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weird spot w ak in 3b pot

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01-03-2012 , 04:27 AM

ebet33

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 4,994

villain seems pretty good/competent...16/12/4 or 80 hands and has opened a decent amount up front....planned on rc obv but then he hoodflats and i get confused

[converted_hand][hand_history]Merge, $10 Buy-in (400/800 blinds, 75 ante) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 8 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #11490332

Hero (MP2): 33,734 (42.2 bb)
MP3: 40,159 (50.2 bb)
CO: 6,683 (8.4 bb)
BTN: 50,263 (62.8 bb)
SB: 20,756 (25.9 bb)
BB: 82,098 (102.6 bb)
UTG+2: 15,096 (18.9 bb)
MP1: 37,328 (46.7 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K

UTG+2 raises to 2,100, MP1 folds, Hero raises to 4,444, 5 folds, UTG+2 calls 2,344

Flop: (10,688) Q

(2 players)
UTG+2 checks, [color="red"]Hero ???

Quote

01-03-2012 , 05:28 AM

Vekked

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 3,294

Just get it in somehow now. It's between 3k/call and just jamming. I think 3k/call is slightly better.

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01-03-2012 , 06:56 AM

Finnera

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,621

3k/f

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01-03-2012 , 09:56 AM

Elephants_pride

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 5,043

Quote:

Originally Posted by Finnera

3k/f

Pretty sure check behind > 3k/f.
With eff psb otf I agree we`re not folding.

I`d probably 3bet bigger pre.

Last edited by Elephants_pride; 01-03-2012 at 10:03 AM.

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01-03-2012 , 10:10 AM

black666

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4,288

What am I missing here? You have 19bb effective with AK, just get it in. So the flop missed you, big deal. You have a psb left and repped a strong range - ship it in.

I guess villain had QQ+ or AQ and you asked yourself after the hand if you could have gotten away from it.

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01-03-2012 , 10:22 AM

Finnera

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,621

I'd say it's a higher likelihood of winning the pot with std cbetting, rather than checking behind and trying to spike an A or K on turn and hope for a free river card. 3k looks like an inducer / value bet and thus its strong, if villain comes over there is like a 90% chance that we have 25% equity, which is not worth risking a chunk of bb's more - mathematically nor strategically.

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01-03-2012 , 10:24 AM

Finnera

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,621

..but actually if Blackie meant to get it in pre with a direct reship, then I like that proposal quite much.

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01-03-2012 , 10:27 AM

snowboard789

old hand

Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 1,734

do competent winning regs call 3bets with 19bbs without AA,KK?

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01-03-2012 , 10:29 AM

Finnera

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,621

no they don't

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01-03-2012 , 10:41 AM

#10

Elephants_pride

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 5,043

I`m not saying I`m checking behind, but b/f is bad (even check behind is better).
Shove or b/c.

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01-03-2012 , 01:48 PM

#11

ebet33

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 4,994

[QUOTE=Vekked;30721134]Just get it in somehow now. It's between 3k/call and just jamming. I think 3k/call is slightly better

Please elaborate?
I b/f 3k

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01-03-2012 , 03:02 PM

#12

feedthabeast

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 8,302

Quote:

Originally Posted by ebet33

Please elaborate?
I b/f 3k

Turrible advice...no need to expand on it. Yeah put 50% off eff stacks in the pot and fold.

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01-03-2012 , 03:40 PM

#13

davethedave2

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 4,397

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vekked

Just get it in somehow now. It's between 3k/call and just jamming. I think 3k/call is slightly better.

Quote

01-03-2012 , 05:12 PM

#14

gregz41

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 8,609

what am i missing? this is such a clear ship. 3b a little bigger pre lik 4777

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01-03-2012 , 05:26 PM

#15

Vekked

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 3,294

Quote:

Originally Posted by ebet33

Please elaborate?
I b/f 3

Basically we can't fold after c-betting given the odds we're getting on a board of this texture where he can easily jam hands that we have great equity against like KJ/KT, or Kx diamonds/Ax diamonds. We only need ~37% equity once we bet to call off the rest. Just from the fact that he flatted with his stack indicates that he's going to have a wide enough range to get it in.

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01-03-2012 , 05:43 PM

#16

timetowom

banned

Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 2,887

Loooooooool 3b/f.

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01-03-2012 , 07:11 PM

#17

ebet33

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 4,994

Quote:

Originally Posted by timetowom

Loooooooool 3b/f.

WTF are u talking about?
Ur like a child who wanders into a movie theater and wants to know what's going on

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01-03-2012 , 07:20 PM

#18

ebet33

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 4,994

Ok. Thx vekked

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01-03-2012 , 08:17 PM

#19

timetowom

banned

Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 2,887

Quote:

Originally Posted by ebet33

WTF are u talking about?
Ur like a child who wanders into a movie theater and wants to know what's going on

oops i meant loooooooool 3k/f

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01-03-2012 , 11:50 PM

#20

ebet33

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 4,994

U are out of ur element

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01-04-2012 , 03:02 AM

#21

Kramerica

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 3,528

bet/fold. Or bet and re-assess turn. Do not shove, do not check.

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01-04-2012 , 03:39 AM

#22

ebet33

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 4,994

so thats pretty interesting.....
^^^ he obv knows what hes talking about

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01-04-2012 , 04:20 AM

#23

Vekked

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 3,294

I'm not sure he realizes we're so shallow, we can't b/f AK here.

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01-04-2012 , 05:42 AM

#24

Finnera

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,621

we surely can 3k/f this otf. It looks supastrong, and you can get lotz o worse hands to fold.

Obviously, they like never come over that with anyhing else than a pair, so we do not get right odds to call. you can also price yourself in, but that is just self betrayal.

jamming is nut worst, since it reeks of you not hitting the flop or being nutted. With AA/KK/AQ, you would not do this, would you?

It was the correct pf play (with a bit of sizing issues though), and post is just not worth it. We have more than plenty biggies after this anyway.

Oh my, I haz zi bigslick I cannot fold post... oh, come on!

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01-04-2012 , 06:09 AM

#25

Vekked

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 3,294

Quote:

Originally Posted by Finnera

Obviously, they like never come over that with anyhing else than a pair

Don't agree with this obv. Yes if he only ever jammed pairs then we can fold but we have to be pretty sure that he only jams pairs on a 2-tone board where a lot of broadway combos flop some sort of straight draw/gutter + over.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Finnera

Oh my, I haz zi bigslick I cannot fold post... oh, come on!

...yea that was my thought process.