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Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads

07-23-2009 , 10:28 PM
I've always been confused as to what to do in terms of set-mining at low stakes.

Some questions:
- What blinds are you willing to open limp, and from what positions? 15/30 only? 20/40?
- Should I be open limping from middle position, or just raising?
- If I limp for 30 and someone 4x's to 120, do I call?
- If someone open raises to 3x for 90 chips, do I call with all pocket pairs, regardless of where I am?

I think this is one of the few very huge holes in my low-blind play, and I'd appreciate any help. Obviously there are going to be some changes in play from regulars to fish to unknowns, so if you think there are very different actions based on reads then please let me know.

Here's an example hand where I'm completely clueless as to what to do, as played right now: http://weaktight.com/1322112

Edit: Another bonus hand: http://weaktight.com/1322114
Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Quote
07-23-2009 , 10:48 PM
1st hand could be setmine-able (500 in the pot already, 120/4:1 to call with your stack being 12ish bets)
2nd hand I would definitely fold

You need to be getting 7:1 back on your investment to make setmining worth it in cEV. In $EV it's going to need to be more.

I am a setmining nit and only really open limp at t20 and some bigger pairs at t30. I don't like calling raises more than 60-80 chips and usually only doing so if 3+ players have called already or there is at least 1 caller and I have already limped.
Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Quote
07-24-2009 , 12:46 AM
Don't raise pre a hand you are planning to set mine with. Call a raise if more than 1 other person also calls it. The more players in the pot, the more value you hand has if you hit a set so adjust your thinking based on that.

1st hand since 4 are in the pot there is a good chance of getting paid if you hit.

2nd hand I fold, too may players left to act and you can't afford a reraise or shove from the shorter stack in the blinds.
Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Quote
07-24-2009 , 01:41 AM
1. Call its a raised multiway pot so u should stack someone if you hit

2. Fold Too many shorties behind.
Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Quote
07-24-2009 , 01:57 AM
not wishing to blow my own trumpet or claim to know all the answers, but I made a post in which I discussed this issue, and I think what I suggest is sound at the low stakes:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/36...-tl-dr-176871/

I'd add that I don't limp from later positions, I don't ever feel obliged to play pairs (will fold them if the dynamics or my stack is wrong) and generally I'll call for 90 more but I don't by any means feel it's obligatory.
Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Quote
07-24-2009 , 02:05 AM
Thanks for the advice. I'll start posting a few more unknowns, but I think I get the general idea.
Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Quote
07-24-2009 , 12:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drzen
not wishing to blow my own trumpet or claim to know all the answers, but I made a post in which I discussed this issue, and I think what I suggest is sound at the low stakes:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/36...-tl-dr-176871/

I'd add that I don't limp from later positions, I don't ever feel obliged to play pairs (will fold them if the dynamics or my stack is wrong) and generally I'll call for 90 more but I don't by any means feel it's obligatory.
Did you ever do a follow up on endgame. I read that post and it is pretty much the style I use but it is always good to read it to reinforce what I am doing. If you haven't done an endgame post like this please consider. Thanks
Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Quote
07-24-2009 , 04:40 PM
Depends on what type of table you are at, how deep the stacks are behind you, what the blinds are, and what your stack size is.

The last level I usually try set mining is 25-50 with like t1500 behind. I am also not looking to limp/ call more than 10% of my stack.
Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Quote
07-24-2009 , 05:14 PM
Quote:
I think this is one of the few very huge holes in my low-blind play
Probably one of the most common leaks in lowstakes games is players are too loose. Due to icm, the general rule is "tight is right" because a chip in your stack is worth more in terms of $EV than a chip earned. För that reason, my standard would be to limp 22-TT(JJ) on the first two levels, regardless of position (almost).

As yellowbastard, I don't want to put more than 10% of my stack in pf unless there are extraordinary circumstances.

Hand 1, I probably call because I get good odds, it's not more than 10% of my stack and I close the action (pretty important factor imo).
Hand 2 is a clear fold for me.
Set-Mining: Positions, Blinds, and Reads Quote
07-24-2009 , 07:21 PM
It's more how they're loose than that they're loose. Although it's controversial to say so in this forum, you can win at STTs playing a looser style in the early levels, particularly in regular speeds. There are other reasons you wouldn't want to -- particularly that if you're going to play more hands, you need to be able to handread some, and that's difficult playing a ton of tables. There's more potential for fail packed into that last sentence than is obvious at first glance, because many more players think they're able to handread than actually are.
Quote:
Did you ever do a follow up on endgame. I read that post and it is pretty much the style I use but it is always good to read it to reinforce what I am doing. If you haven't done an endgame post like this please consider. Thanks
I'll be honest with you. I'm not so confident of my endgame, and don't feel I should be giving advice to anyone about it, really. It's easy to show a newb how to keep out of trouble early, but how to play in the late game is difficult. But I could do a post on how I play at some point, and maybe others will comment to make it a useful thread.
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