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77 in /180 77 in /180

06-08-2008 , 06:13 PM
I had been pretty aggressive at this table, I think prior to this hand I may have only limped once, every other time I had come in for a raise and most were shoves because of my stack size. I found his min-bet a little suspicious but I wasn't entirely covinced of AA or KK. I decided to see a flop from in position, and fold on an AKQJ board without a seven. I figured his bet was a c-bet, I thought that if he had an overpair he would have bet around half the pot trying to entice me to come over the top. I figured this was AK, AQ, AJ, KJ,QJ, or Ax a large percentage of the time and decided to re-raise. I figured I was also representing a big hand because of my flat preflop. Was this a bad play?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t250 (9 handed) Poker Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

UTG (t2670)
UTG+1 (t5125)
MP1 (t1569)
MP2 (t8265)
MP3 (t4121)
Hero (t5610)
Button (t2224)
SB (t3765)
BB (t2810)

Preflop: Hero is CO with 7, 7.
3 folds, MP2 raises to t500, 1 fold, Hero calls t500, 3 folds.

Flop: (t1200) 3, T, 4 (2 players)
MP2 bets t1000, Hero raises to t5085?

Thanks!
77 in /180 Quote
06-08-2008 , 08:58 PM
Eh, its a marginal play. Not horrible or great, sometimes it will work...
77 in /180 Quote
06-08-2008 , 09:30 PM
Is check folding here right then?
77 in /180 Quote
06-08-2008 , 10:14 PM
shove preflop.

i see so much bull**** minraise hands show up in these spots. JT and other **** from total droolers.
77 in /180 Quote
06-08-2008 , 10:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by areaman
shove preflop.

i see so much bull**** minraise hands show up in these spots. JT and other **** from total droolers.
Ok I understand what your saying, but how about as I played it?
77 in /180 Quote
06-08-2008 , 11:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coz
I figured I was also representing a big hand because of my flat preflop. Was this a bad play?
I don't have a big opinion on this hand -- although if you think his range is that wide, I think it's fine to go all in on a flop like this -- but I will say that I think it's a mistake to think that a flat call preflop conveys a show of strength to people in the $4/180. If you want to show strength, shove this preflop. If you want to set mine and/or shove a friendly flop, then call and do that.
77 in /180 Quote
06-08-2008 , 11:47 PM
You seem to jump into a lot of assumptions with your hand analysis. Figuring his min-raise isn't AA/KK, figuring his bet is just a cbet with overs, I always run into trouble making assumptions based on betting especially in a low buy in tournament. I hate to assume a min-raise is AA pre as well though, and I think calling pre is okay, if you have evidence he is raising a large range pre, shoving pre isn't bad either.

I think your line is okay, I would just like to have some more info on the player before coming to assumptions. If he seems like a player that would shut down on the turn after cbetting, you could always call the flop and evaluate the turn.
77 in /180 Quote
06-09-2008 , 12:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmoneymills
You seem to jump into a lot of assumptions with your hand analysis. Figuring his min-raise isn't AA/KK, figuring his bet is just a cbet with overs, I always run into trouble making assumptions based on betting especially in a low buy in tournament. I hate to assume a min-raise is AA pre as well though, and I think calling pre is okay, if you have evidence he is raising a large range pre, shoving pre isn't bad either.

I think your line is okay, I would just like to have some more info on the player before coming to assumptions. If he seems like a player that would shut down on the turn after cbetting, you could always call the flop and evaluate the turn.
But thats just the thing, in these low buy in tourney's I never know what the **** people are calling or raising with. I don't think that calling the flop bet is a question because I will be pot comitting myself with lots of scary cards possibly coming on the turn.

Does know one else think that this is a pretty safe flop for my hand. I mean don't you think he has two overs he quite a bit here?
77 in /180 Quote
06-09-2008 , 12:11 AM
If you call this flop bet you aren't committing yourself by any means, but you do show your opponent that you have a hand. Calling isn't the best, but if you don't have ANY information on your opponent, I don't think you should judge his hand based on this flop bet.

I do think it's a pretty safe flop for your hand, but I think you're putting too much value on making a judgement off of his bet size on the flop. I would feel much safer in a $20+ making a judgement that someone cbetting a pot sized amount on a dry flop has a good chance of having overs than in a $4. People have no reasoning for anything most of the time.
77 in /180 Quote
06-09-2008 , 12:23 AM
I think pushing preflop may be a better option, because of our great FE and the money in the pot. As played, i agree that this is a marginal spot for me, where the decision will me made almost fully upon any reads i have. do u have pokertracker stats or any further reads on him?
77 in /180 Quote
06-09-2008 , 02:44 AM
I don't like calling here and here's why. If you call the pot is at around 3400 with 4000 remaining and he has you covered. Let's say he pushes anything on the turn. Suddenly that decision of 4000 into 7400. Yikes. Those odds are probably too good to fold anything but an A on the turn.

With your M where it is, 15ish or so I still see some time to maneuver. That said I would ask myself one question. Am I better than these bozos? If the answer is clearly yes I fold. If it's not I'm pushing.

Any M approaching 10 and I'm pushing.
77 in /180 Quote

      
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