***OFFICIAL Stars 2014 MTT Discussion Thread*** - Page 67 - MTT Poker Strategy

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***OFFICIAL Stars 2014 MTT Discussion Thread***

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08-23-2014 , 04:06 PM

#1651

mashxx

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 7,835

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sect7G

How has this guy not gotten a job yet? Seriously.

he's broken

08-23-2014 , 06:37 PM

#1652

DoGGz

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 17,315

dude has some serious heart.

most everyone else has given up at this point.

08-24-2014 , 08:22 AM

#1653

UPAY4DINNER

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 4,753

Hey Bryan,

Haven't seen you around lately, hope everything is OK?

Hope we see a reply to that great post above very soon. Was also wondering is there any chance you will add some lower buy in Hyper Turbos. $2.50 + 0.05c for example.

Thanks.

08-24-2014 , 03:56 PM

#1654

skadooshh

grinder

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 481

Quote:

Originally Posted by broken_jia

Bryan, if you're taking feedback/suggestions on the new MTT schedule, see below for some ideas. Most of these outstanding issues are from tournaments that were introduced 5+ years ago and never adjusted to their present day situation:

1. Removing/minimizing tournaments with no guarantees:
-As the world's largest online poker room, there's no need to have such a high % of tournaments with no guarantees. Looking at the non-NL Holdem games, more than 50% of tournaments do not have guarantees. Even if you attach a $50 guarantee to a $2 tournament, it will encourage participation as long as the price and start time are reasonable.

-You recently converted some FLO8 and PLO8 to NLO8 and also added some brand new NLO8s. Some of these have not run due to the fact that there was no guarantee. The implementation of these tournaments could've been much better if all of them had guarantees.
-If you want some inspiration, look at how FTP did their schedule. Even though their player pool is much lower, they attempted to attach a guarantee to almost every tournament (some as little as $50 or $100).

2. Fixing inconsistency with rake:
-I'm not asking for a rake decrease, but the fact that the Supersonic is $210.80+$4.20 (and not $200+$15) acknowledges that Pokerstars believes the rake in a faster-structured tournament should be less than a deeper tournament.

-Right now, turbos have the same rake as a non-turbo and it sets a bad precedent going forward as more and more tournaments become turbos/hypers.

-This also applies to satellites. Right now there is a $27 No Limit 2-7 Single Draw Deep satellite with 10k starting stacks (blinds starting at 10/20, 10 minute levels) that costs $27 ($24.55+$2.45). During SCOOP, you had $27 turbos (1500 stacks, 5 minute levels) with the same $24.55 + $2.45 price structure. What often happens is the turbo will get cancelled or barely draws enough players to award one seat. If the turbo satellite was priced more reasonably, it tournament would draw more players and actually be beatable.

3. Updating the satellite schedule:
-You guys could do a much better job with satellites, especially the weekly $215s. Deadline satellites with step buyin amounts are a must.

-It seems like for all the non-holdem Weekly 215s, all the satellites are from 5 years ago when the games weren't as popular and the MTT catered to the US high rollers who would buy in directly. Right now, there seem to be one or two types of satellites for each game and no guarantees.

Some examples: The $215 PLO has a $39 freezeout and a $56 hyper, the $215 NLO8 and PLO8 have an 11+R, the two Sunday $82 Progressive KO MTTs only have one type of satellite ($11 turbo freezeout).

The lack of decent satellites isn't the only reason these tournaments don't do as well as they could, but they're not helping the cause. There should be more variety of satellites with tournaments running more frequently. If you're going to market these as part of the "Saturday Line-Up" and "Sunday Majors", you ought to run satellites DAILY and not just 4 hours before the tournament starts.

It's appalling that the daily Omanias have better satellites than the weekly 215s, please fix this.

4. Updating outdated tournament structure and late registration policy
-There are still several tournaments which were introduced 5+ years ago that have blind structures and late registration limit that do not make sense.

Specifically, the limit games still start at insignificant levels making the first few levels insignificant. You guys have the capability to set variable levels/repeating levels and still haven't done so. These games would do a lot better if they were structured better.

For NL games, there are hypers with the same structure as 5 years ago (fast blind increases) and ones introduced one month ago (much smoother blind increase) that charge the same rake %. They are the $51 NLO8 hypers and the $7.50 NLO8 hyper. This shouldn't be happening.

With regards to late registration, there are too many tournaments with arbitrary late registration limits. 1 hour seems to be the standard, yet it's very common to see 10 minutes for a tournament with no guarantee. If you guys fix the guarantee issue from above and change the late reg period, many players will be happy.

5. Updating prices for Steps system:
-You've been forced to price tournaments at $27 and $700 due to the current Steps buyins. Any thoughts of converting the awkward amounts of $7.50/$27/$215/$700/$2100 to rounder numbers? After 10 years, you can inflation adjust these numbers to more rounder numbers. The numbers would have to work, but something like: $10/$50/$300/$1000/$3000. This would only work if you plan on making the buyins like partypoker where the buyins are round numbers and rake is included in the total cost.

