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Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain

07-04-2008 , 05:11 AM
Villain (BB) and I have seen quite a bit of each other through this tournament. I've seen much more of him, of course, because he has been much more active. This guy is a hyper-LAG like no other I've seen (and has the best luckbox I've ever seen). If he can imagine that he has the smallest edge preflop, he puts in a big raise regardless of position. He's 3 and 4 betting with 22+, T8+. He's already put his stack on the line from the BB in resteal situations with the likes of A3o and T9s.

Against most villains I'm raising (or shoving) this when it folds to me in the SB, but I know he's going to come over the top with any reasonable (VERY wide range here) holding and put me to a decision. I have folded to most of his moves in this situation before, so I fully expect him to try it again. I can assume that a 4 bet shove has positive equity against his range, but I'm one of (if not THE) best player at the table from what I've seen so I don't want to put TOO much on the line with only a small edge. I'd really like a shot at him postflop where he makes his biggest mistakes (calling shoves with very weak draws, bottom pair no kicker, etc.)

I may have had additional thoughts about villain when the hand took place, but I thought at the time my line was pretty solid given stack sizes and his range. Let me know what you guys think about my preflop thoughts and actions and my plan for the hand postflop and we'll go from there.

Poker Stars $10+$1 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t15000/t30000 Blinds - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BB: t2450352
UTG: t2074578
MP: t723050
CO: t388028
BTN: t1533648
Hero (SB): t1173344

Pre Flop: Hero is SB with J K
4 folds, Hero calls t15000, BB raises to t210000, Hero calls t180000

Flop: (t438000) 5 K 2 (2 players)
Hero ?????
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 05:20 AM
Preflop not sure about. If I complete it's with the intention of raising this aggro guy. limp call could be ok but what is your intention if you miss the flop all together?
This is a pretty awesome flop for you.
If he will CB this crai seems most obvious.
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 05:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gollyheck
Preflop not sure about. If I complete it's with the intention of raising this aggro guy. limp call could be ok but what is your intention if you miss the flop all together?
This is a pretty awesome flop for you.
If he will CB this crai seems most obvious.
If the guy is as spewy as he sounds a donk bet might induce him to come over the top of you.
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 06:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deucegame

Poker Stars $10+$1 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t15000/t30000 Blinds - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BB: t2450352
UTG: t2074578
MP: t723050
CO: t388028
BTN: t1533648
Hero (SB): t1173344

Pre Flop: Hero is SB with J K
4 folds, Hero calls t15000, BB raises to t210000, Hero shoves

Flop: (t438000) 5 K 2 (2 players)
Hero ?????
or

Quote:
Originally Posted by deucegame
Poker Stars $10+$1 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t15000/t30000 Blinds - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BB: t2450352
UTG: t2074578
MP: t723050
CO: t388028
BTN: t1533648
Hero (SB): t1173344

Pre Flop: Hero is SB with J K
4 folds, Hero raises to t75000 and shoves over any raise
imo

as played I'd try to c/r that flop. if he makes a better hand on the turn it's quite unlucky....i don't understand why you you took such a passive line with a very strong pf hand against an ultra-lag oop. you nailed the flop beautifully i'd give him a chance to barrel at you. dunno maybe c/c does it as well, but i'd prefer c/r. if he checks the flop behind, i'd lead turn for 2/3ish pot.
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 06:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blind squirrel
or



imo

as played I'd try to c/r that flop. if he makes a better hand on the turn it's quite unlucky....i don't understand why you you took such a passive line with a very strong pf hand against an ultra-lag oop. you nailed the flop beautifully i'd give him a chance to barrel at you. dunno maybe c/c does it as well, but i'd prefer c/r. if he checks the flop behind, i'd lead turn for 2/3ish pot.
trust me, i see what you're saying and this was my inherent line. but he's not 3 betting you pre, he's shoving, and we're still kind of deep. and with his shoving range, we're small favorites or slightly behind with KJs. he's doing it with any Ace, any pair, and lots of other hands that we're not that far ahead of. i felt like i had to get him postflop to have a real shot at his stack - and i really wanted his ****ing stack. i have no idea how he got this deep based on his play that i'd seen, and if i can stack a donk at a final table, well that just does great things for the ICM. also, i wouldn't be this deep if he hadn't doubled me up twice already when i made him make bad postflop decisions. also, he's not checking behind. ever. he's making a > half pot bet every time. i haven't seen him even slow down with his aggressive actions at any point so far.

