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Coming clean and setting the record straight Coming clean and setting the record straight

08-30-2010 , 01:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sketchy1
not really sure why people keep bringing up justin. he has literally nothing in common with sorel and the similarities end at "they got caught cheating"

justin distanced himself as far as he could from the situation and i genuinely believe justin didn't play online during his time he was banned and did not continue his further shadiness. he went into the live arena, despite having a huge target on his back as a known "cheat." he kept up with the live game for a long time, earned back his reputation and i believe he's also been known to aid stars/FTP when they were trying to target MA'ers and whatnot (i could be wrong about that part, but i coulda swore he said that in a post back in the day).

either way, he definitely gained everyone's respect back by not only NOT cheating anymore, but trying to be very outspoken on the issue and constantly trying to clear his own name in the process. also, if you ever confronted justin about his past or what he did, he was pretty open and honest about it. i also never ONCE saw him come on here and do a JJ/sorel style "coming clean" post, because i genuinely believe after he was caught, he QUIT doing what he was doing and had no need to "come clean." after a few years of no one saying "hmm i heard justin was going to MA the FTOPS this time around" or something, a lot of ppl (including myself) forgot all about his past and have moved on.

and believe me, when justin was caught, there was a HUGE backlash against him. i don't know a single HSMTT player who was sympathetic at the time. everyone who was caught back then was being made an example of, and justin definitely was one of those examples.

however, as you can see sorel, justin hasn't gone on a cheating spree and has seemingly won back most everyone who smeared his name at this point. and it's all because he kept his nose clean, was very honest and respectable when you asked about his past, and never denied what he did was wrong. i had literally no respect for justin when his allegations first came up, but now i would trust the kid with large sums of $ and never think twice about it.

and fwiw i am not really close friends w/ justin, we've played maybe 7-8 times live and that's basically the only place we chat is when i run into him in a casino. and also, fwiw, after sorel's first situation that came up, i had just met the guy at bellagio. i thought he was a really nice kid and very likeable. i talked on AIM once or twice i think with him and always respected the hell out of him and his game, and at the time i looked up to him a lot. when he first got outted for the buying of chris's acct, i actually gave him the benefit of the doubt because when he talked about it on AIM/p5's, he seemed genuinely remorseful and that he really wanted to win everyone back like justin did.

where he failed was instead of just abiding by the FTP ban and being a good kid, sorel instead ignored the ban, continued to cheat HSMTT'ers out of $, and continued to **** on his own reputation as a result. well, at this point, i don't think sorel is going to win anyone back.

agreed
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:47 PM
You just earned a lot of respect for this post Sorel. Its like baseball players who use steroids.. Not one has come out and said, "I used steroids. They helped me hit 60 homeruns in a season. I could probably hit 35-40 off of steroids but they definitely gave me an edge."

I wish for once someone would come clean in this way rather then the usual i unknowingly used them or they were for other purposes. I would be much more inclined to forgive that player.

In this case your post seems really genuine and I think you deserve the respect of the poker community for posting. Yes you did some relatively shady things but setting the record straight in the way you did should earn some forgiveness
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shaundeeb
trust me you haven't been punished enough the 200k taken from you. You've steal way more in skalansky dollars since then. You just finally come clean yah you're shady always have been we've always known it. I hope the community is even harsher on you because maybe in 3 years you will come clean about even more cheating. I know you did a lot wrong in the JJ days based on what stealth has said over the years. You still have a lot of skeletons that will always surpass your ego and skill you have in poker.

Now go about bashing my poker abilities since that's all you have on me, you don't deserve your sponsorship or any fame you should be just blacklisted from all sites as clearly when you disagree with a sites decision you will just do whatever makes you the most $. I wouldn't be shocked if you played on stars during your 3 months of being banned I know you too degen to skip it.
jealous hater much?? Deeb give the kid a break, noone has to bash your poker abilities, you do that enough yourself.