Awesome post! I would be wary of the bolded though as it will probably just be used as an excuse to increase the already high rake.

08-24-2014 , 05:46 PM

#1655

AvoidMe?

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 350

Quote:

Originally Posted by broken_jia

Bryan, if you're taking feedback/suggestions on the new MTT schedule, see below for some ideas. Most of these outstanding issues are from tournaments that were introduced 5+ years ago and never adjusted to their present day situation:

1. Removing/minimizing tournaments with no guarantees:
-As the world's largest online poker room, there's no need to have such a high % of tournaments with no guarantees. Looking at the non-NL Holdem games, more than 50% of tournaments do not have guarantees. Even if you attach a $50 guarantee to a $2 tournament, it will encourage participation as long as the price and start time are reasonable.

-You recently converted some FLO8 and PLO8 to NLO8 and also added some brand new NLO8s. Some of these have not run due to the fact that there was no guarantee. The implementation of these tournaments could've been much better if all of them had guarantees.
-If you want some inspiration, look at how FTP did their schedule. Even though their player pool is much lower, they attempted to attach a guarantee to almost every tournament (some as little as $50 or $100).

2. Fixing inconsistency with rake:
-I'm not asking for a rake decrease, but the fact that the Supersonic is $210.80+$4.20 (and not $200+$15) acknowledges that Pokerstars believes the rake in a faster-structured tournament should be less than a deeper tournament.

-Right now, turbos have the same rake as a non-turbo and it sets a bad precedent going forward as more and more tournaments become turbos/hypers.

-This also applies to satellites. Right now there is a $27 No Limit 2-7 Single Draw Deep satellite with 10k starting stacks (blinds starting at 10/20, 10 minute levels) that costs $27 ($24.55+$2.45). During SCOOP, you had $27 turbos (1500 stacks, 5 minute levels) with the same $24.55 + $2.45 price structure. What often happens is the turbo will get cancelled or barely draws enough players to award one seat. If the turbo satellite was priced more reasonably, it tournament would draw more players and actually be beatable.

3. Updating the satellite schedule:
-You guys could do a much better job with satellites, especially the weekly $215s. Deadline satellites with step buyin amounts are a must.

-It seems like for all the non-holdem Weekly 215s, all the satellites are from 5 years ago when the games weren't as popular and the MTT catered to the US high rollers who would buy in directly. Right now, there seem to be one or two types of satellites for each game and no guarantees.

Some examples: The $215 PLO has a $39 freezeout and a $56 hyper, the $215 NLO8 and PLO8 have an 11+R, the two Sunday $82 Progressive KO MTTs only have one type of satellite ($11 turbo freezeout).

The lack of decent satellites isn't the only reason these tournaments don't do as well as they could, but they're not helping the cause. There should be more variety of satellites with tournaments running more frequently. If you're going to market these as part of the "Saturday Line-Up" and "Sunday Majors", you ought to run satellites DAILY and not just 4 hours before the tournament starts.

It's appalling that the daily Omanias have better satellites than the weekly 215s, please fix this.

4. Updating outdated tournament structure and late registration policy
-There are still several tournaments which were introduced 5+ years ago that have blind structures and late registration limit that do not make sense.

Specifically, the limit games still start at insignificant levels making the first few levels insignificant. You guys have the capability to set variable levels/repeating levels and still haven't done so. These games would do a lot better if they were structured better.

For NL games, there are hypers with the same structure as 5 years ago (fast blind increases) and ones introduced one month ago (much smoother blind increase) that charge the same rake %. They are the $51 NLO8 hypers and the $7.50 NLO8 hyper. This shouldn't be happening.

With regards to late registration, there are too many tournaments with arbitrary late registration limits. 1 hour seems to be the standard, yet it's very common to see 10 minutes for a tournament with no guarantee. If you guys fix the guarantee issue from above and change the late reg period, many players will be happy.

5. Updating prices for Steps system:
-You've been forced to price tournaments at $27 and $700 due to the current Steps buyins. Any thoughts of converting the awkward amounts of $7.50/$27/$82/$215/$700/$2100 to rounder numbers? After 10 years, you can inflation adjust these numbers to more rounder numbers. The numbers would have to work, but something like: $10/$50/$300/$1000/$3000. This would only work if you plan on making the buyins like partypoker where the buyins are round numbers and rake is included in the total cost.

Great post. The bolded structure won't work though, as $10*9 would only guarantee one seat to the next step, which I feel is too top heavy of a structure. I also think that 6 steps are much better than 5. Also FYP. I suggest $10/$25/$75/$250/$1000/$3000

08-25-2014 , 01:30 AM

#1656

SleightOfJam

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 2,375

What about adding a zoom with a 27-55 buy in somewhere?

The smaller ones are really popular and structure is nice for a turbo. Could easily hit a half decent guarantee I would think.

08-25-2014 , 03:37 AM

#1657

ptweedsdro

newbie

Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 41

amen, i dont understand why there's not more zoom mtts at all buy in levels. i think i weekly 109 zoom on saturday could be huge like it was on ftp back in the day.

