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07-03-2014 , 10:36 AM

betgo

banned

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 28,590

What to do on river? Comments on earlier streets.
$10 rebuy NJ site. HUD not working. Villains apparently random. Blinds 200/400/50. Passed rebuy period.
UTG 20K
UTG+1 30K
MP 5K
HJ 11K
Hero 11K
BTN 4K
SB 19K
BB 9K
Hero is dealt 9c8c
3 folds, HJ calls 400, Hero calls 400, fold, SB calls 200, BB checks.
Flop (2000) 8sAc8d. 4 checks.
Turn (2000) Qd. SB bets 1000, 2 folds, Hero calls.
River (4000) 3c. SB bets 2400, Hero ???

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07-03-2014 , 10:39 AM

bikram

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,651

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07-03-2014 , 10:42 AM

Alexo

old hand

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 1,245

I would raise against limper 100000% of the time pre, definitely betting flop. As played, call?

Last edited by Alexo; 07-03-2014 at 10:43 AM. Reason: I READ IT ALL WRONG

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07-03-2014 , 11:15 AM

tboneparte

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,378

Pretty much nothing to discuss, is ok spot to limp I guess (doubt you post the hand if you didn't), shove river. Cool title and awesome thread.

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07-03-2014 , 11:25 AM

betgo

banned

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 28,590

Quote:

Originally Posted by tboneparte

Pretty much nothing to discuss, is ok spot to limp I guess (doubt you post the hand if you didn't), shove river. Cool title and awesome thread.

Thought it was interesting as most people would raise preflop and many would bet the flop. Also, one person said call river and another said push.

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07-03-2014 , 11:31 AM

bikram

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,651

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexo

I would raise against limper 100000% of the time pre, definitely betting flop. As played, call?

I don't like isoing here with the 10bb btn..we commit ourselves

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07-03-2014 , 11:33 AM

Alexo

old hand

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 1,245

Sure we do, but if **** hits the fan we still got fine eq

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07-03-2014 , 11:36 AM

bikram

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,651

that's true...I still prefer an overlimp in this spot

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07-03-2014 , 12:08 PM

tboneparte

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,378

Quote:

Originally Posted by betgo

Thought it was interesting as most people would raise preflop and many would bet the flop. Also, one person said call river and another said push.

Is a decent hand and a decent spot to limp if you think bb and button are gii at threatening rate and we can play decent post flop poker. R/f erryone but button is likely better most times how ever. Flop check is fine in limped pot where it's likely that no one flopped any piece and if they did it will be tough to get 3 streets. River shove is necessary because of this though imo.

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07-03-2014 , 01:39 PM

#10

betgo

banned

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 28,590

I actually called the river and SB had 75o. I checked the flop because I thought no one had anything and it was hard for any card to hurt me. Posted it because there were decisions on 3 streets.

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07-03-2014 , 03:03 PM

#11

cicakman

banned

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 9,229

good job betgo you havent learned a single thing in 10 years.

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07-03-2014 , 05:39 PM

#12

betgo

banned

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 28,590

Yeh, I know. That's why I am back to playing $10 rebuys and still posting here.

I could respond further, but maybe better to stick to strategy here.

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07-03-2014 , 05:48 PM

#13

user12345

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 3,737

You gave 0 info in such villain dependent spot.
If he's nitty and can't have AQ I'd just call.

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07-03-2014 , 05:58 PM

#14

betgo

banned

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 28,590

Quote:

Originally Posted by user12345

You gave 0 info in such villain dependent spot.
If he's nitty and can't have AQ I'd just call.

He would have to be pretty bad to have completed AQ in the SB.

I don't know if the flat call was good, but I couldn't see that many hands I beat he would bet/call. As you imply, it is hard for him to have a good ace. He could maybe have worse trips though, but he might fold a lot of those hands pre.

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07-03-2014 , 06:20 PM

#15

user12345

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 3,737

It's your American story about Jackyl and Hide. (Right?)
The same way there's Betgo and Limpgo in you.
You should learn to adjust freqs at which Betgo surpassing Limpgo.

