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11-07-2014 , 11:00 PM

Ofbravetight

newbie

Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 35

Hey guys,

What do you think about this hand? I dont have HUD stats of the villain. It seems a reg because has 22k games played with a decent profit in sharkscope.

Thanks for your time.

Poker Stars, $50 Buy-in (4,500/9,000 blinds, 1,125 ante) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 8 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #32441892

BB: 230,228 (25.6 bb)
UTG+2: 328,941 (36.5 bb)
MP1: 843,908 (93.8 bb)
Hero (MP2): 212,952 (23.7 bb)
MP3: 596,867 (66.3 bb)
CO: 523,676 (58.2 bb)
BTN: 750,746 (83.4 bb)
SB: 319,270 (35.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A

2 folds, Hero raises to 18,000, 3 folds, SB raises to 35,999, BB folds, Hero calls 17,999

Flop: (89,998) K

(2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets 44,099, SB calls 44,099

Turn: (178,196) Q

(2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

River: (178,196) T

(2 players)
SB bets 238,047 and is all-in, ???????

Spoiler:

Get the Flash Player to use the Hold'em Manager Replayer.

Quote

11-07-2014 , 11:46 PM

tboneparte

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,378

Ok I understand no HUD, but no insight into how you or villain have been playing?

Flat pre is fine with proper reasoning, flop you could argue to check since will be rare for him to check fd or sd on this texture (also have blockers to both) and generally his check range will be weakish sd value. Betting is pretty much always profitable but not necessarily optimal.

Probably tell you to fold now and almost never fold in game. We have bunch of Qx and good amount of XsXs in perceived range that we are calling his click with so would need villain to be bluffing his underpairs or have super wide 3b range.

Last edited by tboneparte; 11-07-2014 at 11:52 PM.

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11-07-2014 , 11:58 PM

Ofbravetight

newbie

Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 35

I play with Huds but he was new at the table and had no hands with him before.
Ty 4 ur answer...

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11-08-2014 , 12:15 AM

wowsooooted

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 5,090

I would 4b pre to try and give him rope/inflate the pot post in the hopes he makes a big mistake against us oop.

We have no reason to think hes 3b light here as hes new and we readless. If I had reads he could be light on the 3b then I think flatting pre is more of an option.

Flop = bet with sizing to set up a turn jam on any card, 66% of pot or so should suffice, so il proly 55k/c - jam turns

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11-08-2014 , 03:02 AM

gamboneee

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 9,160

would jam pre vs that size

Last edited by gamboneee; 11-08-2014 at 03:02 AM. Reason: or not flat at least

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11-08-2014 , 09:04 AM

user12345

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 3,737

Quote:

Originally Posted by gamboneee

would jam pre vs that size

somewhat questionable logic mate

As played I agree flop check back is ok.
River is pretty gross. I think Tyler we never come to the river with a flush and he has more Qx in his range by the river.
Guess it's fold considering vast majority of our range is 2p (and we never have AK) which he probably doesn't expect hero to fold a lot.

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11-08-2014 , 09:22 AM

Alexo

old hand

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 1,245

click it back pre or even shove and level him, call is fine vs bigger sizing but I don't like it vs that. As played call and hate yourself.

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11-12-2014 , 05:21 PM

Everyday81

centurion

Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 144

I would 4b pre - and hopefully not be in this situation on the end. As played, I think I'd hafta find a fold here. Reluctantly mind you (and easier typed in a forum than done live).

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11-12-2014 , 10:43 PM

juggle5344

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 548

All the money's going with AA regardless of flop, turn, and river, (in the majority of siutations) at 23 bb.

You can call, you can min raise or you can shove pre.

It's all the same. I'd just bet the turn. I don't always like to bet the turn with just AA (one pair) but shortstacked there's no reason not to.

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11-13-2014 , 02:57 AM

#10

time=money07

stranger

Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 14

15 players left, im shaking my head at you here. you have 23 bigs starting the hand. this isnt time to get cute my friend. the only option here is 4 bet gii on flop (if villain calls)or 4 bet shove. flatting is asking to have a dripping hole this deep in the tournament. you want to be chipping up here. I prefer to get it in good pre, not guess where im at on the grossest board run out ever...

as played i fold river and hope to find another spot cause i jumbled that perfect opportunity.

