At this moment, I'm not really concerned about how much of it is makeup, as the only way I can see to determine that is to go through all the play history, which you seem unwilling to do. What I'm trying to establish for now is the amount outstanding, whether it's makeup or not.

from the original deal she agreed to, it's all makeup, which I agreed to carry forward for her

since it's gone past the point of settlement, I'm rescinding my offer because I want an independant analysis done with the agreement that she's already admitted to making with me.

Also, what was left of the stake when BF hit? Unless you actually sat a table and went all-in for the last dollars of the stake, something should have been left, and that of course would be owed to her.

How are you arriving at the conclusion that it was all makeup? Only yesterday you were suggesting $235 was not.

Well, I'm hoping on a plane in a couple of hours, so I'll recap where I'm at now.

According to RJ's transaction history, she has sent $479.33 more to JB than has come back her way. JB doesn't not dispute that transaction history. Profits would be over and above anything owed - in other words, if the initial stake was $900, and there had been profit sharing of $200 each and no losses, the staker would receive $1,100 back when it was over, and would have a net profit of $200. Both parties have acknowledged there was profit made, so I would expect that transaction history to be positive in RJ's favour in the end, I just don't know how much it was for - that's one thing I can't determine with the information I have.

The other thing I can't determine with the information I have is whether there is any makeup. I think RJ contends there is none, and JB says all of it is. I don't know if it matters either way, as I believe it's pretty standard that if a player is going to move to a new stake, they are obligated to pay back the MU.

That's basically how I see things so far.

My fifth and final settlement offer was a chop based on an amended agreement, which I'm now claiming that she strong armed me into later in the deal. She is showing strong armed tactics and has lied twice ITT, the first of omission from the original deal, the second that she had some of my MP action.

Bobo, there are plenty of people in the forum who can figure out exactly how much of the stake was makeup, using the information I provided and sharkscope. That's all you need to figure it out. It will show that all of the profit from the stake was MU.

Let me tell everyone here a cautionary tale: do not be staked by a non winning player because they don't usually understand the math of the game, and they almost always in the back of their mind think you are winning because you cheat

lol

amazing

your story has changed 2 dozen times since this thread began.

It would be entirely on you to prove that you were in makeup. You took staking money from RJ, and that remains her money until the conclusion of the stake, at which time it would be returned. If you lost the money at the tables, it would be incumbent upon you to show evidence of that. If there are plenty of people that could figure it out from Sharkscope, then I don't expect it will be a problem for you either, especially given that you will have more information about your own play than anyone else.

And:

I'm not sure why this would concern you. First of all, she said she wasn't sure either way. Secondly, if she had some of your MP action, that would be good for you, as it would mean that some of the money she had sent you was for MP action rather than the stake, and there would be less money outstanding to her.

It's extremely well known that if a backer drops a horse, he doesn't get MU, if the staker leaves voluntarily in MU, he owes the MU. BF was a special case because neither of us dropped each other. So I thought it was fair to carry it forward, but it's expired now. Usually people are given a "reasonable" amount of time to find a new backer. The MU protocols have been discussed and basically standardized in 2p2. This was a special case where it was limbo, so I allowed her to carry it if she wanted. For some reason she wouldn't because this thread is worth more to her I guess.

I think her behavior warrants an MP penalty.

Good to know. I was hoping that you could focus on the questions I was asking for now.

she's already shown to be a liar and a scammer, she's admitted to not knowing what the deal actually was and has changed it already, she's given two versions of it

she's admitted to the deal as I outlined it
she has the starting and ending dates
all records are public

this is all she needs to figure out how much is MU
everything else is irrelevant

as the staker, the burden is on her to figure out how much she is owed, yet instead of doing that on her own, she starts baseless allegations



/thread

I now have an opinion on who lives in bizzaro-staking world.

Here are a few quotes from this year and 2011. Maybe they refresh either side's memory. (All quotes are shortened and the bold is mine)
3/5/2011
3/7/2011
2014
2014
Edit to add: I think SGT RJ case is still very solid since she never used the net loss that she made (according to the transfer history) in any of her arguments. But I didn't want to point out the fact that she had some of his action without including the transfers.

Just edging its way onto page 1 of Google searches, not bad. Anyone got a picture of this clown?

