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Floor Question: Cards off table

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07-02-2009 , 03:47 PM

IS350X

enthusiast

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 78

I am writing this third person for a floor I work with who is dumbfounded. I did not witness this hand but was told the story that one of our floor made the following ruling.

At showdown dealer asks to see winning hand and one hand has both cards off the table lying on the floor. Floor is then called over and the cards laying on the floor happen to be the best hand and wins the pot. I love the story because this floor isn't really solid in any area just acts like she knows everything but is far from being solid.

Comments welcome!!

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07-02-2009 , 03:49 PM

flafishy

adept

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 933

Dead hand.

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07-02-2009 , 03:50 PM

Malucci

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 12,937

No, a hand on the floor is not a hand. It does not qualify, it has no claim to any pot.

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07-02-2009 , 03:55 PM

AceCroupier

adept

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 768

Wrong.

RRoP, Irregularities:

12. Procedure for an exposed card varies with the poker form, and is given in the section for each game. A card that is flashed by a dealer is treated as an exposed card. A card that is flashed by a player will play. To obtain a ruling on whether a card was exposed and should be replaced, a player should announce that the card was flashed or exposed before looking at it. A downcard dealt off the table is an exposed card.

14. If you drop any cards out of your hand onto the floor, you must still play them.

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07-02-2009 , 04:03 PM

fraserbrown

veteran

Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 2,919

Correct ruling. As long as the player did not try and pick them up but called the floor, the hand is live.

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07-02-2009 , 04:21 PM

p4594spa

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 594

I understand that RRop says it is an exposed; however, I have never played at any casino where the floored card was anything other than a dead card. In fact in most
casinos I have played in a dealer is not allowed to pick up a floored card, only a floor man can do so.

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07-02-2009 , 04:25 PM

AceCroupier

adept

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 768

Quote:

Originally Posted by p4594spa

I understand that RRop says it is an exposed; however, I have never played at any casino where the floored card was anything other than a dead card.

Read everything again.

Card was not dealt off the table, but somehow placed on the floor during the hand.
RRoP:I:14. Cards dropped by players are still live.

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07-02-2009 , 04:47 PM

AngusThermopyle

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 14,929

Bay101, if the Floor picks up the card(s), hand is live. Seems fair.

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07-02-2009 , 04:55 PM

Chaosti

centurion

Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 167

wait...it seems like from the OP's description that it wasn't noticed that the cards were on the floor until showdown, and the player with that hand didn't say anything? And the cards happen to be the best hand? Fishy imho. If that's the case, then it should be a dead hand or go to the tape and verify for sure that no card switching occurred.

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07-02-2009 , 04:55 PM

#10

TonyBones

journeyman

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 361

Quote:

Originally Posted by AceCroupier

If you drop any cards out of your hand onto the floor, you must still play them.[/b]

yeah that's why before every live session i play I put a pile of ACES under my chair so i can drop my rags and say "oops' And bring up some aces in their place... of course i call for a set up after you know.

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07-02-2009 , 04:59 PM

#11

AngusThermopyle

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 14,929

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyBones

1. I think that is why the Bay101 rule is that the Floor has to pick up the cards.
2. Floor should check the deck immediately after the incident.

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07-02-2009 , 05:16 PM

#12

TonyBones

journeyman

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 361

Quote:

Originally Posted by AngusThermopyle

1. I think that is why the Bay101 rule is that the Floor has to pick up the cards.
2. Floor should check the deck immediately after the incident.

Point accepted... excuse my feeble attempt at humor... tried to get that one in before al did.

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07-02-2009 , 07:33 PM

#13

Ramon Scott

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,354

This happened two months ago... two players heading to the river... 125ish pot...

River comes an ace... or was it... dealer likes to snap the river during a big hand and this one flies out of his grasp and onto the floor.

Floor is called over to pick up the card and rules that it is just a dead card since it hit te ground and put into the deck, and the deck will be reshuffled. River comes something else, showdown occurs, and player "B" was open-ended King High. He hates the ruling and argues the river should've been the Ace since it was the card that came off the deck in the first place.

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07-02-2009 , 09:38 PM

#14

hotplacepoker

banned

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 295

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramon Scott

That's a bit different. It's like bringing the river before the action is over, the card needs to be re-shuffled in. I'll slap the dealer, but it is dead card.

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07-03-2009 , 05:18 PM

#15

blynk

journeyman

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 376

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaosti

The problem is that this is someone who was told the story relaying it here.
It could been that as the player went to flip his cards they were knocked to the floor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramon Scott

Floor is called over to pick up the card and rules that it is just a dead card since it hit te ground and put into the deck, and the deck will be reshuffled. River comes something else, showdown occurs, and player "B" was open-ended King High. He hates the ruling and argues the river should've been the Ace since it was the card that came off the deck in the first place.

That is exactly what RROP says. If the card is dealt off the table it is dead.
This is what the floor said, however, seen as it was the river card, they allowed it to be put back into the deck.

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07-03-2009 , 06:39 PM

#16

CoinGuy

journeyman

Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 233

The deck should be checked. Just common sense.

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