[converted_hand][/converted_hand

Just want to know if we can gain any more value? Should i bet more on the turn?

I would start by raising more pre.

OR only has 16/17 bb. this is the main reason i only min re-raised, but also because the BB is a very loose player who i wanted to keep in. I feel if i make my 3 bet bigger OR is only going to go all in with the best of it 99+/AK~, anything else he is forced to fold because he has no FE if i make my raise bigger. If i min re-raise:-

1. hes forced to call and see a flop beacuse of pott odds. Or
2. he might even think he even has FE as my re-raise is so small and shove over the top with significantly worse hands.

I hope that makes sense.

Raise to 1,200 pre. Min raise is super bad unless you are sure he will go over the top (which I don't think you do)
As played c-betting would have been ok, but so was the check behind
Likewise for the turn (as played)
Always checking behind the river.

raise more pre , just like the others have stated above.


as played checking back is good otf , the intial raiser could had opened with a9 , a10 , aj , so we don't beat much here i'd discount aq and ak since we can be pretty sure they would 4bet shove over your 3bet.

i'd prolly check back ott again since either player can be checking here with an ace, and if your going to bet you should make it at least half pot which is 1500 or so.


otr , i'd check back , bb has called your bet OOP in a 3way pot ott , so it's likely he has something here like a5s, a6s, a10 or maybe a draw but still i'd check back otr.

Raise more PF.

Why bet the turn? Check down to the river everytime a big stack lets you in this situation. Monster stack is playing large range of Ax hands.

The only time in this hand you could be going for more value is pre-flop. Raise more like the others said. If BB is a LAG and wants to play, he'll play. You have no indication of his strength yet, so don't make plays like this that make it too cheap for the OR to call your tiny bet w/ any hand he opened. You also made it too cheap for the 3 others players who are yet to act to see a flop. I don't know what your 3bet stat is, but if you've been tight, everyone left can assume you've got a monster, and they can call with any pp or suited connector for cheap, hope to flop big, and bust you. You're just asking for more players to see the flop with this tiny 3bet, and the more players that see the flop the less likely your KK will win in the end.

If you wanted to play tricky pre, just call and set up a good squeeze opportunity for the 24bb BTN, the 10bb SB, or the big stack loose BB to come over the top.

As played pre, on the A high flop, you should be looking to do one of two things:
1) Get to sd cheap, not trying to extract more value
-OR-
2) Cbet and take the pot on the flop. Your 3bet pre is a sign of strength, and cbetting into two opp's is another sign on an A high flop. If you get rr, then you know you're beat and can fold.

Regarding the delayed t cbet, this is < 1/3 pot. If your normal cbet is 1/2pot to 2/3pot, maybe you're showing a bit of weakness here and you're inviting a c/shove.

Raise bigger pre

I don't mind between a c-bet or checking back OTF. The only time when you are getting value is PF.

Not sure if serious?

So your saying my min re-raise invites the (24bb button) and (10bb SB) to cold call and bust me with suited connectors or PP's.. you need to learn your pot odds. neither player has nowhere near the odds to bust me with such hands. the only player left to act who has the odds to call with such hands is the BB who i was trying to keep in anyway.

And you also say to either c-bet the flop or check down to river. yet again i totally disagree. OR has alot of aces in his range as could the BB. if either has an ace il most likely find out on the turn and if neither bets the turn then i think there is definitely value in betting to charge draws etc and it also allows me to take control and see a cheap river. yes i should have maybe bet more on the turn. But please have some solid reasoning behind your argument. your just wasting my time and everyone elses

callum it really is opponent dependent, if u fell that you can get 3 streets of value with your kings on a ace high board then sure u can bet.

readless, i think checking back otr is fine in a 3way pot , for showdown value.

alot of bad players like to call with ace rag type of hands , and there's always a sligth possiblity that they are checking otf to see a cheap showdown or even to induce a bet from you.

nh anyway.

bigger pre, ~1212, bigger OTT, ~1313 (then u can jam the rest OTR)
as played, check or jam OTR prob ok, not sure
sry he had 99
:\

ok so i definitely should have raised more pre by the majority of opinions. seems like mixed views as to how to play street by street though.

I must say im certainly not a fan of c-betting the flop as a couple of posters have said. I really think we'l find out on the turn if either one has an ace.
checking back the turn is also an option, but this shows alot of weakness from my end and allows either opponent to bluff the river if they wish which makes my decision really difficult.
this was my reason to bet the turn, (albeit i should have bet more) because two flush draws are out there and it also means the river will often be checked back to me allowing me a cheap showdown.

No, what I'm saying is your min 3bet invites the 24bb BTN, the 71bb BB and the 17bb OR UTG+1 all to call. Your raise is only to 3bb+. Are you saying that if you were in any of their shoes, that you wouldn't call w/ JTs or 66? I understand that they aren't getting good pot odds or implied odds, but since when does that stop low stakes players from calling a tiny 3bb+ 3bet?

Yes, I stick to my original idea of either cbetting the flop or ck/calling it down. Cbetting to rep the A will tell you sooner if you're good or not. Use your position and initiative to take it down now before the board gets even more dangerous. Just like you wanted to charge draws on the turn, you can charge them on the flop as well, be in control on the turn and ck behind to see the free river. The two plays (cbet f or delayed cbet t) seem to have the same effect in the long run, of being in control on the river in a pot-controlled pot. Plus, if you turn a K, the pot is now bigger allowing you to bet more to extract even more value from opp's. I think all of this reasoning (although not fully voiced in my original post) are all valid, and I'm not wasting anybody's time.

Thank you

No i 100% would not be calling with j10s if i was the button... that is mathematically incorrect for our stack size and will lose us a lot of money in the long run. Not calling with a PP either, its too close as to whether we have the correct odds, and we still have to factor in that the OR can shove over the top especially as he is raising from early position.

Yeah there are certainly more ways than 1 to play the flop and turn. i think the river is an obvious check down no matter what, unless a K hits of course. I apologise for being rude but i assure you, you should not be calling with suited connectors if you are the button Maybe one of the more regular posters can validate this for me.

I understand that you wouldn't make the call, but would your opponents? I say the answer is often a yes, and I myself would often do it (as switching up my play, keeping my range wide, and being able to end up with different hands in 3bet pots is good for my image, so opponents won't always know I'm super strong in these spots). Looking at the math, the BTN is getting 29.6% pot odds:
270 antes
562 open
874 3bet
125 SB
250 BB
2,081 total >> calling 874 gives 2.38:1 or 29.6%
If you factor in that the BB is a very loose player, you can count on his call, and probably the OR call, giving the BTN implied odds on his call of 3.45:1 or 22.5%.
JTs, multi-way, is a great hand to see a flop with IP.
Looking at some equity calcs:
JTs vs 3 randoms (but we know they aren't just random) = 33.5% equity
JTs vs 20% range, 30% and 50% = 25% equity
JTs vs 10%, 20% and 30% = 23.5% equity

Doesn't seem like that bad of a call to me, especially if you're reasonably sure the BB and the UTG+1 won't rr, and many of your opponents would agree. When looking at hands like this, I try to keep in mind the level of my opponents. I saw another post you made regarding the KK8 flop and the opponent donked almost 2x pot. Would that guy call here with JTs or a pp?
Sure, it's not mathematically the best call, but it's also not the worst call in the world.