She has; she wants her original stake back. If you contend you don't owe her the stake because you lost the money, then...

And:

Yeah, that was a package outside the scope of the stake. I thought we had done that once or twice but couldn't recall any specifics.

He was small MTTs were part of the stake but he was allowed to sell action for larger buy-in tourneys or cash games if he wanted.

Also, Jeff, I have never agreed to your bizarre stake numbers. I literally have no idea where they are coming from.

Just LOL to the rest. Are you high or something?

It's merely an indication that the -479.33 you get from adding up the transfers could be off. The around $900 obligation seems to be agreed up on. But somebody doesn't want to pay it because you were mean to him.

this thread is too cluttered now and I can't find it but we had the exact same conversation ITT as we did four years ago in this thread. You said you didn't want a stipend, I said it's not technically a stipend because I only cash in winning weeks. You then agreed.

You never wanted me to be in big makeup and I never played well, so I had to shuffle the cashouts around so I was never in big MU, because that's what you wanted. That's why the transaction history is cluttered but that doesn't matter because it doesn't change the numbers in the end. I went on a big DS and you dropped MTT's that's were a lot of it went, but I was also in more makeup than I thought when I did the numbers.

I allowed you to own it as an asset because we never had any problems with each other except you were always wanting the cashouts to be smaller than they were supposed to be.

I tried to work this out from you from the day BF happened. All you had to do was go to any member of the forum and calculate the numbers, but you conveniently "forgot" about the cashout deal. That put all of you profit in MU, but I was willing to carry it forward for you, so all this ruckus is beyond my level of comprehension. We could have worked this out together but you would never accept that I was in MU, but the #s prove it.

Yeah, dude, I get you've constructed an entire alternate version of reality that makes you somehow not the lying, thieving, POS you've proven to be, but just because you say it doesn't make it true.

The deal was a 50/50 profit split, and you were never allowed to withdraw stake money for personal things. It was a pretty basic set-up really. This imaginary stake you've concocted where if X then Y unless Z, but sometimes A is just beyond ******ed.

Also, let's discuss finding an arbitrator. I'm completely 100% fine with that. You claimed to want that in your emails. So let's allow a neutral 3rd party, or a panel, decide who owes what.

all you need is a subscription to sharkscope and the search function in 2p2. You have all the dates. The burden is on you to prove what I owe you. I'm confident that it's nothing, since you've admitted that you agreed to the deal as structured.

I'm also sure that you are trying to free roll the MU as well as trying to free roll my MP action.

You are a liar, a scammer, and a bad person all around, and I think you should at least be perm-banned from MP. Shady and unscrupulous business practices. Bringing serious allegations down without any supporting evidence.

Again, no. She provided you with a stake, you are obligated to return it to her unless you have proof you lost it. Repeating that it is on RJ over and over again doesn't change anything.

I'm off to my flight. Might get back here in 24 hours or so.

you can take all the data to dozens of people in the MP. it's a complicated job but there are plenty of people who can help you

when you figure it out, lmk, in the meantime, delete the thread

bring back the issue when you can provide hard numbers

whatever monies are owed will be settled but MU has expired

No, I haven't admitted that. You keep saying that, and I keep telling you that I don't agree to his weird stake structure you've dreamed up out of thin air.

Further, you've already admitted multiple times that you owe me $900. I've provided the emails where you admit it, and you've admitted it in this thread as well.

I'm enjoying your new tactic, which appears to be simply "nou".

Still waiting on any numbers or emails or any of the other things you've promised.

I don't need any more data. This entire thread is all the data I need. It will never be deleted unless you pay back every penny you owe. If you agree to arbitration then it's whatever number the arbitrator decrees. If you don't, then it's the $900 you've already admitted multiple times you owe.

Further, you weren't in MU, and even if you were, it hasn't "expired" since a) lolwat and b) you cut off communication and came back to the site, time and time again on different accounts, without ever once trying to get back in touch with me.

I've admitted that you had MU invested in me and nothing else. From the original deal, it's more than 900. Before you argue, why don't you let screaming asian do the analysis. He's already said he would.

you have lied numerous times in the thread and admitted to not understanding the deal, so why don't you get help from an expert to figure it out. It's all public record. So what is the problem? Why didn't you do this before?