$16, bubble j10s line check... - MTT Poker Strategy - Multi Table Tournament Poker Forum

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$16, bubble j10s line check...

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06-25-2008 , 12:09 AM

juandadi

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,030

buble had been pretty tight and noone had done anythin out of the ordinary.
Both blinds were foldin alot to raises previously.
Is this worth it...?

Poker Stars, $15 + $1 NL Hold'em Tournament, 100/200 Blinds, 4 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

Hero (UTG): 2,795
BTN: 2,295
SB: 4,355
BB: 4,055

Pre-Flop: (400) J

dealt to Hero (UTG)
Hero raises to 2,770 and is All-In, 3 folds
there were antes as well, 25.

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06-25-2008 , 04:18 AM

Entropic

grinder

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 407

I just raise to 500 preflop, my thinking is you're only getting called by something that's beating you if you push, and lesser hands will usually get out of the way with just a raise.

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06-25-2008 , 05:07 AM

k4b4l

grinder

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 667

whoah against the 2 chip leader with 13BB, it's a bad move i guess.

raise it to t500 if you want to play the hands

otherwise, fold

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06-25-2008 , 06:23 AM

bucciboy

centurion

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 178

I fold with that many BB...

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06-25-2008 , 07:38 AM

Emperor Norton

adept

Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,056

Eh, if nobody at the table is reckless then this is probably an OK shove. It's really hard to put you on a wide range when you're shoving this deep from UTG, so they'll probably call you tighter than is optimal. However, it's relatively thin, and when you do get called you will hate yourself and want to die.

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06-25-2008 , 02:02 PM

brig_broiler

stranger

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 3

I don't really like a push here at all. You have almost 14 BBs, the SB and BB and the big stacks here and could easily pick you off here. As for raising ~500, I think that's even a worse play. If the BB is loose, he'll call pretty often and then what do you do when the board blanks? C-bet? I don't think so.

I fold here and wait for a better spot to steal some blinds.

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06-25-2008 , 02:12 PM

juandadi

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,030

I think raisin its a much better option, thunkib about it, given how tight they wereplayin. Risk less if they have hand, and not a terrible hand to play postflop with. Now if I knew one of the blinds was a loose gun, this is deft a risky play.

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06-25-2008 , 02:16 PM

Jalman1

adept

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 741

fold>raise to 500> shove>limp(lol)

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06-25-2008 , 02:26 PM

jafeather

old hand

Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,928

I'm with the folding crew here. Just not the right time for this kind of aggression, even if they are folding a lot. You're just too deep.

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06-25-2008 , 02:27 PM

#10

StregaChess

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,771

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Norton

Nash wise this is totally fine, no problem at all with shoving here you could open this all the way to J8s+. However you still need to think about Emperor's comments, I think he's basically spot on with his concerns.

(FYI, all the NITS folding is why you need to take ownership of the bubble and trademark it.)

Last edited by StregaChess; 06-25-2008 at 02:28 PM. Reason: Nit Alert

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06-25-2008 , 07:46 PM

#11

waterwolves

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 11,557

Quote:

Originally Posted by StregaChess

Now that surprises me. J8s+ wow. To me it's still a sick push at this level but with the read he had on the table I guess he has enough fold equity to make it work.

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06-25-2008 , 07:56 PM

#12

NoLimitLeagues

old hand

Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,672

Quote:

Originally Posted by brig_broiler

+1 good 1st post

FOLD IT. or get creative and limp it and rep AA, lol. dont raise with 14bbs and jack high utg with big stacks in blinds, unless the other 3 are the tightest players you have ever played.

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06-25-2008 , 08:07 PM

#13

DaN_05

veteran

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 2,886

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Norton

However, it's relatively thin, and when you do get called you will hate yourself and want to die.

hehe

With antes I'm sure shoving isn't awful, and it'll be 200/400 soon. Buuut I'm still in the nit folding crew. (just)

I hate standard raise here.

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06-25-2008 , 08:10 PM

#14

unrealzeal

banned

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 13,990

JTs is a playable hand in a four handed card game. I normally 2.5x it and go from there. If you shove here, you're just looking to get lucky, as the only hand that you are ahead of that calls is 66 - and I doubt I call with that. No reason to give you a flip if I'm a big stack.

The only reason I see to shove here is to piss em off and set up a shove when you are made.

I also think you can profitably limp here if they don't play back at you often.

Last edited by unrealzeal; 06-25-2008 at 08:16 PM.

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06-25-2008 , 08:17 PM

#15

DaN_05

veteran

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 2,886

Quote:

Originally Posted by unrealzeal

lol.

dude, so much wrong here.

We're not shoving to get lucky and get called by 66. We shove because we want to take the blinds (and assuming these guys don't call too light) - we profit from this.

Also, one of the reasons I wouldn't want to shove here, is to set up them calling me lighter, when I'm shoving a much worse hand than this.

SNG bubbles are a different animal altogether.

Also, you say raise 2.5x PF and then go from there. Well, where do you go from there? So many flops and so many situations that you just DON'T want to see, and can easily result in you losing 1/3 of your stack without good reason.

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06-26-2008 , 10:57 AM

#16

StregaChess

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,771

Quote:

Originally Posted by unrealzeal

JTs is a playable hand in a four handed card game. I normally 2.5x it and go from there.

That's about the worst possible route you can take.

Shove > Fold > Call = Raise 2.5x

With call being just > Raise
IMHO

Anyone who wants to take the
Fold > Shove
It's not like I'm going to lose sleep over it, or fight to the blood over this...
As reads matter...

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