Last edited by deucegame; 07-04-2008 at 07:02 AM. Reason: added more
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 08:12 AM
flop seems like a dream...use your read to determine how best to manipulate the chippies into the pot...

donk lead is nice or C/R but try not to let him wriggle off your hook please
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 08:27 AM
well, after him raising that much pre, im expecting that he will fire 100% on the flop, so i like a C/R > Donkleading.
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 09:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deucegame
trust me, i see what you're saying and this was my inherent line. but he's not 3 betting you pre, he's shoving, and we're still kind of deep. and with his shoving range, we're small favorites or slightly behind with KJs. he's doing it with any Ace, any pair, and lots of other hands that we're not that far ahead of. i felt like i had to get him postflop to have a real shot at his stack - and i really wanted his ****ing stack. i have no idea how he got this deep based on his play that i'd seen, and if i can stack a donk at a final table, well that just does great things for the ICM. also, i wouldn't be this deep if he hadn't doubled me up twice already when i made him make bad postflop decisions. also, he's not checking behind. ever. he's making a > half pot bet every time. i haven't seen him even slow down with his aggressive actions at any point so far.
ok, i trust you that you figured him out and all that. but what's your plan if you miss the flop? therefore i kinda like villain's monstrous pf raise cause you're actually comitting yourself a little too much to just call imo. villain sounds pretty bad from your description but i think there's a chance he's playing a monster like this pretty well...?
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 11:26 AM
If villain is as agro as you're saying I really like a complete and shove over a raise preflop since he is likely to be raising you with close to ATC. Having limp/called obviously c/r this flop, it's a pretty simple decision imo.
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 01:13 PM
must be pretty cool to make final tables.
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 01:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deucegame
Villain (BB) and I have seen quite a bit of each other through this tournament. I've seen much more of him, of course, because he has been much more active. This guy is a hyper-LAG like no other I've seen (and has the best luckbox I've ever seen). If he can imagine that he has the smallest edge preflop, he puts in a big raise regardless of position. He's 3 and 4 betting with 22+, T8+. He's already put his stack on the line from the BB in resteal situations with the likes of A3o and T9s.

wow LOL this couldnt describe me better when the antes are high. RR with 22-66 is the nuts. I resteal on ppl with the same stack size as myself ALL THE TIME...ive been doing a bunch of other **** too to accumulate as many chips as possible. Obv wasnt me tho I finished 150 something last night.

obv c/r flop setting up the pot for a shove.

Last edited by Monarchy113; 07-04-2008 at 01:58 PM.
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 03:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PiousDevil
must be pretty cool to make final tables.
thinly veiled brag, but i really couldn't help myself
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 03:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monarchy113
wow LOL this couldnt describe me better when the antes are high. RR with 22-66 is the nuts. I resteal on ppl with the same stack size as myself ALL THE TIME...ive been doing a bunch of other **** too to accumulate as many chips as possible. Obv wasnt me tho I finished 150 something last night.

obv c/r flop setting up the pot for a shove.
notes added. ty sir
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 03:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blind squirrel
ok, i trust you that you figured him out and all that. but what's your plan if you miss the flop? therefore i kinda like villain's monstrous pf raise cause you're actually comitting yourself a little too much to just call imo. villain sounds pretty bad from your description but i think there's a chance he's playing a monster like this pretty well...?
i would have check/folded a lot of flops. i know it's a strange line, but i thought i was getting good implied odds to let him double me up if i got any piece of the flop and that he was going to spew his stack off to someone very soon so i wanted to be the one that took it.

i checked the flop to villain with the intention of CRAI, but he shoved for me. i snap-fist-pump-do-a-little-dance-and-drink-a-little-water-call and he tables AJ (Ace spades) for 3 overcards and backdoor nut flush (where i already have 2 of the spades).

BBV: river Ace.
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote
07-04-2008 , 04:05 PM
fold the river imo
Stars  20K Guar - Final Table - Good read on Villain Quote

      
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