You just hate and hate the bad boyz of poker cause they own so much, id be willing to bet my entire roll when JJ Prodigy hit the live circuit when he comes of age he''ll own just like sorel is and you'll hate and say how much of a scumbag cheater he is..
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4ToedStatue
Your post seems really genuine and I think you deserve the respect of the poker community for posting.
you must not know this guy.

he isn't genuine and he probably thinks in his mind he's 100% justified

he deserves NO ONE'S respect and is only on here posting this **** to save what little face he can and probably trying to save his sponsorship deal.

his original post in the billion-page-long scandal post before this one, where he basically says to everyone "suck my dick i don't care what you think" was CLEARLY the only genuine thing he's posted here in years.

if you really think sorel is a good person who has moralistic fibers somewhere in his body, then you DEFINITELY have no idea who he is or how long he's been cheating people out of $. this guy deserves no one's time of day.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:52 PM
how are we so sure justin didnt ignore the ban?
when poker is your livelihood, your way of making money, i have to say it would make sense to find a way to still play.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheJiggaMan
jealous hater much?? Deeb give the kid a break, noone has to bash your poker abilities, you do that enough yourself.

You just hate and hate the bad boyz of poker cause they own so much, id be willing to bet my entire roll when JJ Prodigy hit the live circuit when he comes of age he''ll own just like sorel is and you'll hate and say how much of a scumbag cheater he is..
can mods ban these ppl? 127 posts? i really bet all of those previous 126 were just as ridiculous as this one.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:53 PM
midstakes ftw
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheJiggaMan
jealous hater much?? Deeb give the kid a break, noone has to bash your poker abilities, you do that enough yourself.

You just hate and hate the bad boyz of poker cause they CHEAT AND STEAL so much, id be willing to bet my entire roll when JJ Prodigy hit the live circuit when he comes of age he''ll own just like sorel is and you'll hate and say how much of a scumbag cheater he is..
fyp
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AK87
Nice post Sorel. Fwiw, back when 2 v good, respected players tried to buy my acct deep in Sunday million, from what I can remember, NO ONE told me that this was an unethical practice. I strongly considered doing it and only didn't because I was a degen and wanted to bink. I had 0 clue that I could potentially have been in Sorel's shoes... In fact, there was a lot of ppl who advised me to take the deal and all of these people are highly respected and doubt anyone would believe these specific ppl told me to.

I wrote the same post on P5s:
I don't mind talking since i'm a nobody. I finished 7th of the moneymaker Freeroll and was rewarded a PCA package worth 14K (under the name nicoSF, pokerstars has since allowed me to change my pseudo after I left SF lol).
Anyway I was there in the lobby sitting with all these guys. There was Mizzi, Annette, Bel0wab0ve, PBdrunks...
I was sitting next to Zpaceman who was winning the 100+R that day. AK87 was deep in the sunday million when Bax came by and is the one who offered to purchase the account. AK87 laughed it off and continued playing. That was the end of the story since no deal occured, but the discussion definitely took place.
So I understand Mizzi's frustration because they made all these rules because of what he's done, yet it looks like the "behind the scene" buying of accounts was very common.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurnUpTheSun
how are we so sure justin didnt ignore the ban?
when poker is your livelihood, your way of making money, i have to say it would make sense to find a way to still play.
no one "knows" other than justin, but if you read their posts over the years and the scandals sorel has been involved in (not to mention i'm pretty sure he's associated with JJ somehow), who are you willing to believe? i have no reason to NOT believe justin, and every reason in the world to assume sorel is trying to save as much face as possible and is not being honest at all.

time will tell, but there's no reason at this point to do anything but believe justin as there's 0% proof that he's done anything shady over the past few years, but i can point you to a few threads that might implicate sorel.

and i mean, sorel has admitted to still playing on FTP, and justin was spending years playing live poker. who do you really think followed the ban more closely?
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:55 PM
Is it okay that Jayson Williams shot and killed his driver and lied and covered it up becuase hes good at b-ball and is a cool guy to hang with?

is it okay that OJ (alledgedly) killed 2 people and then jacked some others at gunpoint because he was a heck of a RB and hey those hertz commercials were cool?

is it okay that the enron guys screwed all their employees retirements for their own benefit because who knew it was wrong back then?