08-25-2014 , 09:19 AM

#1658

AvoidMe?

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 350

Question to all:

If you were able to discontinue 5 tournaments at your buy-in level and replace them with 5 new ones, which would it be and why?!

08-25-2014 , 08:38 PM

#1659

murray3004

newbie

Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 48

Apologies if its been posted already but has anyone noticed a drop in guarantees for a lot of tournaments?

08-25-2014 , 11:04 PM

#1660

DoGGz

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 17,315

Supposedly you should have notice a rise in a bunch of guarantees!

08-25-2014 , 11:31 PM

#1661

The Moo

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 2,205

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoGGz

Supposedly you should have notice a rise in a bunch of guarantees!

LOL if theres any they aint what they was before thats for sure

08-25-2014 , 11:55 PM

#1662

kyan972

centurion

Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 140

before when? pre black friday or pre world cup?

08-26-2014 , 12:59 AM

#1663

ratslla

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 5,535

100r and the sonic didn't reach the guarantee last sunday... EPT or what

08-26-2014 , 03:10 AM

#1664

ONLYRAISEAA

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 4,880

Quote:

Originally Posted by ratslla

100r and the sonic didn't reach the guarantee last sunday... EPT or what

Likely when it's the #regtank tourneys

08-26-2014 , 06:42 AM

#1665

diskkk

banned

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 2,035

Quote:

Originally Posted by AvoidMe?

Question to all:

If you were able to discontinue 5 tournaments at your buy-in level and replace them with 5 new ones, which would it be and why?!

all the $11 3ks bull**** into a $11 reg-speed progsuperko 5k. not sure if need to explain why, lol

08-26-2014 , 01:08 PM

#1666

blakkman08

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 13,134

All 27tko into 27 prog tko with earlier antes. Structure is total nonsense as is.

11 3k into 11 pko 5k is very good idea

75 5k into big 75 lol derp obv

Most importantly Saturday 320 into a pko

08-26-2014 , 11:35 PM

#1667

TooRareToDie

banned

Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 4,303

The 55$ PLO at 18:05 (all CET) should be a PSKO, same as the 16,50$ at 18:35.
The 5,50$ PLO at 01:05 should be a 22$ PLO ZOOM Turbo.
The Weekly 215$ 8-Game should simply be 82$, or both being offered.
THe Weekly 215$ PLO should also become a PSKO.

08-27-2014 , 01:52 AM

#1668

ChiefBlackfoot

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 561

The $88 4 max turbo annoys me since this should have a decent guarantee and a longer reg period and different structure. Same goes for all 500 cap turbos like the $33 and $55 which could easily get 2x the # of entries on weekends if left uncapped (0 idea why any MTT would be capped under most conditions). Also would like to see a hot/hotter 210 turbo (yes lower the rake in turbos pls).

08-29-2014 , 12:16 AM

#1669

TooRareToDie

banned

Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 4,303

I think you should combine Progressive SuperKO with Triple-chance.
Means, starting with a 50bbb starting-stack (at 15/30), and 12 minute levels. Players can use their second and third 1500 chips within first hour, but afterwards, both will automatically be added to the stack, if unused. If it's a 33$, you could take 3$ rake on 3x 5$ buy-in, and the 3x 5$ PSKO per 1500 chip entry (3x1500 = 4500 total). Just make it 20/30. 30/60, 40/80 and 50/100, then the same as the rebuy's, just 12 instead of 15 minutes. It'll be fast paced action, pulling people in, and allowing to use their "own strategy", regarding the 3 1500chip tokes.
After an hour, about 30% will already have busted, despite 3 bullets. And afterwards, the rest will have collected bounties and be ready to bust fast, in a structure that is 3 minutes faster than the old 15 min blinds rebuy-events.

Like this, you could make the losing players get more action for their play, as well as making them play higher (and faster)due to 3 bullets in the tournament, and the regs would be happy about the added skill component of how to chase KO's of shortstacks correctly, which would make up for the earlier shortstack-play at the tables.

I think this would help the games in the long run. More thrill and flips per game for the recreationals, and no less skill-elements than before for the regulars, when contemplating the KO's of every entry of each player correctly.

Last edited by TooRareToDie; 08-29-2014 at 12:37 AM.

08-29-2014 , 08:23 AM

#1670

gollyheck

veteran

Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,547

So you could gets KO for knocking out a third of a stack?

08-29-2014 , 11:04 PM

#1671

jnfpoker

adept

Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,052

They earlier $8 6max turbo's have disappeared

08-30-2014 , 12:20 AM

#1672

TooRareToDie

banned

Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 4,303

Quote:

Originally Posted by gollyheck

So you could gets KO for knocking out a third of a stack?

Yes.
Bounties on each 1/3 part of the buy-in, being displayed as in the PSKO's.
More fun for everyone.

08-30-2014 , 10:59 AM

#1673

andrefs

centurion

Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 158

Here's a suggestion:

Remove the "waiting for all tables to finish before going on break" and just start the break already. There are always people getting up too quickly emptying their timebank and the breaks take forever.