Poker Stars $15+$1 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t200/t400 Blinds + t25 - 4 players
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BB: t7940 M = 11.34
Hero (CO): t1690 M = 2.41
BTN: t3035 M = 4.34
SB: t835 M = 1.19

Pre Flop: (t700) Hero is CO with A K

Limp looks good.

No not at all. You can raise, you can fold (I suggest this), but you cannot limp.

Care to explain?

sick spot, but I can't fold so I shove. I must say I don't get the limp idea here Eric.

Min raise spot. If button shoves and SB folds then we fold too. If SB is in we go all the way too.

The shortstack has already posted a BB, you call here and SB folds a large % of the time, BB shoves a large % of the time, now we're obviously not calling this shove (or we would have just shoved ourselves), so calling is basically throwing away 400 chips. Then you post 2 rounds of blinds for another 600 which would leave us with 1 BB by the time the button gets to us. Since we're presumably trying to force the shortstack all in first before having to go all in ourselves, you should leave yourself as many chips as possible for when the shortstack doubles up and you have to get it in.

Little shorter than i like to be to min raise and i don't think it accomplishes much except losing more chips the times SB folds. SB is gonna make his decision to stack whether we limp or min raise.

Tough spot, but looks like a shove to me.

Blinds get to you next, and you will be left with almost the same chips as SB.

If you shove and they fold, you almost assured the 3rd place. Only problem i see is BB calling you lightly, but since you are likely to be dominating or a flip, i think it must be +ev, cause doubling up here let's you fight for first place, whereas if you fold, you will be either 3rd or 4rd if SB doubles up.

I don't see how limp vs min raise has any effect on SB's folding frequency and also has no effect on the scenario when SB folds and BB gets to pwn us with atc. So we min raise, SB folds, BB shoves and we just burned an extra 400 chips.

I didn't suggest a min raise either. Come to think of it a raise of any kind is also out of the question (I didn't notice positions when I mentioned it originally). This is just a fold.

Of course it accomplishes something it:
i. Wins the pot when everyone folds (you'd be surprised how often this happens)
ii. Most importantly puts SB to a decision for all his chips knowing he will be up against potentially > 1 opponent. Getting the SB to fold here is not a bad result.
iii. Potentially wins a bigger pot when one of the big stacks flats and we shove in our chips on A/K boards.

Downside:
i. SB folds and biggies shove. We can then fold and still potentially fold our way into the money - no difference than if we folded right now.

Oh that's right u suggested fold. Anyway, i think folding here is too weak. When we limp the shortie's not gonna stick in 200 of the 600 he's got behind just to "see a flop", so i don't see what min raising accomplishes here.

I just shove, anything else is too tricky/complicated/tilt inducing. And I doubt that it can be bad.

+1

Fwiw i prefer shoving vastly over folding, and 99+ AQs+ AK looks good.

Two options for me :-

1. Shove. AK at this stage of a tourney is almost certainly top hand at this table and by shoving you are getting some fold equity and a shot at doubling up. No one will expect you to be shoving with such a strong hand and will think you are stealing and so will call with a weaker hand. If you come up against KK or AA then so be it. SB will probably fold hoping you bust out. BB will call probably given their stack size giving you a good chance to double up and secure a payout.

2. There is a tricky play alternative – call and hope that SB goes AI and is called by BB. BB is pretty likely to call with anything given their stack. Then you fold and trust that SB has shoved rashly and you are in the money. If BB doesn’t call then you can call. Again SB is unlikely to have a better hand than you so you should be odds favourite.

The unknown in both scenarios is the BTN. But in their place I would fold to your AI hoping to see you or SB to bust out. If you called then in BTN I would also fold unless I had a strong hand as I would be pretty sure that SB would shove with BB also an unknown I wouldn't want to take the risk.

I'd just shove.

folding and limping is the dumbest **** i ever heard. shove it

You're bad at poker. Sorry.

BB only needs 39% equity to call 1265 into a pot of 1965, which means he can call with just about everything. BB calls 100%, you lose this pot 35% of the time and double up 65% of the time. Prize pool equity gained from doubling up when you're about to post 600 chips in your blinds (one of which you'll lose 99% of the time) is virtually none. Shoving all in just freerolls the shortstack. Folding is the only correct play and it's not even close.

whats wrong with a good old shove eh

your right icm me and everyone else who posted on this thread is bad. sorry but LMFAO at you

Pretty much, yeah.

ok Phil Hellmuth

good range.