I mean Im all for forgiveness and people getting a chance to turn their life around but all you guys defending his actions for any reason whatsover....wtf?
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:57 PM
First, one minor thing that Sorel knows I disagree with: I believe that giving someone advice on the phone/AIM/whatever is much different than being handed that person's tournament and being able to play it with full access to the controls. I think being in command of the rhythm of the tournament is a huge difference.

Second, I do like Sorel, but I don't like what he's done for online poker. Yes, I can keep those contradictory sentiments in my head at the same time. I have argued with him in person several times about his ambitions in ethically gray areas, and I just can't figure out why he can't play it on the straight and narrow and just lean back on his natural talents instead of needlessly edge-mongering and dredging up controversy in his wake. I guess he's just wired differently than most of us are (but probably more similar to, say, Doyle Brunson 30 years ago), and maybe that heedless ambition is connected to what makes him a poker genius and me not so much.

Third, I completely disagree with Daut's sentiment in post #36. ANYTHING that turns people off from online poker is a bad thing, especially people who "suck and don't want to put in the time to become good." Also the nebulous nature of online security and seeming inability to ensure game integrity should be a turn-off to everyone.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiribato
I wrote the same post on P5s:
I don't mind talking since i'm a nobody. I finished 7th of the moneymaker Freeroll and was rewarded a PCA package worth 14K (under the name nicoSF, pokerstars has since allowed me to change my pseudo after I left SF lol).
Anyway I was there in the lobby sitting with all these guys. There was Mizzi, Annette, Bel0wab0ve, PBdrunks...
I was sitting next to Zpaceman who was winning the 100+R that day. AK87 was deep in the sunday million when Bax came by and is the one who offered to purchase the account. AK87 laughed it off and continued playing. That was the end of the story since no deal occured, but the discussion definitely took place.
So I understand Mizzi's frustration because they made all these rules because of what he's done, yet it looks like the "behind the scene" buying of accounts was very common.
A+ first post i have no reason to not believe you because that 1 post is full of so much stuff that is IRREFUTABLE EVIDENCE that i'm going to blindly believe the dude w/ 1 post!!!!!!!!!
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahSD
Look at ZJ for an example for someone who did something wrong that lots of other people were doing, handled it like a big boy, and came out well in the end. You didn't get screwed over because you one mistake. You were punished for a small mistake that you made and then you acted like a huge douche for years and were punished more.
Yes, look at me, for example.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sketchy1
A+ first post i have no reason to not believe you because that 1 post is full of so much stuff that is IRREFUTABLE EVIDENCE that i'm going to blindly believe the dude w/ 1 post!!!!!!!!!
he has >1k posts on the site he posted it on and doubt he's just going to magically come up with all those names and details of what was going on for no reason at all. not saying it's all true or not cause we'll prolly never know but gtfo with your post count bs just because he doesn't spend all day on 2p2.. it's a guy stating his case/insight on the situation, give him a break.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sketchy1
no one "knows" other than justin, but if you read their posts over the years and the scandals sorel has been involved in (not to mention i'm pretty sure he's associated with JJ somehow), who are you willing to believe? i have no reason to NOT believe justin, and every reason in the world to assume sorel is trying to save as much face as possible and is not being honest at all.

time will tell, but there's no reason at this point to do anything but believe justin as there's 0% proof that he's done anything shady over the past few years, but i can point you to a few threads that might implicate sorel.

and i mean, sorel has admitted to still playing on FTP, and justin was spending years playing live poker. who do you really think followed the ban more closely?
makes sense. however, i think youre allowing personal relationships get in the way of the truth. before this chat log came out and sorel's post, there really wasnt concrete evidence of sorel playing on ftp. it could have been assumed, but no real evidence.

the same could be for justin. just because he had been a solid human being after he was banned, does not mean he wasnt jumping around accounts, trying to make a living. we just dont know, the same way we didnt know about sorel. i mean, really, would it shock you if justin did?

jj as well. there are surely people who post on 2p2 who know what accounts he plays under. should those people come forward and out him?
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jsmitty2009
Mike Haven- I can't seem to send emails, so here is my response:

What is a verifiable source to you? It was copy and pasted to me by email and I know it to be true because I was asked to be involved.