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11-13-2014 , 04:27 AM

#11

Andrzejeczek

centurion

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 199

wp
lol @cib

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11-13-2014 , 04:52 AM

#12

giu1iano69

centurion

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 117

Flat with AA's preflop,15BB behind...wrong way!!...river fold it s ok

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11-13-2014 , 05:49 AM

#13

mashxx

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 7,840

I think you played it great except for the river fold, but I'm a station in these spots.

edit: and the comments are mostly aids so far. guys, really?

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11-13-2014 , 05:58 AM

#14

Dragons_Egg

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 4,861

Against that sizing pre I like 4b to something around 70K.

I like tbone's analysis on post-flop.

I wonder how much of his range he effectively jams pre, and whether hands like AQ/KQ are in it.

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11-13-2014 , 11:11 AM

#15

gamboneee

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 9,160

Quote:

Originally Posted by user12345

somewhat questionable logic mate

just seems like such a terrible 3b/f size that hes prob a little stronger than his usual whole 3b range

Quote

11-14-2014 , 12:18 AM

#16

busto_soon

old hand

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,724

Like every street, nh!

4b pre is terrible

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11-14-2014 , 12:24 AM

#17

Alexo

old hand

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 1,245

how the **** can a 4bet with AA be terrible? that comment autotilted me

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11-14-2014 , 02:54 AM

#18

mashxx

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 7,840

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexo

how the **** can a 4bet with AA be terrible? that comment autotilted me

because it's suboptimal?

Quote

11-14-2014 , 05:35 AM

#19

Alexo

old hand

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 1,245

Based on what? How did you construct villain's range when he sizes like that oop to deem 4b terrible? Flatting is fine, 4b is fine, neither is terrible nor amazing, it's totally subjective which is optimal readless esp. vs a winning reg.

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11-14-2014 , 05:47 AM

#20

mashxx

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 7,840

Because, as almost everyone agreed upon, his range is most likely wider when he does that and we're representing much wider range when we flat against that sizing. And SPR postflop is also ideal for that. Therefore 4b would be perceived as 'horrible' as we're losing a lot of value that way.

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11-14-2014 , 05:50 AM

#21

Alexo

old hand

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 1,245

Almost everyone=you+busto_soon? I see more people advocating 4b than flat pre itt. I really doubt you can construct his range well enough without any info at all to be so absolute about 4bet being terrible.

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11-14-2014 , 05:53 AM

#22

wowsooooted

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 5,090

Being only 15 left in a $55 FO we should expect our opponents to be somewhat decent and if we do 4b/cib with 20bb stack our range should be pretty face up as nutted as we generally should only be folding or shipping at this point, so I guess il change my view and look to flat pre instead,

although I really think that turn needs to be bet with this spr and especially As.. as he shouldn't have too many Qx's hes x/c with otf, most of these hes going to cbet with..

so yea flop make it 60% pot or so then jam that turn

Last edited by wowsooooted; 11-14-2014 at 05:54 AM. Reason: fun hand btw

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11-14-2014 , 05:57 AM

#23

mashxx

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 7,840

Quote:

Originally Posted by wowsooooted

although I really think that turn needs to be bet with this spr and especially As.. as he shouldn't have too many Qx's hes x/c with otf, most of these hes going to cbet with..

Actually As is the reason for not betting turn.

Quote

11-14-2014 , 06:20 AM

#24

wowsooooted

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 5,090

Quote:

Originally Posted by mashxx

Actually As is the reason for not betting turn.

ok if you like turn check what is your suggested line then as played?

Last edited by wowsooooted; 11-14-2014 at 06:23 AM. Reason: and please dont say call unless you can justify a range of hands we beat

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11-14-2014 , 06:53 AM

#25

mashxx

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 7,840

That's why I said I'm a station in these spots otr, it's hard to think of hands that we beat but on the other hand his shove applies serious pressure and he might be aware of that. We're considering folding AA so his bluff shove should be possible.

I'm in no way condemning a fold nor saying call is good.

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