.

Hand #1: I raised PF to $10 with AK and got 3 callers. Cbet of $10 on an AK7 rainbow flop got me 1 caller. $20 on the turn and I'm called. $30 on the river and the other player folds. After the $7 rake and jackpot, I profit a bit over $50. I tip $3.

Hand #2: I raise PF to $12 and get 1 caller. Cbet $25 on the flop and the other player folds. $1 tip.

Hand #3: I raise PF to $12 and the blinds fold. I profit $3. I tip $1.

Hand #4: I call a $10 PF raise on the button with J5s. One other caller. Flop comes J83ss. I call a $20 bet and the other player folds. 7s on the turn brings me the flush and I call the bettor's all-in. River is a blank and the bettor shows AA. This doubles me up, and my stack of ~ $80 turns into $160. $5 tip.

Hand #5: I'm dealt KK in the big blind. PF raise to $15 isolates me against one other player. 682 rainbow and I bet $25 and am called. 7 on the turn and I shove. River brings a 9. My hand holds up against Q9 and I nearly double up (I had villain covered) and drag a $300 pot. $8 tip.

I rack up my $309, tip the cashier $1 (standard for me) and leave, $208 richer. All told, I was at the table for about an hour and tipped the dealer about $20.

If I had been playing on a day off from work, or if I'd known the dealers personally (I'm friends with a decent number of dealers in this room, having previously worked with some of them, gone to dealer school with some of them, or have gotten to know them from seeing them play at my tables) those same hands probably would have resulted in double the tips. But since this was a business session and the dealers were relative strangers, I didn't tip as well as I might have.

I routinely did this as well until I read this thread and found out that dealers don't normally expect a tip in this situation. Consequently, I've discontinued tipping if I only scoop the blinds. (But I'll try to make it up by tipping extra if I manage to win a large pot during the same down.)

I tip the cashier as well, although I've never seen anyone else do so as I'm waiting to cash out. I haven't read this entire thread, so I don't know how prevalent such tipping is or even if it has been discussed here.

You're right. When the PF raiser steals the blinds, a tip is hardly expected. But it's certainly appreciated, and I'll always give a buck in this situation.

On the other hand, when a series of PF raises and re-raises results in pushing a large pot to a player without ever revealing a flop, I've never really understood why many players won't tip. For example a player might profit $100 or more without seeing a flop, but they won't tip on principal. The same player will then tip a buck or two on a much smaller pot that goes to the river.

This is really silly, and nothing but sought-out justification for not tipping. These mistakes are very rare to begin with, and they're neutral in the long run, as they're as likely to help you as they are to hurt you.

they are rare, which is why theyre listed as ...wait for it... exceptions!

when it helps me I tip, when I doesn't, I don't. so its actually justification FOR tipping just as much as it isn't AGAINST tipping, following YOUR line of reason of how neutral they are.

How's that glass house?

You realize this encourages a bad dealer to make mistakes right?

no I don't.. I don't think its possible to encourage a dealer to do this. its a mistake, some dealers make them, some don't. is a buck really going to tell a dealer, "hey keep screwing up". most likely, his next shift will be somewhere in line with his last. he just feels a bit happier if he gets a buck from me. apples and oranges.

hows being condescending, arrogant, and not correct?

.

Maybe, the rule on burn & turn should change slightly. Like when a player has his hand completely concealed, the dealer spins his head around, doesnt see the hand in question, and burns & turns. Should the player just lose all rights to the hand in that spot?

The reason I sarcastically bring it up, is you'd be surprised how many times a player is a huge part of the reason for a burn & turn. I'm surprised that right now, during wsop in LV there isn't a lot more of it going on.

Players stacking their chips in pretty 20-30 chip stacks, all neatly organized in a row across. But the row is in line with a shoulder, going away from them toward the next seated player, and his stacks are 8-10" away from the rail. To look at his hand he pulls his cards BEHIND the stacks. Now nobody can see the hand, people behind him constantly act out of turn, because he hasnt folded but has no cards in front of him. And though he's been told 2 dozen times, he nods, but doesnt speak ENGLISH!

This is just a small part of what dealers have to deal with daily and take a butt load of **** about from players.

I had one player in PLO today. He's sitting in the 9 seat (9 handed game) fortunately, so I take the time to lean over quietly when he's not in a hand and ask him to do me a favor. "Try not to pick up your cards and hold them in front of your face to look over until it's your turn". Otherwise I miss that you actually have a hand as I am more often looking downwards, and not at eye level". Fortunately he understood and obliged. But I could see it coming, a burn & turn is likely to happen with this fellow involved.

** Should dealers be toked when some player mouths off about how a dealer screwed up and made an error, but in the end the dealer didnt make an error, the player was wrong, and his mouth caused the most of table to MF the dealer and call it a miss-deal? Even though maybe 1-2 players say "he didnt screw up" but everyone in the $800-$1600 game mucks and wants the hand redealt.

Just wonderin.

hahaha so now a dealer singles me out as the one guy who doesn't tip him and says. let me start jepordizing my job and make a mistake to get a buck. sounds reasonable

also, your right ive never worked in a poker room. but the past is the greatest predictor of the future obv. whether I personally don't tip him or do, hes the same dealer he was yesterday, now and tomorrow

This probably causes me to flip more cards then anything. Yes the player 99% of the time still blames me.
Let me place both of your cards in the same spot please.


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The point is a dealer will be less likely to be more careful in the future if the player who won tips. When a big error occurs in a huge pot, there still needs to be a winner and loser. You're saying when you win, you tip. If everyone shared the same philosophy, then dealers will always get tipped regardless of their performance. Not only does that not make any sense, it's unfair to the good dealers who actually give a **** about their performance. If it's an otherwise very good dealer that ran bad and a mishap occurred, then fine, **** happens, but in general this is a policy that's counterproductive.



Unfortunately, you as the dealer, must take accountability for this. 99% of the time it is not your fault, but 100% of the time you must insist it is your fault. Anytime a dealer retorts that it was the player's fault for moving his hands into the line of fire, he's being unprofessional (I'm not saying you do this, btw).

Unfortunately this is how it works.
I wish players would reward good dealers and punish bad/rude dealers.
It's not like they're holding their hand out and I hit it.
After I pitch the card they reach out and try to grab it out of the air.

Would I be out of line to ask the player to not try to grab the
cards out of the air and to let them land and then pick them up?

I've been trying to figure out a way to get the players to stop.