I think the best proof is who I am, but if that gets out I will probably get a hit put on my life (not to mention the person who sent it to me will be killed too). I personally know about half of these people very well and have no idea who the other half mentioned are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Imper1um
I encourage whoever posted this conversation to come out and say who you are. You say you're worried that I will retaliate with violence if I find out who you are. I'm not in the mafia, nor do I have any ties to the underworld. Stop being a coward and reveal yourself.
To be fair, it seems absurd for the accuser to hide behind the suggestion that Sorel is some sort of Don Corleone character. Sorel's first post was irrational and counter-productive, but this time he makes a lot more sense imo.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurnUpTheSun
makes sense. however, i think youre allowing personal relationships get in the way of the truth. before this chat log came out and sorel's post, there really wasnt concrete evidence of sorel playing on ftp. it could have been assumed, but no real evidence.

the same could be for justin. just because he had been a solid human being after he was banned, does not mean he wasnt jumping around accounts, trying to make a living. we just dont know, the same way we didnt know about sorel. i mean, really, would it shock you if justin did?

jj as well. there are surely people who post on 2p2 who know what accounts he plays under. should those people come forward and out him?
Just stop.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiribato
I wrote the same post on P5s:
I don't mind talking since i'm a nobody. I finished 7th of the moneymaker Freeroll and was rewarded a PCA package worth 14K (under the name nicoSF, pokerstars has since allowed me to change my pseudo after I left SF lol).
Anyway I was there in the lobby sitting with all these guys. There was Mizzi, Annette, Bel0wab0ve, PBdrunks...
I was sitting next to Zpaceman who was winning the 100+R that day. AK87 was deep in the sunday million when Bax came by and is the one who offered to purchase the account. AK87 laughed it off and continued playing. That was the end of the story since no deal occured, but the discussion definitely took place.
So I understand Mizzi's frustration because they made all these rules because of what he's done, yet it looks like the "behind the scene" buying of accounts was very common.
No doubt you were probably there but it wasn't bax who offered to buy the acct. No names gonna be posted though.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sketchy1
can mods ban these ppl? 127 posts? i really bet all of those previous 126 were just as ridiculous as this one.
Please stop calling for people to be banned without cause. We really don't want the 2p2 moderators to turn into Nazis like the P5s moderator(s).
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdomeski
Just stop.
not defending sorel, but curious why people turn a blind eye to others who have been in the exact same situation.
why is it so outlandish to think justin did the same thing but was just better at it and less douchey?
and people are going nuts about sorel having multiple ftp accounts, but theres obviously people who know of others who have done this/are doing this, but wont speak up about it.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas Chuck
is it okay that OJ (alledgedly) killed 2 people and then jacked some others at gunpoint because he was a heck of a RB and hey those hertz commercials were cool?
personally I forgave him because of his performance as Nordberg in Naked Gun. But I see your point.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurnUpTheSun
not defending sorel, but curious why people turn a blind eye to others who have been in the exact same situation.
why is it so outlandish to think justin did the same thing but was just better at it and less douchey?
and people are going nuts about sorel having multiple ftp accounts, but theres obviously people who know of others who have done this/are doing this, but wont speak up about it.
For the same reason when the US expanded westward it was Manifest Destiny and when the Russians moved west it was the end of the world.

I think its a fair question to ask why guys are protecting known cheats.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:29 PM
a) that has nothing to do with zeejustin, don't know why TUTS is trying to figure out whether he played on stars during his ban when no one knows except justin (I'd be willing to bet a lot that he didn't though)

b) yes, it'd be nice if people who knew people cheating would give them up, but does that really need to be said for the 1000th time? people who know about others cheating and aren't telling 2p2 about them are doing so for immoral selfish reasons but some random telling them its immoral and selfish isn't going to change that
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote
08-30-2010 , 02:31 PM
Ya he had a gun though. Armed robbery and rap sheets add up to doing time. Doesn't matter how much money you take. Pretty sure he is getting out next July which would be 7(I think) after all is said and done but he got sentenced to ten.
Coming clean and setting the record straight Quote

      
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