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How to get max max value?

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09-29-2009 , 12:31 AM

kalv

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 2,103

Loose player, calls with almost any 2 card preflop, somewhat loose post.
Poker Stars $4.00+$0.40 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t25/t50 Blinds - 9 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG+1: t1660 M = 22.13
UTG+2: t7620 M = 101.60
MP1: t1220 M = 16.27
MP2: t4717 M = 62.89
Hero (CO): t2056 M = 27.41
BTN: t407 M = 5.43
SB: t685 M = 9.13
BB: t12115 M = 161.53
UTG: t2995 M = 39.93

Pre Flop: (t75) Hero is CO with Q

1 fold, UTG+1 calls t50, 2 folds, MP2 calls t50, Hero raises to t250, 4 folds, MP2 calls t200

Flop: (t625) Q

(2 players)
MP2 checks, Hero ????

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09-29-2009 , 12:36 AM

Foks

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4,355

CB like t432 if we're readless, may as well play our hand in a straightforward/valuish manner unless we're pretty sure of an alternate line being able to extract more value from an aggro villain we have reads on.

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09-29-2009 , 12:46 AM

Ch3wi3

journeyman

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 242

Umm I think its better for value if you put in a normal cbet especially if like me you cbet a lot.

It suck when you cbet here and they fold but this is what I lean towards as I think you have a higher chance of building a pot.

If you just check back and then he checks to you again you have missed 1 and maybe 2 streets of value if you check back again hoping he will bluff at it.

Cbet as normal maybe a little less than your usual cbet something like 300 if he is loose he may perceive that as weakness and come over the top, lets hope so!!

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09-29-2009 , 01:01 AM

johall111

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 4,496

Since hes somewhat loose postflop i think that betting 350 on flop is way to go. that way if he has a small pair here you got a good chance to pick up a call that another overcard on the turn may kill, also its small enuff where he may c/r bluff. if he does call i dont think that screams A or Q but its good enough to warrant a 600 turn bet. if he finds another call u have an easy river shove for whats left in ur stack

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09-29-2009 , 01:05 AM

randompoker

journeyman

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 379

Half-pot it and pray he has an A/Q/flush/straight draw that he feels is worth calling.

I'm often tempted to bet small when I flop huge to give odds to absolute trash to draw, but at the end of the day if they have a hand worth calling a small bet, they'll typically call a half-pot bet.

Standard procedure is to juice the pot and hope he feels like getting frisky if he improves to 2nd best.

Yeah, it sucks when he instasnapfolds to a half-pot bet, but he's probably doing that to a smaller bet exactly the same way.

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09-29-2009 , 01:21 AM

pukerz

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,382

Checking behind or betting ~350 looks good

I'm more inclined to check behind here since we are not too deep, so it won't be a problem getting stacks in on the turn/river. Also, a lot of cards can come OTT that help the villains range, maybe giving him a backdoor flush/straight draw.
It also gives him another opportunity to bluff, or to convince himself you don't have an A and call you down with a small pair

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09-29-2009 , 01:25 AM

Willyoman

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 10,468

Yeah I'd check. Think you have to slow-play here.

Harrington had a good phrase discussing a situation like this, where you absolutely crush the flop and villain is very unlikely to have a good 2nd best hand... he says something like you have sucked all the air out of the room and there's nothing left for anyone else.

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09-29-2009 , 01:46 AM

randompoker

journeyman

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 379

Getting maximum value, as was the OP's original point, is incredibly hard to guage in situations where the decks smashes you in the face like this. Maximum value is extracted from an A or Q hand shoving you when cbet flop because they think you can't call a shove. You get maximum value from air or third pair type hands by checking all the way to the river and giving them ammunition to take a stab, but that is fraught with the danger of no return whatsoever, especially against draws that would pay to see the river but then blank and check/fold.

Because of this, I always bet and hope he spazzes out or calls me down. It's the long term max max value line imo.

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09-29-2009 , 01:56 AM

inanimatecarbonrod

centurion

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 115

just check it. you have blockers on a super dry board. unless villain is a complete maniac you aren't getting anything until he hits something/bluffs at the pot

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09-29-2009 , 05:17 AM

#10

furo

deviation of equilibrium

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 29,639

check it

may even check turn behind here to be honest. betting turn is transparent as well.

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09-29-2009 , 05:24 AM

#11

The_Stro_Sho

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 4,444

Quote:

Originally Posted by inanimatecarbonrod

on a super dry board

I know drier tbh

yea checking is def better, he'll let u know if he has sth on the turn.

what did u do ?

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09-29-2009 , 06:00 AM

#12

Engel

adept

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 822

if ur read is lag i'd c/c flop

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