Game of Thrones TV Thread - ***NO BOOKREADERS*** - Page 61 - Game of Thrones -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

Why wouldn't it? The wine is much more of a elaborate mechanic where things can go wrong. With the pie you are hitting the intended target *if* the King is always first served at his wedding. I'm assuming this is the case because I don't think it's an unreasonable assumption; there is an order that people eat in weddings as per social custom. Margaery was certainly at risk here if it was the pie but I think Joffrey ~always dies. And it's much easier to poison the pie.

Again, we see several people getting served pie at the same time. This isn't the couple cutting the cake with some cheesy song that has the word "sugar" in it while Margery shoves it in Joff's face.

Were you expecting the mother/son dance next? :-)

04-14-2014 , 09:33 PM

#1503

Lagtastic

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 3,794

Lol why are the Tyrells the only ones who could poison the wine???

04-14-2014 , 09:39 PM

#1504

Mrtrebus

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 4,962

Tywin was petty close to getting got if it was the pie, he had some on his fork. Makes no sense to me if you wanted to kill specifically one person to poison something meant for everyone that he may not eat. Not impossible but its definitely less likely.

04-14-2014 , 09:39 PM

#1505

razztapes

old hand

Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 1,641

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lagtastic

Lol why are the Tyrells the only ones who could poison the wine???

This. There are several legit suspects

04-14-2014 , 09:40 PM

#1506

razztapes

old hand

Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 1,641

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mrtrebus

My thought processes aswell. No one ITT has defended the pie stance in a satisfactory way. I've been wrong before though

04-14-2014 , 09:41 PM

#1507

shakalakashakaboom

adept

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 1,022

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lagtastic

Just because they were served pie doesn't mean they would have eaten it before the king. Did we see anyone else eat pie? I'm pretty sure the answer is no. We see Tywin about to eat some, but he stops as it becomes apparent that Joffrey is unwell and may have been poisoned.

Anyways, I think this is a "Gale's alive!" situation, in that both sides are likely to be convinced until explicitly proven otherwise on screen. The difference being that both sides are plausible.

04-14-2014 , 09:45 PM

#1508

Lagtastic

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 3,794

Quote:

Originally Posted by shakalakashakaboom

Just because they were served pie doesn't mean they would have eaten it before the king. Did we see anyone else eat pie? I'm pretty sure the answer is no. We say Tywin about to eat some, but he stops as it becomes apparent that Joffrey is unwell and may have been poisoned.

Anyways, I think this is a "Gale's alive!" situation, in that both sides are likely to be convinced until explicitly proven otherwise on screen. The difference being that both sides are plausible.

Even though we didn't see anyone eat the pie, I'm ok assuming someone else would've, rendering them poisoned seeing how it was being distributed. So next weeks ep will have to address that by talking about how several guests, and maybe even a few key characters also are dead from the poison pie. If that doesn't happen, the pie is out.

04-14-2014 , 09:51 PM

#1509

shakalakashakaboom

adept

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 1,022

Quote:

Originally Posted by razztapes

My thought processes aswell. No one ITT has defended the pie stance in a satisfactory way. I've been wrong before though

I'd really like to let this rest, but come on.. have you read the thread? This stuff has been covered.

1) we do not know who is behind the plot

2) we do not know who the intended target was

3) there may have been multiple targets or multiple acceptable targets

4) there may have been a wide range of acceptable collateral damage

Without at least some of this information, it's impossible to really rule out either the pie or the wine.

04-14-2014 , 09:54 PM

#1510

BobboFitos

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Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72,763

I've been PMed, thanks all

04-14-2014 , 09:55 PM

#1511

shakalakashakaboom

adept

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 1,022

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lagtastic

Or the tradition of the king eating pie first is addressed.

I mean, I don't hate the idea of it being the wine, I think that would be fine, especially the more I think about it, I don't really want to be in either camp. I think it's purposefully ambiguous with tons of red herrings for a reason. Either is possible and we'll have a mini murder mystery arc and/or trial of Tyrion in which the pie and wine are both possibilities.

04-14-2014 , 09:58 PM

#1512

razztapes

old hand

Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 1,641

Quote:

Originally Posted by shakalakashakaboom

1: agree

2: you think it could be someone besides Joffrey? Bad read IMO

3: see above

4: agree.

04-14-2014 , 10:01 PM

#1513

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lagtastic

The King is served first and then everyone sitting up front is as well. He takes the first and only bite - he dies very quickly, so quick that there's an entire cut to Tywin lifting his fork and putting it back down because something is afoot.

