V early hotter 4.40. UTG (660/33 15h) has been calling pf 3bets w 63o, 3betting pf then calling 2-way 4bet all-in with KQs 75bb eff stacks. UTG+1 (40/0 10h) has been similar, limp calling in MP w Q2s only hand to reach showdown.

PokerStars - $4+$0.40|25/50 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

MP+1: 2,845 (VPIP: 13.64, PFR: 4.76, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 22)
Hero (CO): 5,700
BTN: 1,575 (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 2)
SB: 3,375 (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 18.75, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 16)
BB: 2,830 (VPIP: 6.25, PFR: 6.25, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 16)
UTG: 6,720 (VPIP: 60.00, PFR: 33.33, 3Bet Preflop: 28.57, Hands: 15)
UTG+1: 3,085 (VPIP: 40.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 10)
UTG+2: 9,840 (VPIP: 70.00, PFR: 20.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 10)
MP: 2,900 (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 50.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 2)

SB posts SB 25, BB posts BB 50

Pre Flop: (pot: 75) Hero has A K

UTG raises to 100, UTG+1 calls 100, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 375, fold, fold, fold, UTG raises to 650, UTG+1 calls 550, Hero ?

What is the optimal play here to get the most chips out of these 2 goldmines?

5 bet

How much?

Well you could make it like 1800-2000 perhaps but they're not folding - im not folding - nobody's folding - so I might just ship it here. The problem is im not sure if I feel like flipping yet this early this deep in such a soft tournament ... I might actually fold here. If it were a little shallower and a little later for sure gii.

I would hate to get flatted but in case I do, the rest goes in on the flop. so we are committing to play for stacks, I would leave myself with a psb that goes in on almost all flops.

I might call and see a flop.

5bet shove.

You think we are crushing two players?

Nope we are definitely not crushing 2 players. We are most probably ahead though. Folding will not get us any chips from the "goldmines".

We are very deep so I think calling is good too since we will be in position. It will be interesting/tough to play AKo against 2 players when we whiff even in position though.

Yeah we cant fold for sure, im thinking either call or shove.

I shoved they folded. Think maybe a 5 bet to 1300 then shove most dry flops would have been good.


I also think a call would not have been a bad play, lower variance and keeps their dominated kings and aces in to get value out of IF we hit

I might be wrong, but calling will have them keep playing the hands you beat, while shoving will most likely have them call only the hands we are flipping against or hands that beat up.

We are still deep enough that player aren't pot committed with hands like TT and AQs, so they might find a fold. We can't really hide our hand anymore after the 3 bet pre. We are pretty much saying we have AQs+, TT+ type hands. So the hands that will call a shove will be AQs+, TT+, which we are flipping against. Shoving wouldn't be for value IMO but more to pick up chips easily and without showdown. It is for value if we have reads and think we can get called by worst, like AJs, KQs type hand.

Like you said, if we hit an Ace or K on the flop against a dominated hand we're both going all in and it's big $ for us, but we might scared them off pre if we shoved.

Shove with info given.

5 bet 1350. Jam all flops.

5bet ~1500. Call any shove and/or shove otf. gl.

I think shove and flat are both better than small raise here. It's quite hard to leak vs. smaller raise while there is value to be made by flatting vs. it in other players position.

Flatting vs. shoving

2 villains fold vs. shove - Prefer shove (flatting does make some here since villains ranges are weak, but it makes less than shove)
One folds vs. shove one calls (Both options would make money here)
Both villains call a shove (EV of shove and fold are about equal, flat is best)

nice thread.

given the reads 5bet shoving here is good , and i think once we make that 3bet we have to be prepared to call a 4bet shove against this opponent.

there will be times where i would just flat AK here , but when it gets to the mid/late stages I 3bet AK 80% of the time at the least.

if they had a hand like 99, 10s, JJ they would flat our 3bet they might even flat with AQs too , if they decided to 4bet shove these hands that would be pretty bad on their behalf and this player is the type that would shove these hands or maybe with weaker Ax , and if thats the case 5bet shoving with AK is profitable at any stage of the tourney.


:edit If i knew V had a tight 4bet shoving range i'd fold AK here.