What was the correct line here with QQ? - Page 2 - MTT Poker Strategy

Two Plus Two Forums Poker Strategy No Limit Tournaments

What was the correct line here with QQ?

Post Reply Subscribe

...

Page 2 of 2

1 2

Page 2 of 2

1 2

03-11-2011 , 07:14 PM

#26

TeamTrousers

talks the talk

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 12,894

as played, c/c river

4b/call pre though

Quote

03-11-2011 , 07:54 PM

#27

foxracer662

centurion

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 176

raise more preflop with this stack size IMO. Start min raising more around 50-60BB (I prefer 2.2222x) Once the flop comes just shut down. We are never getting value from anything, and not getting rid of much either.

Quote

03-11-2011 , 08:44 PM

#28

killer_kill

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 28,604

Quote:

Originally Posted by foxracer662

He'll call the turn with TT/99 but he likely checks it back if we check. So I like to bet turn at the least.

Quote

03-11-2011 , 09:19 PM

#29

greenrebellion

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,575

I'll just say that you have to fold to the river raise. If he wanted to bluff, he would've done it on flop or turn, you are never good on river.

Quote

03-11-2011 , 09:55 PM

#30

Pardyallthetime

adept

Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 786

betting river is fine but after he raises fold. he would just call with a king or a jack, not raise. if he does, then good for him.

check calling river is ok too i suppose.

i prob 4bet small to see whats going on (pf that is), but i dont blame ya for just callin. nh

Quote

03-11-2011 , 10:49 PM

#31

zdctg

journeyman

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 367

Break this hand down on each street.

Pre: 4betting/call and calling both zeem fine.

Az played
Flop: check
Turn: I can see an argument for b/f here if you are going to throw out a bet anywhere, but villian pretty much throws away hands we beat 75% or more, so we aren't getting much value here by betting and if villain flats, ... gl.
I think checking turn is clearly best, even against any range.
River: check call and check fold are both close, but if we check behind, I have to call 1/2 PSBs and less, anything else, I would consider b/f. Not sure how anyone can advocate a bet here ever.

Quote

03-12-2011 , 04:15 PM

#32

killer_kill

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 28,604

Quote:

Originally Posted by zdctg

Break this hand down on each street.

Pre: 4betting/call and calling both zeem fine.

I agree

Quote:

Originally Posted by zdctg

Az played
Flop: check
Turn: I can see an argument for b/f here if you are going to throw out a bet anywhere, but villian pretty much throws away hands we beat 75% or more, so we aren't getting much value here by betting and if villain flats, ... gl.
I think checking turn is clearly best, even against any range.
River: check call and check fold are both close, but if we check behind, I have to call 1/2 PSBs and less, anything else, I would consider b/f. Not sure how anyone can advocate a bet here ever.

Yes, we'd be obviously b/f turn. This is a 3b pot so villain doesn't like have many K's in his range and those don't raise turn. AK/KK raise turn and those are a small pct of his possible 3b range. Hands that can call (imo) JJ/TT/99. If we think villain can 3b pf with KJ type hands then we have to be 4b for value. Because if villain can 3b wide enough to have KJ type hands then his range for flatting/5b is going to be significantly wider. River I'd rather c/evaluate than b/f. By checking we let him value town worse pairs and we lose min to weirdly played Ax (yes they'll double check sometimes) and other weird stuff we lose to.

Last edited by killer_kill; 03-12-2011 at 04:32 PM.

Quote

03-12-2011 , 05:10 PM

#33

firefoxmaz11

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 1,692

pf is fine(2x's get more light calls out of blinds), check flop, lead turn, c/c river

as played i'd bet that river for thin value against mid pps and fold after the raise

Quote

03-13-2011 , 06:13 AM

#34

Rakhir

journeyman

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 349

Quote:

Originally Posted by killer_kill

AK/KK raise turn and those are a small pct of his possible 3b range. Hands that can call (imo) JJ/TT/99. If we think villain can 3b pf with KJ type hands then we have to be 4b for value. Because if villain can 3b wide enough to have KJ type hands then his range for flatting/5b is going to be significantly wider. River I'd rather c/evaluate than b/f. By checking we let him value town worse pairs and we lose min to weirdly played Ax (yes they'll double check sometimes) and other weird stuff we lose to.

Without reads we shouldnt assume villain is 3betting so wide, its certainly not that common. If we 4bet here for value we shouldnt expect an unknown to continue with most hands we are dominating (ATs, AJ,AQ) or crushing (77-TT, maybe even JJ) but he will most likely atleast flat with JJ+ AK or even only QQ+ AK. So we either win a small pot by 4betting or will be playing a big pot oop vs a range we are at best flipping against.

Quote

03-13-2011 , 06:04 PM

#35

killer_kill

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 28,604

Reread my post please Rakhir. I'm saying that if anyone thinks this guys has a K in it then his range has to be wide enough that 4b for value is good.

Quote

Page 2 of 2

First

1 2

Last

Post Reply Subscribe

...

Page 2 of 2

First

1 2

Last