Since I'm sure it was Limpgo playing there's def no value on shoving river for him. And considering no one would advocate folding ever I can't see why is it a thread.
Afaic Limpgo called and villain had better!?
Well it's just variance... Yes there're more better hands he vb, but you're getting price. And people in $10r can overplay smth stupid or vb A3 for example.

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07-03-2014 , 06:25 PM

#16

ArtanisAce

grinder

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 470

As played, call the river. Probably you are not getting much hands to pay u, except the ones that beat u. In limped pots, these kind of spots normally u have to be careful playing for stacks. Much to risk.

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07-03-2014 , 06:40 PM

#17

tboneparte

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,378

I mean we can r/f a little deeper, kinda tempting and might be a decent line here just seems gross this shallow- mainly I think we're missing value vs most randoms by just calling though. If we know villain as being better and realizing this isn't a spot we bluff often/ever then calling is more of a viable option.

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07-03-2014 , 07:09 PM

#18

jwwoods332

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 28

Quote:

Originally Posted by betgo

I actually called the river and SB had 75o. I checked the flop because I thought no one had anything and it was hard for any card to hurt me. Posted it because there were decisions on 3 streets.

I would have jammed the river or at least raised. There were no straights or flushes out there, and you can't worry about set over set. Harrington said, you can't fear a higher set than your set, if it happens, you're supposed to lose a lot of money! It's old advice, but it's right. Clearly the guy wouldn't have called you're all-in in this case, but that's irrelevant.

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07-03-2014 , 08:02 PM

#19

lissistinkt

old hand

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 1,816

bomb bomb bomb postflop to stack ax
is it that hard

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07-03-2014 , 08:18 PM

#20

hitchens97

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 2,745

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwwoods332

a) This is Trips, not a Set
b) Harrington said that about the flop, not every street
c) It's a jam not a raise given stacks
d) What worse hands call if you jam? Or better hands fold? It's a clear call as played imo.

I don't think betgos over limp is terrible here. If you don't overlimp a hand like this, then I basically think you have to say you never overlimp (which is fine, but let's just say that). This is an implied odds hand, which means our best outcome is usually served by seeing a cheap flop with a lot of people in it.

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07-03-2014 , 08:30 PM

#21

oldsilver

MTTLivePro

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 5,955

bombbombbomb would be fine if strong Ax featured in opponent's ranges, but i don't expect random limpers with 30BB to have much AT+ stuff here to call 3

checking allows AJ- to check behind, call ott, then potentially get stuck calling for a chop on the Q river - so I definitely prefer checking flop to bombing it.

then SB starts handing value to OP, so calling remains the best option.

cliffs: OP line postflop is fine (could argue for something different pre with 30BB), and calling river >>>>> shoving river if V never calls worse.

Last edited by oldsilver; 07-03-2014 at 08:49 PM.

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07-03-2014 , 10:41 PM

#22

betgo

banned

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 28,590

I know the tendency is not to limp behind. I don't agree this is the best situation to limp behind. Say you had 2 limpers and a small pp, then overlimping would usually be way better than raising. Also, you might have an ep limper who you thought might be have a strong range and might 3-bet.

With this hand, there are some advantages to raising, as it misrepresents your hand as well as represents more strength. I didn't mind seeing the flop 4-way in position though.

I actually really like SB's play. He can represent trips with random cards in the blinds, and he would likely check an ace acting first on the flop.

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07-04-2014 , 04:14 AM

#23

benadryl55

newbie

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 31

What's the discussion about? As played, call. If you've shown wild raises on river before for bluff, there's certainly value in a shove. Standard play is to call...Boring hand.

Last edited by benadryl55; 07-04-2014 at 04:21 AM.

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07-04-2014 , 09:13 AM

#24

betgo

banned

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 28,590

As for the flop check, I am probably betting this flop every time with air. In fact I am almost always betting any flop with air in this situation if checked to. Also, hard for anyone to improve to something they like. At higher stakes, it might be better to bet as it looks weak, but I had a feeling no one had anything.

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07-04-2014 , 09:39 AM

#25

lissistinkt

old hand

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 1,816

there is 3 other people who can easily have ax in their range that they are probally not getting away from
imagine what a disaster it is if villain had ax in this hand and not a desperate bluff which you cannot really expect when its limped and 4way

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