Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
All in or wait for a better spot All in or wait for a better spot

07-17-2009 , 08:00 AM
What's the best way to play this. I have about 20x the BB in chips but still below the average chip count of 50,000. Regular tourney with blinds going up every 15 minutes. 870 players and I'm just in the money in 51st place. No read on UTG but BB is tight aggressive. Should I have gone all in rather than cold call to try and isolate? Secondly, since I did cold call should I call the BB or fold and wait for a better opportunity. I'm thinking I'm behind most of the time with his range so fold would be smart. On the other hand I want to get to the final table so this may be an opportunity to more than double up.
Poker Stars $150+$12 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t800/t1600 Blinds + t150 - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG+1: t41890 M = 11.64
MP1: t55835 M = 15.51
Hero (MP2): t32562 M = 9.04
CO: t86158 M = 23.93
BTN: t42161 M = 11.71
SB: t27943 M = 7.76
BB: t47808 M = 13.28
UTG: t12736 M = 3.54

Pre Flop: (t3600) Hero is MP2 with Q A
UTG raises to t12586 all in, 2 folds, Hero calls t12586, 3 folds, BB raises to t47658 all in
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 08:06 AM
just calling the first shove is pretty bad, shoving over it or folding are the only good options...shoving here is better than folding because AQo has a ton of equity against UTG's short shoving range

as played yes you have to call, > 1/3 of your stack is already in the pot
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 08:08 AM
iso shove the first time round. flatting sucks.

as played you have just put 33% of your stack in the pot plz don't fold
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 08:12 AM
meh, calling isn't really all that bad, it's not like iso shoving gets the BB to fold AK or something. Maybe it gets him to fold 77 or something, but that's hardly an equity killer. Yeah it's a mistake, just not a huge one.

Anyway, yeah, stick your chips in.
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 08:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PageUp
meh, calling isn't really all that bad, it's not like iso shoving gets the BB to fold AK or something. Maybe it gets him to fold 77 or something, but that's hardly an equity killer. Yeah it's a mistake, just not a huge one.

Anyway, yeah, stick your chips in.
As many "what do I do with AK" threads as we see, I wouldn't be surprised if we make some villains fold AK.
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 08:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deucegame
As many "what do I do with AK" threads as we see, I wouldn't be surprised if we make some villains fold AK.
well its obvious that we have AA then if we go over the top again and AK has 7% vs AA, that would be a very good fold with AK.
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 09:22 AM
reshipping >>> letting your mom dress you >>> just calling the initial all in. As played ship it
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 09:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deucegame
as played yes you have to call, > 1/3 of your stack is already in the pot
Lol, classical. As soon as you bet, it is not your money anymore, it belongs to the pot. Basing a decission to go all on the fact that you already put money in the pot, and therefore have some deluded ''right'' to get it back is stupid.
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 09:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gathart
Lol, classical. As soon as you bet, it is not your money anymore, it belongs to the pot. Basing a decission to go all on the fact that you already put money in the pot, and therefore have some deluded ''right'' to get it back is stupid.
1/3 of his stack is already in the pot and he will only have ~4 bb left. Why wouldn't he ship at this point with AQo??? NOT shipping at this point is crazy. We're basing our decision on that and the fact that AQ is by no means a bad starting hand... Not the fact that we have commited chips to the pot. I would ship it with that many chips and those cards regardless of whether i had put chips in the pot already or not.
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 10:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiscDirection
1/3 of his stack is already in the pot and he will only have ~4 bb left. Why wouldn't he ship at this point with AQo??? NOT shipping at this point is crazy. We're basing our decision on that and the fact that AQ is by no means a bad starting hand... Not the fact that we have commited chips to the pot. I would ship it with that many chips and those cards regardless of whether i had put chips in the pot already or not.
Oh, i don't dispute that with 4BB left this is a shove. My arguement was that two previous posters argued that because we allready invested one third of our stack in the pot we should call and that is obviously wrong. investing 4BB with AQo in a 30BB pot is standard not because some of our money is already in the pot.
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 10:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gathart
Lol, classical. As soon as you bet, it is not your money anymore, it belongs to the pot. Basing a decission to go all on the fact that you already put money in the pot, and therefore have some deluded ''right'' to get it back is stupid.
It's not about 'ownership' of the chips, it's about the pot odds. There's ~59K in the pot and it costs hero 20K to call. The only way he can fold is if BB's pushing range is limited to a hand range that offer him less than 34% equity [TT+, AQs+], because he's getting 2.9:1.
All in or wait for a better spot Quote
07-17-2009 , 10:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anotherFliplost
It's not about 'ownership' of the chips, it's about the pot odds. There's ~59K in the pot and it costs hero 20K to call. The only way he can fold is if BB's pushing range is limited to a hand range that offer him less than 34% equity [TT+, AQs+], because he's getting 2.9:1.
this

and so much more politely than i was going to say it
All in or wait for a better spot Quote

      
m