04-14-2014 , 10:05 PM

#1514

Jack Bando

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Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 7,587

Quote:

Originally Posted by roy_miami

I thought Bolton was half joking when he said he picked the fattest Frey daughter...

Bolton clearly isn't a joking type.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrizza

S1E4:

Ned: I've heard it said that poison is a woman's weapon.
Grand Maester: Yes, women, cravens and eunuchs. Did you know that Lord Varys is a eunuch?

Why do people think Pycelle's quote means anything? It felt like just a stereotype he was saying.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vixticator

That's just silly, there's no guarantee whatsoever Marg just hitches Tommen.* Marg's not in danger**.

*It was a pure political marriage to strength the throne from Stannis+Robb+Greyjoy's+Martell's. They still need that.
**Yeah, Joffery's not a sociopath who killed a hooker for sport and threatened to execute his mom and his fiancee and started a war for the lulz.

Quote:

Originally Posted by razztapes

Does it fit in a bread basket?

Theon's dong is the killer!

04-14-2014 , 10:07 PM

#1515

Our House

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Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 28,109

Quote:

Originally Posted by shakalakashakaboom

Or the tradition of the king eating pie first is addressed.

I mean, I don't hate the idea of it being the wine, I think that would be fine, especially the more I think about it, I don't really want to be in either camp. I think it's purposefully ambiguous with tons of red herrings for a reason. Either is possible and we'll have a mini murder mystery arc and/or trial of Tyrion in which the pie and wine are both possibilities.

Spoiler:

04-14-2014 , 10:15 PM

#1516

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by razztapes

This. There are several legit suspects

Such as...? (Sansa and _____.)

The only possibility the Tyrell's are involved is if the intended target was Cersei and/or Tywin, because this is the glass the wine is poured from except it isn't full and both of them have kind of obv been drinking from it. In fact, Joffrey himself drinks from the allegedly poisoned wine before he cuts the pie. This is some long acting poison here. With the pie Joffrey INSTANTLY starts feeling the effects. THAT is why he asks for the wine in the first place.

04-14-2014 , 10:19 PM

#1517

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lagtastic

Lol? Dude everyone who is served the pie is in the frame. It's only these front tables. Nobody takes a bite because Joffrey is antagonizing Tyrion and everyone is watching that, as you can see in the frame. Tywin is the first person to lose interest and lifts the fork up to his mouth* and stops because Joffrey is like instantly dying here. Why would anyone start eating the pie in front of them when the King is literally on the ground choking to death?

* Do you think this is an ACCIDENTAL cut?

04-14-2014 , 10:22 PM

#1518

Our House

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If we make one assumption, that the poisoning was planned out ahead of time, then we can eliminate a bunch of things.

1) Joffrey acting like a douche throughout the entire wedding becomes insignificant.
2) The fact that Tyrion was made cup bearer (and top suspect by the crowd & Cersei) by Joffrey.
3) Sansa getting hold of the cup and being a suspect.
4) The fool Dontas asking Sansa to leave, because this happened AFTER Joffrey started choking.

4 is iffy. The fool could still be involved, though I personally think he's another dead end mislead by GoT & Co. I'm probably missing some other obvious items from that list.

04-14-2014 , 10:24 PM

#1519

Our House

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Quote:

Originally Posted by vixticator

He could have been legitimately dry mouthed from the pie like he claimed, and then started choking after the 2nd sip of wine (meaning his cup or cup full of wine was poisoned in between).

04-14-2014 , 10:34 PM

#1520

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Bando

Dear God, why did the show repeatedly have scenes where Margaery has Joffrey wrapped around her finger? There's a TON of them; there are ZERO scenes where poor Margaery is in need of rescue. Cersei is even completely aware of this dynamic and hates Margaery for it. All of this is established of course so the Tyrell's kill Joffrey to protect her from Joffrey, right? Makes sense. No.

04-14-2014 , 10:38 PM

#1521

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by Our House

4 is iffy. The fool could still be involved, though I personally think he's another dead end mislead by GoT & Co. I'm probably missing some other obvious items from that list.

There's a major leap from the King is choking -> the King is dead and we need to get the hell out of here pronto. Why does the Fool think the latter? The Fool character is never a misdirection regardless of role played because he was established in the prior episode, and he pops in at a key moment to extract Sansa. None of this CAN be by accident, this is the one piece of information that cannot be a red herring.