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good shove with QJs?

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11-22-2007 , 10:03 PM

shat4brains

adept

Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 962

Poker Stars, $15 + $1 NL Hold'em Tournament, 100/200 Blinds, 5 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

BB: 2,980
Hero (UTG): 2,060
CO: 2,550
BTN: 2,370
SB: 3,540

Pre-Flop: (300) J

dealt to Hero (UTG)
Hero raises to 2,060 and is All-In, 2 folds, SB raises to 3,540 and is All-In, BB folds

Flop: (4,320) 3

(2 Players - 1 is All-In)

Turn: (4,320) 2

(2 Players - 1 is All-In)

River: (4,320) 3

(2 Players - 1 is All-In)

Results: 4,320 Pot

no real reads here
is this a donk play?

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11-22-2007 , 10:09 PM

sippin_criss

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 11,778

1) no
2) yes

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11-22-2007 , 10:12 PM

shat4brains

adept

Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 962

why is it bad? u just open fold this?

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11-22-2007 , 10:22 PM

Fishing2do

journeyman

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 322

My brain gives an error when pushing in this spot lol, so its prolly a fold. there are very few situation in which I would push this hand.... maybe like when all the players left at the table were all UBER pro's, then I might shove. But against some random bunch of players Id definitely fold.

All you got is queen high m8, your a (big) dog against EVERY hand that will call you. You might aswell shove with 52o in this spot.

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11-22-2007 , 10:29 PM

vers

See my staking thread

Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 4,831

too light, esp w/o antes.

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11-22-2007 , 10:35 PM

AMT

Charlie Brown of MTTs

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 17,745

ehhh bit too deep to be pushing this UTG with no antes, with antes or with less chips it becomes more of a shove.

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11-22-2007 , 11:52 PM

DannyOcean_

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 28,336

you are UTG and still have a pretty healthy stack. I don't push this ever really. Just -EV if even one person is calling loose. Also, your avatar is pimpin OP.

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11-23-2007 , 01:20 AM

rakemeplz

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 11,990

'All you got is queen high m8, your a (big) dog against EVERY hand that will call you. You might aswell shove with 52o in this spot.'

Stating the obvius, but this is definitely bad advice, shoving with 52o is way way worse than shoving qjs here. And I think you do get called with some middle/high pairs here.

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11-23-2007 , 01:31 AM

BeattysLuck

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 444

Im pushing this from the button but in your current position its bad. youre a dog to whatever is going to be calling you and at best youre looking at a coinflip which is not the situation you want to be at this point in the game.

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11-23-2007 , 01:37 AM

#10

xGREGORx

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,270

I don't like this 5 handed and with these chips stacks...

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11-23-2007 , 02:22 AM

#11

runhot

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 2,891

Quote:

too light, w/ or w/o antes.

fyp

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11-23-2007 , 07:11 AM

#12

marand

adept

Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 923

This is somewhat opponent dependant. Against tight callers this is a push. (If they play tight or good.) Against loose donkeys its a fold.

I assume it might be a fold in a $15 sng.

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11-23-2007 , 08:34 AM

#13

IFoldPktOnes

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 2,374

I would push this with antes.

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11-23-2007 , 08:47 AM

#14

jetlag99

enthusiast

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 79

Don't like it. Probably push A7+ 66+

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11-23-2007 , 08:51 AM

#15

RexWoo

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 6,587

The risk / reward does not look good here.

My range here UTG with 10+ BB would be like AJs, AQ, 88+, maybe 77.

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11-23-2007 , 10:46 AM

#16

marand

adept

Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 923

Quote:

Don't like it. Probably push A7+ 66+

That is a horrible range sir.
QJs is a much better hand to push in this situation than A7o. A7o is a super super easy fold here.

For reference nash equlibrium in this situation is:
17.0%, 22 AT KJ A4s K9s Q9s J9s T9s

But expect your opponents to call looser than they should so a tighter pushing range is correct.

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