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66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO 66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO

12-05-2014 , 06:32 PM
Hey,

Opponent has 10% PFR over 74 hands.

Is this pretty much a standard call? Didn't want to flip for 2/3rds of stack (or could be crushed by bigger pair).






    Poker Stars, $10 Buy-in (6,000/12,000 blinds, 1,500 ante) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 8 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #33133371

    Hero (SB): 201,411 (16.8 bb)
    BB: 141,774 (11.8 bb)
    UTG+2: 320,499 (26.7 bb)
    MP1: 132,325 (11 bb)
    MP2: 677,397 (56.4 bb)
    MP3: 283,707 (23.6 bb)
    CO: 136,624 (11.4 bb)
    BTN: 449,434 (37.5 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is SB with 6 6
    4 folds, CO raises to 135,124 and is all-in, 3 folds

    Spoiler:
    Results: 42,000 pot
    CO mucked and won 42,000 (28,500 net)



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    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-05-2014 , 07:04 PM
    Non turbo? Seems fine, I would snap 88 and prob sigh call 77
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-05-2014 , 07:20 PM
    how much is up top?
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-05-2014 , 09:56 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by HUHandEH
    how much is up top?
    I think about 11K for 1st...

    petesgotaces
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-06-2014 , 03:48 PM
    I recently wrote an article on another forum (that I’m not sure if I’m allowed to link here) called ‘The Top Down Method’ with advice on what to do in this situation. The general idea is focusing on the hands you just ‘know’ are calls and work down. So we know that AA is a call here, we know that KK is a call etc. We’re confident that AK and AQ are calls here because we dominate a lot of weaker Ax hands in our opponents’ shoving ranges. What we then do is stop at the point where we’re not sure anymore. This is where our knowledge and experience shows us that we’re not confident that this is a correct call. So you might settle on QQ+,AK or TT+,AQ+ or 66+,AT+ (just examples by the way) depending on your knowledge of the players involved and your knowledge and experience of similar situations in the past.

    The point is that in game you have to trust your own knowledge and experience to make a confident move. In an ideal world we want to get to a point where every move we make is a confident one and we avoid any spots where we’re not really sure. There are a ton of moves in poker that we know will make money/chips. Avoiding spots where we’re not sure is almost as valuable. Sometimes you will avoid a spot, mark it for review and then realize you made a massive mistake. But, guess what?! Suddenly your knowledge has improved and will help in similar situations in the future. Your experience here has given you the opportunity to learn that you have to make a different move next time.

    I also think it's really important to consider that by calling here you only have one way to win, which is by having the best hand at showdown. Calling is the number one cause of variance so it makes sense to have a far bigger edge than the break-even value. His shoving range is a great example of imperfect information (which poker has a lot of) where you cannot know for sure what his shoving range is - you can make an educated guess, of course! So with all that said, it's important to consider perfect information like the stage of the game, how your stack compares to others in the tournament and how easy you've found picking up chips so far. I hope all that makes sense, PM if you would like to talk through some of these things in more detail.
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-06-2014 , 08:19 PM
    Agree with bumpnrun, might even fold in turbo depending on stats to my left
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-07-2014 , 12:13 AM
    i'm happy enough calling with this.
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-07-2014 , 04:09 AM
    fold 88+ if not FT

    Last edited by mktpppr; 12-07-2014 at 04:11 AM. Reason: if not FT
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-07-2014 , 09:54 AM
    pretty borderline spot imo. For me it would come down to btn and MP2 a lot of the time. If they are both being aggressive at the table, opening a lot of pots etc. I'd probably fold and focus on printing chips shoving over their opens with this stack size. Your stack is getting to the point though, where you'll need to take some gambles soon if you don't have good resteal spots consistently and this type of spot would be about the bottom or just below the bottom of my range.

    Last edited by CrunkMonkey; 12-07-2014 at 09:59 AM.
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-07-2014 , 07:41 PM
    Totally depend on how I seen villain if CO as any clue he should be pushing pretty wide here tbh honest am ok with going either way here I think in game I would prolly fold
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-08-2014 , 01:13 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gazellig
    I recently wrote an article on another forum (that I’m not sure if I’m allowed to link here) called ‘The Top Down Method’ with advice on what to do in this situation. The general idea is focusing on the hands you just ‘know’ are calls and work down. So we know that AA is a call here, we know that KK is a call etc. We’re confident that AK and AQ are calls here because we dominate a lot of weaker Ax hands in our opponents’ shoving ranges. What we then do is stop at the point where we’re not sure anymore. This is where our knowledge and experience shows us that we’re not confident that this is a correct call. So you might settle on QQ+,AK or TT+,AQ+ or 66+,AT+ (just examples by the way) depending on your knowledge of the players involved and your knowledge and experience of similar situations in the past.

    The point is that in game you have to trust your own knowledge and experience to make a confident move. In an ideal world we want to get to a point where every move we make is a confident one and we avoid any spots where we’re not really sure. There are a ton of moves in poker that we know will make money/chips. Avoiding spots where we’re not sure is almost as valuable. Sometimes you will avoid a spot, mark it for review and then realize you made a massive mistake. But, guess what?! Suddenly your knowledge has improved and will help in similar situations in the future. Your experience here has given you the opportunity to learn that you have to make a different move next time.

    I also think it's really important to consider that by calling here you only have one way to win, which is by having the best hand at showdown. Calling is the number one cause of variance so it makes sense to have a far bigger edge than the break-even value. His shoving range is a great example of imperfect information (which poker has a lot of) where you cannot know for sure what his shoving range is - you can make an educated guess, of course! So with all that said, it's important to consider perfect information like the stage of the game, how your stack compares to others in the tournament and how easy you've found picking up chips so far. I hope all that makes sense, PM if you would like to talk through some of these things in more detail.
    Nice post ...

    As per the hand I'd call.
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-08-2014 , 06:34 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nonsimplesimon
    Nice post ...

    As per the hand I'd call.
    Thank you!
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote
    12-09-2014 , 02:00 PM
    snap call
    66 in SB to 11BB shove from CO Quote

          
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