So, playing live at Harrah's Chester and I noticed a few players doing the same thing repeatedly. I didn't say anything, because I wasn't in the hand and I hate to be 'that guy.'

Anyhow, the flop would come and the player would pick up a stack of chips. Probably $50-$100. They'd take the stack in their hand, palm down with the chips underneath the hand. They'd then place the chips down on the table and count out their bet - usually $20-$40 - and pull back the rest of the stack. These stacks are over the line. The bottom of the stack touches the table.

Should the entire stack in the hand be in play here? (No bet number is announced either).

depends on the rules of the house.

Would you make a stink over it?

over the line..in play

If they never release their hand from the stack and they let out a few chips at one time in a seamless, non-stop action then only the chips that are released from the stack count as a bet.

Some places the whole the stack will play, others places it is only the chips they release that are in play. During a bathroom break, you should politely ask a floor for a clarification of the room's rule on this if you are unsure.

Or he could just ask the dealer between hands. Your answer suggests he should have a secret ruling so he jump up at a strategicc time and force a player to make a bet they never intended to, but if he asks the dealer at least all the players at the table will hear the answer.

If the action is against house rules and the dealer has been allowing it?

Your answer suggests that the dealer actually knows and follows house rules and procedures.

I would rather get the rules from a good, unbiased source.

If I was certain of the rule, I would probably do this as a gentle reminder to the dealer to enforce the rules. (It also assumes the dealer is aware of the rule. He could be new or a new hire from where the rule is different.)

Uncertain, I would more likely ask the floor away from the table so as to not appear as a total noob at the table.

But either way is fine.

I did this at Harrahs NO w/ a stack of reds and the nuts. $50 pot, I was trying to decide to bet $25 or $50, but as I started cutting out a bet, the other players pushes out $100 and says "I call!".

Thanks for the extra $50.

House rules dominate.

BTW the "racetrack rule" sucks and should never be part of the house's rulebook, although sometimes it is, unfortunately.

The principle of clear intent should apply at all times. I often take a whole stack but only cut off part of it as my bet. There's nothing wrong with this as I always make it quite clear what my intentions are and how much I intend to bet. The problem is that some people decide to be ridiculous nits about this in an attempt to gain an advantage for themselves, but do so under the guise of "following the rules" or whatever.

Principle of clear intent. Always. Anything that forces someone to do something other than what they clearly intended to do is wrong.

Not every cardroom has clairvoyant dealers.

I like grabbing a stack while I'm deciding how much to bet/raise or even call.
Then I reach out a cut off my bet/raise/call.
When I bring my hand back, what is left on the table is what you need to call.
Wait for the player in front of you to finish acting and there's no confusion.

If the room has a rule where all chips brought forward must be a bet/raise it opens the door for angles.

With the nuts I bring out a stack and just smooth call.
Players or the dealer say "That's a raise, all those chips have to stay in the pot.".
"No, I was just calling."

Ayup.

Tho' throw me in the camp of people who like others to just wait until the betting is complete. If you over-legislate out of fear of angles behind every corner, you simple create more opportunities to angle.

You're going to have people here argue absolutes, when in fact, it depends on the rules of the house.

I don't see why people can't just work out how many chips they want to put in the pot, cut it out behind the line/near their stack and then put it out

A lot of poker players like to fidget, and play with stacks. When it's their turn to bet, they put out the hand with the stack and cut off the bet. Also, they may not really know how much they want to bet until they start betting.

Did you know that, historically, you were even allowed to go back to your stack for more chips in the middle of a bet? True story.

Forcing what's in the hand to stay in the pot creates far too many problems than it solves. And if you're patient and wait for the bet to be finished before reacting (as per the traditional rules), then there's really no problem to solve in the first place.

The same reason the same people can't act in turn, stop talking about the board, cover their cards with their hands, talk about a bad beat possibility, and a score of other etiquette violations.

So you think it's bad etiquette to bring out a stack
and cut off your bet and bring the rest back to your stack?

And you put it on a par with these?

Oh come on. That's not what I mean

I am saying there are many other things people do that are incorrect at the poker table, and they do them because they are ignorant.

Sigh. Just forget it.

I see limit players do this more often for some reason. (guess more old timers play limit?)


Personally I prefer to announce my raise amount in a clear manner and then put the chips in however I want so there's no confusion as to what I'm doing.

http://www.cardplayer.com/cptv/chann...-betting-lines

I'm always a little saddened that people get overly nitty about things. I've dealt and played poker in a wide variety of venues, and this kind of thing is so very rarely a problem. I've seen people move out whole stacks just to drop a few chips, and I've seen people cut off bets behind the line.

When your interest is in helping the game move along smoothly and allowing people to go with intent, all of this sorts itself out. Thankfully, most people are interested in helping the game, rather than looking for technicalities.

Your point? If you have a dispute with the management of the room you are playing at you whip out that video?

And I don't see why people can't just wait until a player releases the chips and withdraws his arm.

Which is more efficient of these two: make the player cut out chips behind the line, restack them, shove them forward, and recut them? ...or allow the player to cut out the chips in front of the line from a big stack?